Help - I just bought an R25!
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  1. #1
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    Help - I just bought an R25!

    Hello to all the very knowledgeable people on the board!

    Well, I took the Froggy plunge, although ended up with a Renault when I had originally thought I would be in a Peugeot now.

    I wonder if I might ask for a bit of guidance on my purchase and potential pitfalls of this car. I have no experience at all of Renault (apart from the Clio I drove through Europe in 98 - and that was a star car!).

    Anyway, here is a little background on the 'beast'.

    It is a 1995 GTX 2.2L 5 speed. It started life as an auto but was changed (properly!) some years ago. The ownership history of the car was well known to the mecahnic who I spoke with prior to purchase (he has looked after it for three owners for years).

    The mechanic gave it glowing praise, and with only (wait for it) 125,000 km on the clock (wow!) I thought, 'why the hell not?' I mean, people want the same money for crappy old lasers and telstars. So I bought it yesterday for $3,000.

    Apart from a scrape on the driver's rear quarter, the body is essentially spotless. Same goes for the interior. Still has original funky radio setup, complete with 80's style graphic equaliser.

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    A few small problems, but maybe you can tell me if these are common?

    1. A/C was completely rtebuilt in 1993, but doesn't seem to work now. Everything spins and blows, just no cold air. May be a simple re-gas, I guess...

    2. Acceleration is all over the place. Really jumpy acceleration down at low reves (spluttery sought of feeling) but then starts to kick on at about 3,000 RPM. Maybe just needs a tune up, or is this 'feature' just something I'll have to live with?

    3. No fuel guage. Mechanic says he knows how to fix it, but requires 7-8 hours labour to pull the whole dash out. I don't mind going without, but will the electronic voice still warn me?

    Well, as you can see, I have a lot to learn about my new piece of Euro-trash. I look forward to hearing from those who can help.

    Thanks! Skip.

    <small>[ 01 November 2003, 12:31 AM: Message edited by: Skippy ]</small>

  2. #2
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    Geez, I just prrof-read that post (too late, as it turns out). Believe me, I am a spelling/grammar freak and am sorely disappointed with myself for some of those mistakes. I must be caught up in the excitement of my purchase!

  3. #3
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    Prrof read?? J.C., how much worse can this get? Any chance of respect lost in a flutter of key-stroke errors. Oh, the shame!

  4. #4
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    We had a R25 for years, a fantastic car! The computers will eventualy play up, but hey, who cares, just ignore them. Ours used to tell us the fuel level was low everytime we started it. The little pom under the dash gets VERY excited if the motor ever gets warm or anything. He screams at you to pull over immediatly, switch the engine off immediatly, wait for it to cool etc..

    Due to the design of the twin butterfly in the injection, there is a bad flat spot under light acceleration where they overlap. Just drive through this flatspot, there's nothin you can do about it wink

    Bacily for $3,000, who cares :p :p Just drive & enjoy, I'm sure you'll get a lot of miles out of it yet!

    seeya,
    Shane L.
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    Yay ... No Slugomatics


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  5. #5
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    Oh cr&p. I just realised another mistake. Of course, it is not a 1995 model, it is a 1985 model...I give up.

  6. #6
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    Thanks, Shane. Do you know if there is a modfication/upgrade that can be sourced to resolve that troublesome problem with the butterfly? Surely it annoyed someone enough for them to find a way to fix it?

  7. #7
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Dave's your man, the flat spot is noticable, but not to the extend your saying. Sounds like it may even be dropping a cylinder at low revs.

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    'Cit' homepage:
    Citroen Workshop
    Proper cars--
    '85 Series II CX2500 GTi Turbo I
    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/showthread.php?t=90325
    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


    Modern Junk:
    '07 Poogoe 407 HDi 6spd manual

  8. #8
    Good Sport danielsydney's Avatar
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    Your very lucky. Id love a Renault 25 as a second car if i could find one.

    Good luck with it but watch those electrics

  9. #9
    Banned renaulturbo's Avatar
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    Regarding the R25 engine, was it the pre or post '87 engine that put out 98 kw? Im 75% sure it was the pre '87 leaded engine (?)

  10. #10
    1000+ Posts Europa's Avatar
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    Most of the electrical problems experienced seem to be of the "dry-solder joint" variety.

    ie. 10+ years of wear & tear has deteriorated the solder joints on the PCB's

    It seems rare to see a total computer failure (the exception being the gearbox computer which is exposed to even more wear and tear under the bonnet!)

    If you feel keen enough, get the instrument cluster out (not as hard as it looks really) and get it to someone who is handy with a soldering iron (I'm not talking about those massive plumbing irons either!) - get them to inspect the PCB's for solder joint failures, especially around the connectors.

    Replace all the globes and put the dash back together - you may find many of the gauges and functions coming back to life!
    '05 Pearl Black Mégane 5-Door LXR(Daily Driver), '75 Trak Yellow R16TSA (Parts Car), '74 Midnight Blue R17TS (Rebuilding), '73 457 Blue R17TL (Parts Car), '72 Alpine White R16TL (Retired), '69 Sunburst Brown R16TS (Awaiting Rebuild), '68 "Appliance White" Europa (Stored)

  11. #11
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    renaulturbo:
    Regarding the R25 engine, was it the pre or post '87 engine that put out 98 kw? Im 75% sure it was the pre '87 leaded engine (?)
    You are correct, the pre '87 model was the 98kW leaded petrol motor, actually these cars were all 1985/ early 1986 cars that sold slowly. The 1987 onwards car having about 91kW with 91 octane unleaded and Renix injection.
    1963 Renault R4 Van
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  12. #12
    Fellow Frogger! Reno17's Avatar
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    Skippy

    Was goin home from the coast on Sunday, through Southport and I noticed a Light brown R25 sitting at the lights.

    I was in a Green R17, Think you noticed meh.

    Anyway was it you ?

    Ashley
    1967 1135 R8 Gordini
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  13. #13
    Fellow Frogger! deja vu 25's Avatar
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    You have made a wise choice in purchasing a R25. They are magical cars, that still compete with the newer cars of today - even 17 years down the track!!

    I have had 2 previous R25's and one current one, plus a spare parts car.

    I had an 1985 Bordeaux Red GTX with auto. It has done over 400,000kms now (ON THE ORIGINAL AUTO BOX MIND) and is driven by my sister.

    My favourite R25 was my V6 1986, which burnt to the ground! It was a beast, to say the least. I still miss it very much and am very envious at Matt, as he still has his in one piece!

    After a bit of practice you will be able to remove the dash in about 10 mins! It is a piece of cake, and you don't even have to remove the steering wheel, as the manual suggests.

    You will find that it more than likely is dry solder joints. Take Matt's advice and give all the connectors a good clean and going over, and you wll probably have success.

    As for the aircon. It probably just needs re-gassing. Once they have been emptied once, you will need to top them up every couple of years.

    If you want any info please don't hesitate to email me.
    I also would love to have your car on the R25 register.

    I will have a site up and running in the very near future.

    Regards

    Luke
    Cheers - Luke

    1990 Renault 25 V6 Baccara - Gunmetal Grey
    1974 Renault 17TS (1317) - Silver

  14. #14
    1000+ Posts Europa's Avatar
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    LukeCass:
    My favourite R25 was my V6 1986, which burnt to the ground! It was a beast, to say the least. I still miss it very much and am very envious at Matt, as he still has his in one piece!
    err umm, yeh, well, I guess it's sort of in about 50 pieces at the moment, with the engine in the process of being removed and all

    ...but yeh, it will be back in one piece soon enough
    '05 Pearl Black Mégane 5-Door LXR(Daily Driver), '75 Trak Yellow R16TSA (Parts Car), '74 Midnight Blue R17TS (Rebuilding), '73 457 Blue R17TL (Parts Car), '72 Alpine White R16TL (Retired), '69 Sunburst Brown R16TS (Awaiting Rebuild), '68 "Appliance White" Europa (Stored)

  15. #15
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    Ashley,

    Not me, I'm afraid. I bought a blue one (real nice dark blue). Brown is probably a little bit too retro (even for me!).

    Skip.

  16. #16
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    Regarding the pre-87 motors (as mine is). Can anyone advise the most appropriate fuel? Is it simply lead -replacement fuel, or should I be running on something else, or using additives?

    Also, out of sheer curiosity value, if my 4cyl ever packs it in, does the v6 slot straight in, or are we talking major modifications?

    Hey, I had no idea 98kW was under the bonnet! Wow! If I could just get it to stop bunny-hopping at low revs I might have a chance to test it.

    Perhaps a good tune up is in order this weekend. Plugs, oil, oil filter, air filter, fuel filter(?). Anything else I should throw in while I'm at it (e.g. ditributor cap?).

    Also, is there a reputable service manual around that anyone would like to recommend for this model car?

    Thanks,
    Skip.

  17. #17
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    Luke,

    Thanks for the words of encouragement. Owning this type of car is really a bit of a new world for me. I would love to be on the register, so let me know when you get that site up and running.

    Also, was the price about right? I figured for a 17 year old car to only have 125,000km on the clock it was at worst a fair price, and at best an absolute bargain! I could be wrong, though...

    Skip.

    <small>[ 01 November 2003, 12:33 AM: Message edited by: Skippy ]</small>

  18. #18
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    Fuel for the pre '87 25 motors is anything with a minimum of 96 octane, like LRP or PULP. It is the octane that is required for the 9.5:1 compression, rather than needing the lead.

    The original AUS spec low compression Fuego is fine on standard unleaded just for info purposes.

    Theoretically a PRV V6 should drop straight in, with the approprate mounts of course. But you will need to source a V6 suitable type 369 or UN1 gearbox to take the torque of the V6, also the V6's have stronger driveshafts, bigger fuel tank, etc etc so it is one of those yes, but, type answers.

    For servicing, think about a new timing belt too, especially if the history of the old one is unknown.

    For a manual try the Haynes R25 manual. The Tech Book Shop in Melbourne have them, if unavailable in Qld, or try Haynes themselves.

    <a href="http://www.haynes.co.uk/inc/viewmanual.asp?mt=1228" target="_blank">http://www.haynes.co.uk/inc/viewmanual.asp?mt=1228</a>

    Simon
    1963 Renault R4 Van
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  19. #19
    1000+ Posts Europa's Avatar
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    You can even order it online from the Technical Book Shop in Melbourne - simply visit

    <a href="http://www.techbooks.com.au/" target="_blank">http://www.techbooks.com.au/</a>

    and type in "Renault 25" for your search query.

    Can't be easier.
    '05 Pearl Black Mégane 5-Door LXR(Daily Driver), '75 Trak Yellow R16TSA (Parts Car), '74 Midnight Blue R17TS (Rebuilding), '73 457 Blue R17TL (Parts Car), '72 Alpine White R16TL (Retired), '69 Sunburst Brown R16TS (Awaiting Rebuild), '68 "Appliance White" Europa (Stored)

  20. #20
    Fellow Frogger! deja vu 25's Avatar
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    Hi Skip

    Yes I think you paid a very good price for a car with such low k's.

    You will enjoy the car, and it actually has 89Kw under the bonnet, not 98kw (unless it is modified).

    I will let you know when the R25 Reg is up and running on the Web.

    Luke
    Cheers - Luke

    1990 Renault 25 V6 Baccara - Gunmetal Grey
    1974 Renault 17TS (1317) - Silver

  21. #21
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    Europa,

    I have gotten the dash out, but the only printed circuit board that I can reasonably access is the one on the far right hand side which connects to the fuel-gauge scrolling buttons.

    Any others I should be trying to access?

    Thanks,
    Skip.

  22. #22
    Good Sport danielsydney's Avatar
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    Im glad your pulling the dash out of the 25 i would hate to do it to my 19 dreading the day..

  23. #23
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    Howdy Skippy,

    I don't recommend LRP - most users of this find that it ends up coking up the combustion chambers and plugs to the extent that the car won't run properly.

    Stuey


    2003 PEUGEOT 206 GTi

  24. #24
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    Stuey:
    Howdy Skippy,

    I don't recommend LRP - most users of this find that it ends up coking up the combustion chambers and plugs to the extent that the car won't run properly.

    Stuey
    This is strange, and must be a regionalised problem, because I've never had problems with LRP.
    1963 Renault R4 Van
    1964 Renault R4
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  25. #25
    1000+ Posts Europa's Avatar
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    Skippy:

    I have gotten the dash out, but the only printed circuit board that I can reasonably access is the one on the far right hand side which connects to the fuel-gauge scrolling buttons.

    Any others I should be trying to access?
    Keep going, layer upon layer of equipment to dissassemble :-)

    You should find that the fuel gauge/trip computer is a single unit attached by a short cable to the main instrument PCB. Check all joints at this location (and around the cluster PCB as well) - look for "dry" solder joints and carefully resolder (just heat and reapply solder if neccessary)

    On my fuel gauge, nearly all the joints were open circuit.

    I think you will have to carefully pull the instrument cluster out of the dash assembly and remove some covers etc.

    Clean hands, clean desk with good lighting, take your time etc.

    Or alternatively, take the whole thing to a decent electronic technician - you've done most of the hard work already (getting the dash out) - so they may be able to assist you...

    <small>[ 07 May 2002, 09:57 AM: Message edited by: Europa ]</small>
    '05 Pearl Black Mégane 5-Door LXR(Daily Driver), '75 Trak Yellow R16TSA (Parts Car), '74 Midnight Blue R17TS (Rebuilding), '73 457 Blue R17TL (Parts Car), '72 Alpine White R16TL (Retired), '69 Sunburst Brown R16TS (Awaiting Rebuild), '68 "Appliance White" Europa (Stored)

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