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  1. #51
    Fellow Frogger! vanderaj's Avatar
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    Upon re-reading, the place down Geelong way seems to be an okay dealer, and that's not too far away (I'm in Point Cook) - an easy drive down the freeway.

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    Might give them a shot. I still like the new Scenic. Does anyone know if diesel engines will make it to Australia for the Scenic?

    Andrew
    Last edited by vanderaj; 26th September 2005 at 12:41 AM.
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  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by vanderaj
    Upon re-reading, the place down Geelong way seems to be an okay dealer, and that's not too far away (I'm in Point Cook) - an easy drive down the freeway.

    Might give them a shot. I still like the new Scenic. Does anyone know if diesel engines will make it to Australia for the Scenic?

    Andrew
    From my experience, the Geelong dealership rock

    I am sure there are many customers that have been happy with the service from other dealers, it's just that people are more likely to take the time to relay negative experiences than the positive ones which are taken for granted...

    The ScenicII is a ripper car that is without competition in it's segment.

    A turbo diesel would be great on practiacal Mulit Purpose vehicle like the Scenic, but Diesel still only makes limited financial sense in Australia with petrol/diesel prices as they are...

    Unless your pulling big K's it's probably not worth it anyway...

  3. #53
    Fellow Frogger! vanderaj's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mistareno
    From my experience, the Geelong dealership rock

    A turbo diesel would be great on practiacal Mulit Purpose vehicle like the Scenic, but Diesel still only makes limited financial sense in Australia with petrol/diesel prices as they are...

    Unless your pulling big K's it's probably not worth it anyway...
    Coolo. I'll make an appointment soon with them.

    I do about 25,000 km a year. I love the turbo diesel feel - so grunty in the city with effortless overtaking. As almost all euros need 95 or better fuel, and that usually costs 10c a litre more no matter what the price on the pump, whereas diesel is usually 3-5 c/l more. According to the Renault UK website, the 1.9 dCi has a combined fuel economy of 6 l/100 km, and the 2.0 petrol (which we get here) gets 8.6 l/100 km, let's call it 40% improvement in fuel economy.

    25000 km / 100 * 8.6 = 2150 litres of petrol @ 1.34 = $2881
    25000 km / 100 * 6 = 1500 litres of diesel @ 1.27 = $1905

    I usually keep a car for three years (max so far so I can save a maximum of ~ $3000 in fuel costs assuming today's pricing stays. The Golf and Pug diesels are around that price difference, so it works about the same for me. The 1.9 tDi is also about 1.3 s faster to 100 km/h than the 2.0 petrol, so the nominal price difference is made up by the improvement in performance, particularly where I notice it - in the city.

    So in short, I'd like a diesel I'll test drive what they have, though.

    Andrew
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  4. #54
    1000+ Posts Europa's Avatar
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    Anyone know how the Australian diesel refineries are going?

    Last I heard we were getting the less advanced diesel engines (in Peugeot etc) due to the quality of our fuel being poorer than the Euro spec.
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  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by vanderaj
    Coolo. I'll make an appointment soon with them.

    I do about 25,000 km a year. I love the turbo diesel feel - so grunty in the city with effortless overtaking. As almost all euros need 95 or better fuel, and that usually costs 10c a litre more no matter what the price on the pump, whereas diesel is usually 3-5 c/l more. According to the Renault UK website, the 1.9 dCi has a combined fuel economy of 6 l/100 km, and the 2.0 petrol (which we get here) gets 8.6 l/100 km, let's call it 40% improvement in fuel economy.

    25000 km / 100 * 8.6 = 2150 litres of petrol @ 1.34 = $2881
    25000 km / 100 * 6 = 1500 litres of diesel @ 1.27 = $1905

    I usually keep a car for three years (max so far so I can save a maximum of ~ $3000 in fuel costs assuming today's pricing stays. The Golf and Pug diesels are around that price difference, so it works about the same for me. The 1.9 tDi is also about 1.3 s faster to 100 km/h than the 2.0 petrol, so the nominal price difference is made up by the improvement in performance, particularly where I notice it - in the city.

    So in short, I'd like a diesel I'll test drive what they have, though.

    Andrew
    they say 8.6 but in my brand new scenic with the lot (sun roof etc) I have done better than 8 on every country run. Better than 7 from bottom of west gate bridge to first traffic light in geelong, using cruise control which i guess is not wuite as ecopnomical as anticipating hills ahead. (no I'm not fixated on fuel consumption but that geelong road is so boring what else can i do?) since you're in point cook you'd be doing a bit of freeway driving i guess. (see extended rant on the thread "my new scenic II")
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  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColinJ
    they say 8.6 but in my brand new scenic with the lot (sun roof etc) I have done better than 8 on every country run.
    Bear in mind that is the combined fuel consumption figure - for country driving you should look at the country fuel cycle figure - which is 6.4l/100km (EU figures). The city figure is 10.9l/100km to compare

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  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Europa
    Last I heard we were getting the less advanced diesel engines (in Peugeot etc) due to the quality of our fuel being poorer than the Euro spec.
    New 1.6 and 2.0 16V HDis have been released in the Peugeot 307 & 407 ranges - same engines as in Europe.

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  8. #58
    Fellow Frogger! vanderaj's Avatar
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    Cool - I like a larger car like the Scenic to be so frugal. How do you find the six speed transmission? Does the cruise control work properly with it on hills?

    I changed to an auto cos of the nightmare that is the Westgate bridge on those odd mornings which require an early start, but if the car is torquey enough, it shouldn't be too bad on the ol' clutch leg.

    thanks,
    Andrew
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  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Europa
    Anyone know how the Australian diesel refineries are going?

    Last I heard we were getting the less advanced diesel engines (in Peugeot etc) due to the quality of our fuel being poorer than the Euro spec.
    From what I gathered in the recent news articles, upgrading the diesel refineries was part of the plan that was to be funded by that 0.06cpl increase in the fuel levy.

    I think they're still going ahead with it, it's just coming out of other govt revenue streams now.
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  10. #60
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    Yup thats exactly right Peter.

    In any case, BMW and Mercedes have been sending us their best diesels engines for a while now, so it was always a fairly lame excuse from PSA. But environmentally, with the new diesel, it will make a lot more sense (sulfur contents will be dropping dramatically).

  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by vanderaj
    Coolo. I'll make an appointment soon with them.

    I do about 25,000 km a year. I love the turbo diesel feel - so grunty in the city with effortless overtaking. As almost all euros need 95 or better fuel, and that usually costs 10c a litre more no matter what the price on the pump, whereas diesel is usually 3-5 c/l more. According to the Renault UK website, the 1.9 dCi has a combined fuel economy of 6 l/100 km, and the 2.0 petrol (which we get here) gets 8.6 l/100 km, let's call it 40% improvement in fuel economy.

    25000 km / 100 * 8.6 = 2150 litres of petrol @ 1.34 = $2881
    25000 km / 100 * 6 = 1500 litres of diesel @ 1.27 = $1905

    I usually keep a car for three years (max so far so I can save a maximum of ~ $3000 in fuel costs assuming today's pricing stays. The Golf and Pug diesels are around that price difference, so it works about the same for me. The 1.9 tDi is also about 1.3 s faster to 100 km/h than the 2.0 petrol, so the nominal price difference is made up by the improvement in performance, particularly where I notice it - in the city.

    So in short, I'd like a diesel I'll test drive what they have, though.

    Andrew


    Hi Andrew, Rick at Rex Gorell Geelong here,

    More than happy to show you the New Scenic. We have both auto and manual to drive. I have been driving the Scenic for 5 mths ...great car ....

    Contact me anytime !

  12. #62
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    I had no problem getting a tesk drive when i bought my RSC, spoke with the dealer for about 10 minutes and told him i would be back next sunday for a drive, when i got there the car had just been detailed and was told to have fun and have it back by 4pm, i only expected a round the block drive but he gave it to me for the whole day , needless to say that RSC copped the thrashing of its life up the old road that day, and thats when i feel in love, gotta say though if i didnt get to drive it on a tight and twisty road i probably wouldnt have bought one, but hey it got me hook line and sinker

  13. #63
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    Andrew are you selling your little C3 and getting a scenic?

  14. #64
    Fellow Frogger! vanderaj's Avatar
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    I am looking around - in November, I get (very) tax effective packaging through work. If it makes sense to get out of my current lease, I'd be silly to keep paying for my car out of my post-tax dollars.

    The cars I'm interested in are:

    a) VW Golf 2.0 TDI - way faster than my other choices, but also fairly frugal. A bit bland in the styling department and so-so in the toy department
    b) Renault Scenic - a faster, bigger version of what I have now, plenty of toys, and from what I read in the reviews, a comfy ride
    c) Citroen C4 hatch - awesome looks, plenty of toys

    All of them are in the early to mid 30's on road.

    I like toys such as climate, cruise control, and auto-on everything. The Golf has most of these in the Comfortline model I like (the seats in the Sportsline are simply uncomfortable), but is a bit on the light side compared to the C4 and the Scenic which are loaded with useful gadgets.

    I drive on some of the worst urban roads in Australia - we have more potholes than road around here, so a comfy compliant ride is essential. I don't know what it is about western suburbs ultra safe Labour seats, but we don't get any attention from road crews.

    Lastly, I don't tote a lot of stuff all that often, but I need the opportunity to do so, which is why I like the hatch form factor. The Scenic is larger than the other two, and it is eerily reminiscent of my C3 from the front quarters (although has the Megane style bustle thing happening in the rear). The C4 hatch is a little squeezy, but I prefer its looks. I'll check out what the rear loading is like when I go test drive one.

    thanks,
    Andrew
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  15. #65
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    Its a little over three years ago now, but I was really serious about a Scenic, having driven one for a month in the UK (1.6). But, as you do, I wanted to try one on local roads. An hour would have been plenty. I went and kicked tyres, but was told to come back the next day for a drive. I returned and waited 10-15 minutes then off we went. I drove competently but very gently around the block - probably less than a km, following the directions of the salesman and as we came back past the dealership he said 'just turn in and I'll park it'. I suggested I might need a little longer with the car and was told that would not be possible for the foreseeable future as they didn't have enough stock to be racking up km. Similar experiences with Alfa Romeo and one particular Subaru dealer who, in spite of booking days ahead and being called to drive, had a car to try with no petrol. So after 5 minutes, we were back in the forecourt. Silly waste of everyone's time. You really need a good hour or so to even begin to get the feel. Ideally a morning and half a tank of petrol. Plenty do this - Ford, Landrover, Citroen, BMW (take it for the weekend sir..), Saab, Peugeot, Mercedes Benz, Audi have all offered me unsupervised vehicles for longer periods.
    John

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  16. #66
    1000+ Posts Europa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trixie
    Saab, Peugeot, Mercedes Benz, Audi have all offered me unsupervised vehicles for longer periods.
    Looks like Vukie (4 posts back on this thread) was able to take his test drive for a while, and I've heard of a few others who have been able to take cars for 1/2 a day. I guess it depends on the dealer, once again...
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  17. #67
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    I bought my Renault Trafic from Gorells, iwas also negotiating a VW transporter until the Renault caught my eye (they sell both) the salesmen from both makes were quite good and helpful and prepared to deal,so far after sales service has been good also.
    By far the beat dealer I have dealt with in regards to service is Peck & Stokes in Geelong they sell BMW,Landrover,Jag,Peugot,Mini etc we have bought several cars from them the current one is a 307. They are very helpful and obliging, Rex Gorell has bought them in his bid to own every dealer in Geelong so it will be interesting to see if the standards are maintained.
    Cheers,
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  18. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stuey
    It's slightly upsetting, isn't it John? A few idiots who can't do their job properly, in such a small market, could almost kill a marque in this country. So much so, that a few days ago, I went to the Renault Aus. website to email them a link to this thread (and others) with a prompt to 'read them - please...'.

    Unfortunately, there was no contact email address at all. I suppose that just about sums them up.

    I was surprised they didn't have a 'Don't Contact Us' link at the top of the page that you click on only for it to make a farting sound.

    Stuey

    You are absolutely right, I tried to contact RENAULT, no way you can do this on ther site. Lagunas are still listed on their website, however, they are not even sold in this country anymore. I tried to buy one in May, and only got a pathetic smile: what do you want here. After all I only owned Renault cars for 30 years. How come Renault and their sales people are not motivated?

  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Europa
    hehe funny man ;-)

    Nothing compares with a DSG - even the forthcoming roboticised manual transmissions I don't think would be able to compare. The DSG is really a brilliant idea!


    After 1 week with the GTI DSG I am absolutely blown away. I have to restrain myself to run the car in properly, never had so much fun. It is an awsome innovation and I think in time there will be other car companies who will buy the rights to use this box.(Maybe even Renault)
    Yes, you accused me of being unfair camparing it with my 95 Laguna V6 Auto,but going by press reports over the years they were always a little bit lame, even the Laguna 2. But apart from the Auto ( and the service) I loved the Laguna and would even have bought a new one. But as you know; no more Lagunas in this country for a while. So I opted to look at the GTI (2 Renault dealers did not even let me look at the RS 225, not even thinking about test driving one).
    I opted for the GTI, and I am not sorry, even though I am a Renault nut.
    Fine, the boot is a little smaller, but the GTI is agressive and so is the new VW policy and their sales staff.
    Surely, the Froggies can match this, with a bit of French flare and agressive marketing policies they should be able to compete here instead of sitting back doing nothing.

  20. #70
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    I highly recommend City Automobiles on Church Street. I bought my 2002 RSC 172 from them and the service is top rate. I have had no problems going on test drives and i have driven nearly all the Renault cars bar the new Scenic so far including about 3 test drives of the 225.

    I made it clear from the start to them though, the timing of my purchase which was tied-in to the likelihood of the Cup making it here.

    I am now going to order one from the first batch of '06 build cars.
    I only wish Renault Australia (aka VDA) would be more in sync in rolling out the models and marketing. I mean they have advertised the Cup in the October editions of F1 and Wheels but when you go online, the price for the standard Megane still shows up as $42,990 (when it has been reduced since 1 July) with advertising of the new price only hitting print media as recent as last month. No mention of the Cup on the website still!

    I think dealerships are partly bound by the lack of push from VDA in terms of models, timing of launch/supply etc.

  21. #71
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    There is an Ad in this month's Wheels for the Megane Cup 225 Turbo. Unfortunately they show the 3 door model we don't get. Bit silly of them.

    Fine, the boot is a little smaller, but the GTI is agressive and so is the new VW policy and their sales staff.
    Must be why they are within spitting distance of selling more cars in Oz than BMW.

  22. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Europa
    Looks like Vukie (4 posts back on this thread) was able to take his test drive for a while, and I've heard of a few others who have been able to take cars for 1/2 a day. I guess it depends on the dealer, once again...
    Try a weekend ... that was Pug (several times) not Ren. Ren, well I did get a few drives of RSC and 225 to their credit, but my brother could not (despite trying to make bookings 3 or 4 times and earning twice as much as me). So he bought a GolfMkV, they let him take the car for a couple of drives back to back with other cars (Subaru mainly) over a week, third time he came back and said "OK ... where do I sign - I've got cash*".

    - xTc -

    * dealers prefer the hear "I need finance"
    You're not fooling everyone, or did you forget? .......




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    Quote Originally Posted by Frosch
    I opted for the GTI, and I am not sorry, even though I am a Renault nut.
    Don't worry, your username means Frog in German

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  24. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frosch
    Yes, you accused me of being unfair camparing it with my 95 Laguna V6 Auto,but going by press reports over the years they were always a little bit lame, even the Laguna 2.
    umm, you DO realise that the DSG box is ENTIRELY different to a traditional automatic gearbox - this was the reason why I highlighted the unfairness of comparing the two.

    A "traditional" auto is no match for a DSG. A DSG really is closer to a manual gearbox than an automatic.

    And the DSG is a good thing, no doubt about that at all.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mantra
    There is an Ad in this month's Wheels for the Megane Cup 225 Turbo. Unfortunately they show the 3 door model we don't get. Bit silly of them.
    Sounds like someone grabbed the wrong picture for the Advert. Still, they are planning to sell them in the future...

    Quote Originally Posted by mantra
    Must be why they are within spitting distance of selling more cars in Oz than BMW.
    Having a low sales volume doesn't neccessarily mean "failure". I can think of plenty of cars that are really desireable, but were never volume sellers.
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