is Renault going to quit Australia?
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  1. #1
    Tadpole
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    Icon6 is Renault going to quit Australia?

    I was told yesterday that Renault would be the next car manufacturer to leave our shores???

    I have just purchased a Clio Sport to sit alongside my Citroen XM and Peugeot 406 coupe.

    Renault leaving Australia will not really concern me with my new purchase but I got the feeling they have sold a heap of Scenics. Meganes, Clios and it was only the Laguna that failed. It looked that they were making their numbers.

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    Anyone know how they are going?

  2. #2
    Member adamsclio's Avatar
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    I was told the moon is made of cheese.

    I really don't think they have been back for long enough to make that decision yet. I also think they would realise how bad it would be for their image to leave again.

    Just my opinion though.
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  3. #3
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    Let's face it, Renault haven't got a real good track record for stability in Australia which is one thing about owning one that makes me nervous.
    I'd suggest that Australdi should be able to shed some light on this as she is in the trade and works for a Renault distributor...be a pity to see her have to change her login name to Kiadi or Hyundaidi
    Seriously though, I think the whole motor industry is in for a rough time based on all the downgrading of profit expectations by most major companies and the likes of Cit/Pug and even Ford making noises about pulling out of motor sport for financial reasons.
    Where I am it's pretty to see the streets lined with all the wanky 4 X 4s with the "For Sale" signs on them and them also wall to wall in the car yards.
    Methinks this little craze id coming back to earth with a big thud thanks to the cost of petrol and repairs and the debt some of these posers must be in must eventually create major problems with new car sales as they struggle to refinance themselves back into proper cars.


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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan S
    Let's face it, Renault haven't got a real good track record for stability in Australia which is one thing about owning one that makes me nervous.
    And this advice is from someone who owns a string of Citroen's?? :-)

    At this point I'd say that Renault are finally sorting out a viable volume. The numbers of cars sold each year from 2001 is fairly consistent, even though the car market has been booming. It really is just a matter of hanging in there to re-establish the credibility of the marque. Given the Renault-Nissan alliance I'd say the incentive is there to persist even though the production volumes for Australia are quite low. One thing that does surprise me though is that in Renault publications disclosing sales in markets, that Australia is one of the better markets in the Asia-Pacific region, but they never seem to disclose the numbers in their own publications.

    One other thing, in the ABS motor vehicle census of 2004, Renault was listed in the top 30 of vehicle marques on the road, sure at number 28 with 15,994 but at least there are more Renault's out there now than Proton's, Porsche's and Citroen's :-).

    For interest Peugeot came in at number 19 with 49,846 and VW at number 15 with 88,399.

  5. #5
    Tadpole
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    Icon6 great news. From what I see the Reno's seem to be selling better than ever

    The comment was from the Pugcit mob of which I am very happy. Seems to me the only one that failed in the past 2 years was the Laguna.

    Anyway, I will proceed with the Clio Sport purchase

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    If they are going it'll be one of the best kept (or worse kept) secrets ... and other then dealer principles I would think they would leave it to the last minute to tell everyone (why have a fire sale tooooo early) ...

    It's a rumour. (though it has some historical precedence to it).

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  7. #7
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    Default Renno in for the long haul

    Just my perception.

    Renault recognise that one of the things that they have to get over in reaching market acceptance, is to overcome or dispell any suggestion that they will again withdraw from the Australian Market.

    At most of our club talks it was emphasised that Renault were determined to be here for the long haul, to build a solid base on a good selection of vehicles, a dedicated dealer network and service commitment to owners.

    From my humble observations, the dealer network has expanded and there is growth in both sales and more recently the number of new Renaults appearing on our roads, particularly the scenics, and as a Laguna owner I am pleased to see many of the dealer networked vehicles in private hands, and subsequent purchases by new car buyers. The megane 225's will develop into quite a cult following and the Clios do fulfill an established sporting market and excellent potential to endure as a secondary base of ownership and modification.

    All in all, a good base for increased rather than reduced sales - the key to continued sales and growth is a determined dealer network and after sales service, by enthusiastic sales and service personnel dedicated to the Marque and maintaining the present bouyant image.
    If Renault can ensure this last component the picture is rosy for a long and happy commitment in Australia.

    Lets enjoy the cars and end the "doomsday" speculation that some competitors would like to spread as they see their market share penetrated.

    Ken, (enjoying his "family" of cars )

  8. #8
    1000+ Posts Europa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Stewart
    The comment was from the Pugcit mob of which I am very happy.
    You expect a Peugeot/Citroen agent to give you accurate information about Renault?

    Next thing you'll be visiting a Ford dealer and asking them about Holdens.
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    More unsubstantiated rumours i think...
    Renault have said from day 0 they are willing incurr a loss & stick with it for the long haul...

    As for the dealers, there's a few that are definetly keen & trying to build the image, so in line with Ken i think it will happen, it will just take a while!

    Lets also not forget that thing called the Formula1... I'm sure its a HUGE boost to the image (well maybe not in Aust that much), maybe they should start making a locally produced V8? LOL

  10. #10
    wielder of the sword Australdi's Avatar
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    Icon1 I heard my name mentioned....*grin*

    I get asked this all the time....I'm beginning to think it's the classic furphy every competing dealer drops if someone mentions they're looking at a Renault.
    The justification given is "they left before"
    The facts they don't mention is that things were VERY different then.
    1. Renault did not have direct access to the Aussie market, and had to rely on other dealers selling & servicing the cars (need I elaborate?)
    2. Tariffs on the import market meant that the playing field was decidedly uneven.
    3. The dealers they were going through were also 'niche market' and didn't have an extensive coverage nation wide.

    so in other words price, distribution & loyalty were all against them.

    Luckily things have changed....alot!
    1. Renault now has their own dealerships.
    2. Tariffs have been removed so everyone plays on an (almost) equal footing
    3. Due to the Renault-Nissan Alliance, Renault has Australia wide coverage for parts & servicing via the established Nissan network.

    Renault assured those present at the re-launch & the motorshow that they were here to stay now & I have no reason to doubt that on logic.
    Renault have invested millions to establish in Aust, fully aware that it was going to be a long term exercise to re-build the brand over here. Renault being one of the biggest (worldwide) manufacturers is able to support this.
    and can do so in an economically viable & sustainable way utilising Nissan infastructure. Sales are steady & the brand is becomming increasingly known & accepted as more people are exposed to the vehicles, therefore I have no doubt that Renault will be able to consolidate their position over here and will continue to increase their market share, even in a contracting market. Lets face it they build better cars, with excellent value for money. They are reliable & fun & economical to drive & it won't take long for the general populace to cotton on to this....they have already began to.

    Aus
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  11. #11
    Good Sport danielsydney's Avatar
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    Most of the dealers would not know much history on Renault anyhow. So asking them about Renault and the future inn australia is not very productive.
    Australdi thats why i sent you a private message about how many Trafic and Master have been sold here till date?

  12. #12
    wielder of the sword Australdi's Avatar
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    Daniel
    My answer comes, not as a representative of a dealer, but from someone who has owned a renault since the 90's (and therefore lived the abyss) and direct from Renault itself...ie: I was present when Renault assured (the renault clubs) at the Launch year motorshow, and I have discussed the perceived concerns with renault personnel directly on training days; as well as making logical deductions based on a reasonable understanding of commercial economics, combined with some knowledge of the micro market too. (The Australian & O/S history of renault is a part of salesperson training by the way.)
    Did you get my reply to your PM? As I said I will see what I can scout out, however I can't see the relevance to this topics' question as the commercial range only launched late last year (in entirety) and therefore I would hazard that it is a bit early to extrapolate a causal linkage to those figures and the future of renault in Aust.

    Aus
    Last edited by Australdi; 10th May 2005 at 06:08 PM. Reason: alzhiemers
    Aus
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    The bottom is the area that runs out of oxygen first, it is where the most oxygen is used........"



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    ....beginning to look a bit frightning isn't it.

  13. #13
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    Sales figures here FWIW. No split between models, but it does list the commercials separately.

    http://www.fcai.com.au/sales.php/200...ufacturer.html

  14. #14
    wielder of the sword Australdi's Avatar
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    Ta Simon.
    You're incredible!!

    Aus
    Aus
    ".....the good health of a pond is held in a delicate balance. A pond's condition
    deteriorates when the bottom environment cannot support animal life.
    The bottom is the area that runs out of oxygen first, it is where the most oxygen is used........"



    '84 fuego GTX
    '87 fuego GTX
    '85 fuego GTX
    ....beginning to look a bit frightning isn't it.

  15. #15
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    Another factor for remaining in Aus is that the market is different this time. They are making small inroads into the mainstream because the mainstream is more accepting of different design, and in more cases than before customers are starting to look for it. I'd guess there are quite a few new to Renault buyers as well, especially with vehicles like the Scenic.

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    1000+ Posts zykyra's Avatar
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    What Renault needs to do is to BUILD on sales. Its all well & good selling cars to people & they dont come back because of poor dealer service. My experience in WA is that the dealers here really dont have a clue. (I am not speaking about Eastern states dealers!). Both will quote 3 weeks for a loan car & wont go out of their way to help if they dont have to. I have had 6 trips to both dealers in the last 6mths & not one has been pleasant. So many issues & just bad attitudes, I like to think I am fairly happy, go lucky as well & usually forgive most things that others whinge about, but they have stretched my patience! This has certainly not been my experience when personally dealing with SAAB in the past. I also have a mate who works for the local BMW dealership & 1 who works @ a Subaru dealership & their level of customer service is a world apart from Renaults. These brands, albeit being more expensive, have built there reputation on SERVICE, as well as their cars! I believe this isnt limited to WA & that Renault needs to take a long, hard look at its long term dealer network & implement a new customer retention program. Maybe they are doing this?? I certainly dont see it here! I love Renaults & think their cars are just right to take the Aus market by storm for the 1st time in years but if it doesnt happen, I can guarantee it is not product, price or willingness, it will be the dealers lack of service, simple as that. I probably wont buy another Renault simply because of this factor (or I would go East!). Saying that, however, I, probably more than most, wish that they succeed in Australia & that they overcome this. I couldnt think of anything better than seeing more Regies on the road! I dont think they will pull out readily though, I'd say they are here for the long run & that they will build on their failures here more & more. Lets hope.
    Last edited by zykyra; 10th May 2005 at 11:14 PM. Reason: Grammar
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  17. #17
    1000+ Posts Europa's Avatar
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    There is only one dealer in Adelaide, and reports generally seem to indicate they are pretty good. Australdi may be able to verify, I think the SA sales are considered OK (within Renault) factoring in the smaller population etc.
    Last edited by Europa; 11th May 2005 at 10:34 AM.
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  18. #18
    1000+ Posts David Shearer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zykyra
    What Renault needs to do is to BUILD on sales. Its all well & good selling cars to people & they dont come back because of poor dealer service. My experience in WA is that the dealers here really dont have a clue. (I am not speaking about Eastern states dealers!). Both will quote 3 weeks for a loan car & wont go out of their way to help if they dont have to. I have had 6 trips to both dealers in the last 6mths & not one has been pleasant. So many issues & just bad attitudes, I like to think I am fairly happy, go lucky as well & usually forgive most things that others whinge about, but they have stretched my patience! This has certainly not been my experience when personally dealing with SAAB in the past. I also have a mate who works for the local BMW dealership & 1 who works @ a Subaru dealership & their level of customer service is a world apart from Renaults. These brands, albeit being more expensive, have built there reputation on SERVICE, as well as their cars! I believe this isnt limited to WA & that Renault needs to take a long, hard look at its long term dealer network & implement a new customer retention program. Maybe they are doing this?? I certainly dont see it here! I love Renaults & think their cars are just right to take the Aus market by storm for the 1st time in years but if it doesnt happen, I can guarantee it is not product, price or willingness, it will be the dealers lack of service, simple as that. I probably wont buy another Renault simply because of this factor (or I would go East!). Saying that, however, I, probably more than most, wish that they succeed in Australia & that they overcome this. I couldnt think of anything better than seeing more Regies on the road! I dont think they will pull out readily though, I'd say they are here for the long run & that they will build on their failures here more & more. Lets hope.

    Zykyra I completely agree. Whilst the renaults are great cars to drive and own its the people running the show over here that lets the team down. I really love driving the car, but if something happens, I imediately think that its going to be a major hassel dealing with this problem as I feel that currently the idea is to sell the car and wash your hands of the buyer. Its very sad as when my car had problems I seemed to get the response of renault covering themselves (loan car policy, drivedays,we've checked the computer etc). All i need in a car company is someone who will assure me they are looking into my problem, then actually look into it and maybe solve it (if possible). I don't feel that this is happeneing at Renault at present. Hopefully the dealers can take on some of this responsibility as they're usually the poor buggers that have to deal with the problems us drivers face.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not out to get Renault head office or the dealers, as I'm sure they're not trying to make us angry by choice. If they perhaps did their surveys a few months down the track rather than the fortnight after purchase (when pure new car bliss is still about), maybe this would give them a better understanding of where they need to change.

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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Shearer
    Zykyra I completely agree. Whilst the renaults are great cars to drive and own its the people running the show over here that lets the team down.
    Well my brother is willing to give Renault yet ANOTHER chance tonight .... if it's been the same attitude as the last two times then he'll forget it (three strikes and you're out). The Mazda dealer been real good, "sure take the MX5 out for unsupervised spin, we'll have an SE in a few weeks we'll call you"....

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    Good Sport danielsydney's Avatar
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    I agree with david its the support that lets the team down with these french car brands.
    This would not happen in France..

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by danielsydney
    I agree with david its the support that lets the team down with these french car brands. This would not happen in France..
    Where is "The Real Frog", I'd be intersted in the "perception" of french cars in France, cause in the UK it's not very good, in Aust it's not crash hot, so do they love them in France or do they have the same sort of "indifferent" attitude.

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    Quote Originally Posted by XTC206
    Where is "The Real Frog", I'd be intersted in the "perception" of french cars in France, cause in the UK it's not very good, in Aust it's not crash hot, so do they love them in France or do they have the same sort of "indifferent" attitude.

    - xTc -
    I asked a few (non car enthusiast) people in France and it was their belief (whether rightly or wrongly) that Renault was superior to the others (ie Pug and Cit)

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by graham66
    I asked a few (non car enthusiast) people in France and it was their belief (whether rightly or wrongly) that Renault was superior to the others (ie Pug and Cit)
    Similar to my Korean friends who say Hyundai isn't considered that well and Daewoo and Kia have better reputations (not the case on Oz) ... strange.

    Was reading recently - It's like Lexus .. ask an Aussie and they'll tell you you're driving a fancy Toyota, ask an American and it'll be consider on par with BMW and such.

    Lexus Japan has just broken away from Toyota somewhat, that may change some perceptions, maybe. Lexus is a great car, I'd certainly wouldn't mind owning one.

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    Good Sport danielsydney's Avatar
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    France is a very nationalistic country and i got the impression if it was french it was the best. They love the cars there...

  25. #25
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    There's definetly a few good dealers in terms of service...

    I've always treated my service people well from the start, not sure if i was lucky to pick a good dealer, but i've had nothing but praise (and from others i've sent there)

    Honestly in a fair few cases i think the dealers are reacting to the attitudes of the drivers! treat the service people like sh*t & expect great service back? i dont think thats going to happen...

    I also think its a lack of communication & somewhere the Car Clubs can help, i.e. provide a feedback medium to Renault Aus & bit of power to the drivers if they are having troubles with dealerships...

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