Old hose clip
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Thread: Old hose clip

  1. #1
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    Default Old hose clip

    This is probably just another display of ignorance on my part, but may be a useful/interesting discussion point.

    In the process of un-storing the 4CV I have been working my way through the rubber wear, sometimes electively, sometimes prodded by disaster/misbehaviour

    MY 4 CV has only 23000 miles and much of it is as it left the factory ( excepting the layers of dirt and some rust ) I don't think that it has had or needed any major mechanical stuff done, so the mechanicals are as they left the factory.

    The hose clips are a type with which I am unfamiliar - essentially a band secured by a bloody great split pin. Pictures are attached.

    I have managed to get one off intact, the others died in the course of a life and death struggle down a hole in the dark (radiator filler hose). Am pondering whether to re-use for authenticity or whether to add it to the instructional/historical collection.

    Could anybody enlighten me on how they worked - how to get and maintain tension while doing them up?

    Best Wishes

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    Andrew

    IMG_0527.jpgIMG_0529.jpg

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    Welcome to yesteryear! We undid and fastened those Cotter clips with a tool that was basically a sharpened hook on a screwdriver handle. They unwind. Change to a modern one for an easier and better job.

    You can still find those things at antique parts places.

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    Quote Originally Posted by seasink View Post
    Welcome to yesteryear! We undid and fastened those Cotter clips with a tool that was basically a sharpened hook on a screwdriver handle. They unwind. Change to a modern one for an easier and better job.

    You can still find those things at antique parts places.
    My same advice, always replaced the Fuego ones with modern clips after all you might have to change a hose yourself at some time. Never tried to re-use the originals.

    Ken

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    Hi Andrew,
    That's a Mirex buckle, quite common on early French cars. They are effective, but fiddly to fit correctly
    https://shop.citroenclassics.co.uk/m...ping-627-p.asp

    There is a special tool but a small screwdriver will do the job, I have a small supply with straps if you want to keep things original - I've also got a few AF stickers here with your name on them. . .

    See here for fitting.
    Mirex instructions

    Cheers
    Chris
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Watkins View Post
    This is probably just another display of ignorance on my part, but may be a useful/interesting discussion point.

    In the process of un-storing the 4CV I have been working my way through the rubber wear, sometimes electively, sometimes prodded by disaster/misbehaviour

    MY 4 CV has only 23000 miles and much of it is as it left the factory ( excepting the layers of dirt and some rust ) I don't think that it has had or needed any major mechanical stuff done, so the mechanicals are as they left the factory.

    The hose clips are a type with which I am unfamiliar - essentially a band secured by a bloody great split pin. Pictures are attached.

    I have managed to get one off intact, the others died in the course of a life and death struggle down a hole in the dark (radiator filler hose). Am pondering whether to re-use for authenticity or whether to add it to the instructional/historical collection.

    Could anybody enlighten me on how they worked - how to get and maintain tension while doing them up?

    Best Wishes

    Andrew

    IMG_0527.jpgIMG_0529.jpg
    I used a tubular tool with a rectangular section at the end which fitted exactly the head of the split pin. I never ever saw anything like the ones shown here: https://www.google.com.au/search?q=s...xPy79Hro3lGbM:

    P.S: The Yanks refer to split pins as "Cotter Pins" This however is incorrect in English usage. Here's a Cotter pin:
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got 'til it's gone............

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    The Australian wholesalers split the difference as well as the pin - "Split Cotter Pin"

    It reminds me of people who used to adjust tappets on cars that didn't have any.

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    Quote Originally Posted by seasink View Post
    The Australian wholesalers split the difference as well as the pin - "Split Cotter Pin"

    It reminds me of people who used to adjust tappets on cars that didn't have any.
    As the Split Pin was invented in the US by a bloke named Ira J Young, I, like most of the world, am mystified as to how split pins became known in the US as cotter pins or cotter keys. A split pin is a split pin, a cotter pin/key is something else entirely but the all pervasive use of so-called "US English" (No such language - it's "American") has now found it's way into regular use in Australia. I wonder what fancy name there is for a roll pin?
    Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got 'til it's gone............

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    Some call them spring pins.......

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    Quote Originally Posted by seasink View Post
    Some call them spring pins.......
    Sure they don't call them "spring cotter pins?"
    Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got 'til it's gone............

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    Dear All

    Many thanks, learned something today , so it's a good day

    Interesting that they still seem to be sold on large scale for specialist applications. Can see the advantage of having generic clip and infinitely variable length of strip, so that one only needs a roll of the stuff and a supply of the clips.

    I think that I'll stick with something I understand, especially for hard to get parts or mission critical although can see why the cognoscenti might prefer them for some applications.

    My photo was of the fuel tank filler pipe, which had more hole than rubber, so was cremation risk and PITA to get at. This one will certainly be done with something I understand. At least it gave me the opportunity to refresh tank, hoses and sender, but am in no hurry for a repeat any time soon.

    Thanks again

    Andrew





    Quote Originally Posted by GreenBlood View Post
    Hi Andrew,
    That's a Mirex buckle, quite common on early French cars. They are effective, but fiddly to fit correctly
    https://shop.citroenclassics.co.uk/m...ping-627-p.asp

    There is a special tool but a small screwdriver will do the job, I have a small supply with straps if you want to keep things original - I've also got a few AF stickers here with your name on them. . .

    See here for fitting.
    Mirex instructions

    Cheers
    Chris

  11. #11
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    I'm with you Kim a cotter pin is that horrible little tapered pin with a thread on its end that used to come loose and cause all sorts of pain when riding push bikes.
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    What a coincidence. Just yesterday I was inspecting a truly superb restoration of a Hino Contessa in Perth. All of the new clips on alll of the hoses were this type to maintain originality. The owner told me he found Mercedes Benz had them available for some old models and that he made a tool to tighten them. They worked far better than he expected!

    They work on a similar principle to the Ligarex device that is used, for example, on driveshaft boots and which are familiar to some Citroen owners. The way they tighten, with 2 or 3 wraps, depending upon desired tightness, seems to be extremely effective. I really like the idea of getting more mechanical advantage the more wraps you do. I reckon they probably give more even circumferential tightening than conventional clamps. I have the correct Ligarex pliers and have used them from time to time on the Renaults but, as Peter has suggested, went to conventional worm-drive clamps (remember "Jubilee" clamps?) for all practical purposes a lifetime ago.

    You'd know to try and get clamps with an edge bevel, not the thin, sharp-edged SS ones.

    Sounds like an active Christmas break over there.... Happy driving for 2019.
    JohnW

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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnW View Post
    You'd know to try and get clamps with an edge bevel, not the thin, sharp-edged SS ones.

    .

    Absolutely JohnW but they seem harder to procure these days. I usually buy a box of each size when I can find them, just to have on hand in the garage. Some of the cheap Chinese SS variety cut into the hoses and can strip their innards when you try to tighten them


    Ken

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    Any place that deals in industrial hose clips will have bevel-edged ones. They aren't hard to find. The nasties are usual in cheaper car places.

    PS Tridon T bolt models are commonly found, these have a rolled edge.
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    I use Norma ones and yes, after buying quite a few online some time ago (Norma) and seem to remember Enzed has an interesting range of clamps.

    I've just refitted a nasty one to the Citroen, i.e. not rolled edge, but it is very wide and caused no apparent damage. Next time I'm in there I'll change it out.
    JohnW

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    Icon14 Trick is finding the right clip size when you want it..shops shut and all.

    Quote Originally Posted by seasink View Post
    Any place that deals in industrial hose clips will have bevel-edged ones. They aren't hard to find. The nasties are usual in cheaper car places.

    PS Tridon T bolt models are commonly found, these have a rolled edge.
    I often buy in bulk and get those quality ones at bargain prices by the boxful, just keep an eye out at market stalls and so forth where they tend to sell both types (bought them up in a job lot?) and sell at a low get what you can cheap price.

    Bit of dickering and you end up with all the quality stuff at a bargain price. Sometimes you have to buy a bit of the rubbish stuff too, but they come in handy for non critical stuff. I have a bucket of those and s/hand ones accumulated over the years too.

    After doing this for a few years though if you have to go into an industrial supply place and buy at "normal prices" over the counter be prepared to get a surprise at what you have to pay, pays to keep an eye on prices as most are unimpressed when you faint on the floor.


    Ken
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    Hi Ken
    What you say is too true ! I have been saving/buying all sorts of clamps, clips, dohickies, etc for years. Now it all has to go I gave my mate all the good normal sized ones for the farm. Still left me with a lot of very handy ones which will all go in the bin probably It has got to that time in my life !!
    I must say also that those double wrap hose clamps with the split pin were very good and usually could be undone and used again if a normal size. Not hard to see how they work. Similar to a strapping machine if you have used those, with fiber strap or SS strap.
    Jaahn
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