R12 gear linkage
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Thread: R12 gear linkage

  1. #1
    1000+ Posts REN TIN TIN's Avatar
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    Default R12 gear linkage

    I had the pleasure of having the Silentblocs in the gear selector of the R12 fail on me last week.
    (On a busy road during the morning rush of course). My first 'failed to proceed' event for this car.
    Anyway, during this episode the linkage got a bit bent either when pushing the car off the road or when it was winched onto the tow truck. Would the bent linkage affect the gear change?

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    R12 gear linkage-img_0169.jpg

    I replaced the Silentbolcs and put everything back together but I don't know if I'm now imagining things but the gear selection, while never smooth, appears to be more difficult. Reverse particularly is difficult to select.
    It all went together without any drama.

    I don't want to try an straighten the arm unnecessarily as it looks like it will easily break with any sort of sideways force (the shaft appears to just be butt-welded to the plate). It already had some sideways force to bend it in the first place. If straightening it isn't going to make any difference I'll leave well enough alone.

    R12 gear linkage-img_0176.jpg

    Cheers
    RTT
    "I cannot help but notice that there is no problem between us that cannot be solved by your departure."

  2. #2
    Simon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by REN TIN TIN View Post
    Would the bent linkage affect the gear change?


    Click image for larger version. 

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    If you haven't straightened this bit, it wouldn't surprise me things are a bit dodgy, as it looks bent and therefore would be out of optimal alignment. Straightening it, or replacing it by an unbent part, would - if the other bushes are in good nick - likely restore the "normal" selectivity of the gears.
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    COL
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    I'm with Simon, you will either need to straighten all the bent bits or replace them.

    if you are having gear selection problems the bushes that join the gear lever to the remote link rod could be worn. Also where the remote linkage attaches to the selector shaft at the rear of the gearbox, the rubber bush and where the roll pin is.

    My gear change is very precise and positive, I have removed all the rubber parts (replaced with nylon) and made sure there is no slop in any of the joints.
    Regards Col

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    There's a brand new one of those on ebay fr, I'll see if I can find it for you. (humblest apologies to the apostrophe police if I got it wrong)

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    1000+ Posts schlitzaugen's Avatar
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    I think it is too easy to straighten it without straining the weld to not do it. The bend is going to at least put your gear stick in a different rest position (did you notice anything?) hence command a different range of movement.
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    I used to carry a pair of vice grips in my R8 during a stage of a few failing events while waiting for new blocks. I used the vice grips more than once!

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    Last edited by 59 Floride; 4th October 2017 at 10:31 PM.

  8. #8
    1000+ Posts REN TIN TIN's Avatar
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    Thanks 59 Floride but unfortunately this is the wrong end.
    That's the end the connects to the gearbox selector, I need the end that connects to the gear lever.
    But thanks for looking.
    (The apostrophe is good, this is a contraction of 'there is' so the apostrophe is correct).

    The bend does appear to make enough difference to affect the gear change.
    I was hoping it wouldn't be significant but it appears it is.
    The kink is only about 1/8" to 1/4" at the plate, I don't know, maybe 10 - 15 degrees.
    Over the length of the arm it's a lot further at the lever
    I'll pull it out on the weekend and have a go at straightening it.
    The worst that can happen is the weld will break and I may have to weld it back on (hopefully in the right place).

    Cheers
    RTT
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    1000+ Posts alan moore's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by REN TIN TIN View Post

    The bend does appear to make enough difference to affect the gear change.
    I was hoping it wouldn't be significant but it appears it is.
    The kink is only about 1/8" to 1/4" at the plate, I don't know, maybe 10 - 15 degrees.
    Over the length of the arm it's a lot further at the lever
    I'll pull it out on the weekend and have a go at straightening it.
    The worst that can happen is the weld will break and I may have to weld it back on (hopefully in the right place).

    Cheers
    RTT
    I don't think you will have any worries with bending the gearshift shaft back straight again. I have found them to be quite tough to break the weld.
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  11. #11
    1000+ Posts REN TIN TIN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shoji View Post
    Thanks for that Shoji.
    That's bloody good value at 30 Euro for the complete linkage end to end.
    The asking price for the silentblocs alone are about 10 Euro each (which I think is a bit of a rip-off).


    Cheers
    RTT
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  12. #12
    Fellow Frogger! Shoji's Avatar
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    I bought the silent blocks off Ebay for nicks. There is still a bit of stuff that crops up on Ebay, even in Australia. It doesn't help that I'm a shopaholic.
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  13. #13
    1000+ Posts REN TIN TIN's Avatar
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    Well I pulled the linkage off on the weekend and maybe it was a bent a bit more than previously thought.
    R12 gear linkage-img_0181.jpg
    It didn't look so bad when it was hanging under the car and it sure was enough to stuff up the gear change. Now relatively straight, perhaps could have gone a couple of degrees more but was getting very hard to bend at this stage.
    The gear changing is much better.

    R12 gear linkage-img_0182.jpg

    I really didn't think a bit of a kink would have made that much difference but it sure did.

    Cheers
    RTT
    Last edited by REN TIN TIN; 9th October 2017 at 08:18 AM.
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    Rooting round on the mezzanine last night and found one.

    Its yours if you don't wanna bend the old one. Even got an entire gear shift assembly somewhere too if you can't live with the old one.

    It'll cost you postage.
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Exfrogger View Post
    Rooting round on the mezzanine last night and found one. Its yours if you don't wanna bend the old one. Even got an entire gear shift assembly somewhere too if you can't live with the old one. It'll cost you postage.
    Your mezzanine sounds really interesting....
    JohnW

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  16. #16
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    You have no idea...
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  17. #17
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    In fact neither do I.
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  18. #18
    1000+ Posts REN TIN TIN's Avatar
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    AAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHH HHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    The bloody thing has done it again.
    Not even 6 months and the silentbloc let go again and another ride on the back of the tilt-tray.
    Only one side this time and the arm didn't completely separate so it didn't get bent again.
    But I still couldn't select gears properly or at all sometimes so couldn't chance driving home in peakhour traffic.

    I got some silentbolcs from French Car Care who still had them in stock and it was cheaper, including postage, then getting them through ebay (and quicker).

    I don't know why Renault didn't just keep the original design straight-through link without these rubber monstrosities that regularly fail. I suppose the silentblocs insulate the gear lever from some of the vibrations of the motor/gearbox. When they fail the gear lever is completely insulated from the gearbox.

    I think I'll just do away with the rubber and bolt the two halves of the selector shaft together. The gear lever might shake more but I won't use up my annual quota of free tows with RACQ.

    Cheers
    RTT
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  19. #19
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    I found with Pieces d'origine parts, the blocks lasted circa 160K km. Repro stuff is of questionable quality in a lot of cases. When replacing them again, place a couple of stout zip ties around the steel. This will give the rubber some sort of support, and will likely give some warning when the shift becomes imprecise before the car becomes immobile.

    Bolting the two halves together will make the car more prone to jumping out of gear over rough surfaces, especially if the engine and gearbox mounts are soft.
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  20. #20
    COL
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    Quote Originally Posted by REN TIN TIN View Post
    AAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHH HHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    The bloody thing has done it again.
    Not even 6 months and the silentbloc let go again and another ride on the back of the tilt-tray.
    Only one side this time and the arm didn't completely separate so it didn't get bent again.
    But I still couldn't select gears properly or at all sometimes so couldn't chance driving home in peakhour traffic.

    I got some silentbolcs from French Car Care who still had them in stock and it was cheaper, including postage, then getting them through ebay (and quicker).

    I don't know why Renault didn't just keep the original design straight-through link without these rubber monstrosities that regularly fail. I suppose the silentblocs insulate the gear lever from some of the vibrations of the motor/gearbox. When they fail the gear lever is completely insulated from the gearbox.

    I think I'll just do away with the rubber and bolt the two halves of the selector shaft together. The gear lever might shake more but I won't use up my annual quota of free tows with RACQ.

    Cheers
    RTT
    I'm not sure why you are breaking these, I have had R12's for over 30 years and have never broken one.

    On my R12 I have done away with the "silent blocks" by cutting through the tube that is welded to each. I have then from memory tapped a 10mm thread into the tube, then cut a piece of 10mm all thread of appropriate length and a couple of lock nuts to lock it up.

    I did this to get rid of the rubbery feel of the gear change and also as a bonus the reach to the gear stick is adjustable.

    My gear stick does not vibrate any more noticeably than it did before the modification.
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    Regards Col

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  21. #21
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    That's odd, we never broke one on either of our R12s over quite a few years. I've never broken one in 45 years of R8 ownership, although I've replaced them once or twice as a precaution.

    Is everything lined up correctly? Maybe something is stressing them too much?

    Personally, I'd go for replacement plus cable tie reinforcement. Maybe there's a market for 59Floride to capture here with the right grade of rubber compound?
    JohnW

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  22. #22
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    I'm pretty sure I replaced the rubber with two steel bushes and through bolts and don't remember having any issues.


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  23. #23
    1000+ Posts schlitzaugen's Avatar
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    Another permanent mod I considered was replacing the two square silentblocs with round bushings similar to grommets. You need to enlarge the holes in one of the control rod plates so the "grommet" sits in the hole and put a steel tube through the hole and a big washer behind the "grommet". A bolt and nut through the centre would keep the lot together. You can find poly bushes like that made for other purposes that will fit.

    Col, did you mean "the tube welded to each plate"?
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    COL
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    Quote Originally Posted by schlitzaugen View Post

    Col, did you mean "the tube welded to each plate"?
    Affirmative
    Regards Col

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    Quote Originally Posted by 59 Floride View Post
    There's a brand new one of those on ebay fr, I'll see if I can find it for you. (humblest apologies to the apostrophe police if I got it wrong)
    That apostrophe is correct, a diminutive of 'there is'. My frustration is with things like "a fox has two eye's". Plurals do not need apostrophes, as many fruit and veg places don't seem to understand. "Carrot's" is one horrible example that comes to mind, painfully. I know I'm a sad case.....
    JohnW

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