Identity Crisis - can Renault bods help?
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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! Mort Subite's Avatar
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    Default Identity Crisis - can Renault bods help?

    I have a picture of what I am pretty sure is a Renault.
    It has been modified from the original rolling stock - obviously.
    I was wondering if any one could tell from the image what model designation and approx years of production it may be? I know the photo was taken during the 1915-1922 period. Sorry the clarity isnt better.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mort Subite
    I have a picture of what I am pretty sure is a Renault.
    It has been modified from the original rolling stock - obviously.
    I was wondering if any one could tell from the image what model designation and approx years of production it may be? I know the photo was taken during the 1915-1922 period. Sorry the clarity isnt better.

    Judging by the brick shithouse appearance I wouldn't rule out the possiblility of it being a Volvo


  3. #3
    Fellow Frogger! Mort Subite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by graham66
    Judging by the brick shithouse appearance
    I'm sure I should be offended by that....
    Quote Originally Posted by graham66
    I wouldn't rule out the possibility of it being a Volvo
    The company that ran this fleet was exclusively Renualt/Berliet for many years. They switched to American dodge/olds/chev vehicles in the 30's and stayed with the yanks until the last of the enormous Dodge/Chryslers of 1968/9. Then switched to Benz products and currently run anon GMH/Ford (yawn) units.

  4. #4
    farmerdave
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    The dash mounted radiator and coal scuttle bonnet strongly suggest pre '20 Renault, definitely pre '28.

  5. #5
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mort Subite
    I have a picture of what I am pretty sure is a Renault.
    It has been modified from the original rolling stock - obviously.
    I was wondering if any one could tell from the image what model designation and approx years of production it may be? I know the photo was taken during the 1915-1922 period. Sorry the clarity isnt better.
    Well it's hard to be exact. Judging from what I have in books, it is probably post-1910 and pre-mid-1920s. There's a range of 4 and 6 cylinder cars with broadly the appearance of your photo, but the bonnet looks long enough to be one of the 6-cylinder ones. Of course it's a hearse, which might lean towards the larger cars too.

    It looks very similar to a 40CV of 1912 but I think those models didn't change much for quite a few years, partly because of WW1 and partly because Louis was quite conservative. If the photo was around 1915 or a bit later, it probably is a pre-war import, so the 40CV might be a fair guess.

    By the early 1920s the headlamps were getting smaller, even though the style hadn't changed much.

    Hard for me to do much better. Hope that helps. It's a classic early alligator bonnet Renault, that's for sure. Lovely.

    JohnW

  6. #6
    Fellow Frogger! Mort Subite's Avatar
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    Thanks for that lead JohnW.
    I will do some research on period 40CV's in/from Sydney and see what comes up.....

    Indeed its a hearse, and the photo is taken in the cemetery I work at.
    Infact not much other than the model of hearses have changed......

  7. #7
    Fellow Frogger! Mort Subite's Avatar
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    looks like its a circa 1912 40CV (can't find much on these 40CV's) - the shape of the 40CV 'queen of the road' is modified in the early 20's (there is loads of stuff onthese ones) .

    Do you think im right? Does anyone have a book or knowe of an online reference that may show a 1912 40CV in a bigger image?
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  8. #8
    Good Sport danielsydney's Avatar
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    Looks to me to be a nervastella but im not sure, they were very nice indeed...

  9. #9
    Fellow Frogger! Paul Smith's Avatar
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    Hi Mort,

    It doesn't appear to have front wheel brakes - that makes it before 1922 (according to Georgano). He also says the 40cv actually started being called that in 1921. It had a 9.1 L six, cast in threes, fixed cylinder heads, wood wheels and a choice of two wheelbases, (12ft 6in & 13ft 1in). And the radiator capacity was a mere 12 gallons! It was supposed to do 90mph .

    Also in 1922 the dashboard radiator was, 'merged into the body line'. So definitely pre 1922!

    In 1914 the bigger Renaults were a 5.1 and 8.5 L fours, plus 5.1 and 7.5 L sixes. At the rear they had a transverse helper spring, and all had electric lighting. So if the lights are not electric it could be before 1914.

    The 7.5L six was also apparently rated at 40cv, replacing the 50cv from 1907.

    The first attached image is a 1907 XB, and the 2nd a 1914 Shooting Brake. Note the different lights.

    Paul
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  10. #10
    Fellow Frogger! Mort Subite's Avatar
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    Good show Mr Smith,

    Though it seems to have a more rounded front wheel arch than shown on the shooting break (but I suspect that just may be the whim of the coach builder at the time).
    I have a much sharper image of a mourning car following it and the headlights on that one are more of the early 1907 porthole shaped things not the conical tapering style.(cant post for others to see coz it has copyright issues at the moment) I think we have a 'shooting break' era hearse.

  11. #11
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mort Subite
    Good show Mr Smith,

    Though it seems to have a more rounded front wheel arch than shown on the shooting break (but I suspect that just may be the whim of the coach builder at the time).
    I have a much sharper image of a mourning car following it and the headlights on that one are more of the early 1907 porthole shaped things not the conical tapering style.(cant post for others to see coz it has copyright issues at the moment) I think we have a 'shooting break' era hearse.
    Good snooping guys!! Pity we can't distinguish the shape of the badge on the front. I'm pretty sure it's pre WW1 from these clues. There are some of these large early Renaults in Australia - used to be anyway - I clearly remember a monster blue one in Adelaide which might be the same.

    Cheers

    JohnW

  12. #12
    Fellow Frogger! Mort Subite's Avatar
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    Update for those interested.
    I think it may be a:

    Big45 (6 cyl)

    Type JK (4cyl)

    or

    Type JY (6 cyl)

    All quite usual motors in the 20's but now all seem to have vanished! Well in Sydney anyway.
    Last edited by Mort Subite; 16th June 2004 at 05:55 PM.

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