R8G clutch noise.
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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! Paul T's Avatar
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    Default R8G clutch noise.

    Today I took the R8G on its first real outing. We attend the 1st Central West Life Line Soar Ride and Shine air show which included a car and bike show.
    The G has started to make a strange noise which appears to be coming from the clutch and when attempting to find first gear from a stopped position it feels like I'm pushing the gear stick against a rubber wall and can't find any gear. It does it to a smaller effect at times while driving however if I double clutch it slides in and out of gear nicely. This appears to be worse as it warms up. Any ideas?
    Thanks.

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    R8G clutch noise.-dsc_5287.jpg

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    PO John Kitchen re-united with the G.
    Last edited by Paul T; 15th May 2016 at 08:41 PM. Reason: Added photo.

    Paul Tomlinson
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  2. #2
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    Check clutch adjustment? Do you have enough free travel at the actuating fork where the cable pulls it?

    Could you select reverse or were the gears grinding steadily?

    I just love the shade of blue you've used.
    JohnW

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  3. #3
    Fellow Frogger! Paul T's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnW View Post
    Check clutch adjustment? Do you have enough free travel at the actuating fork where the cable pulls it?

    Could you select reverse or were the gears grinding steadily?

    I just love the shade of blue you've used.
    Hi John,
    It has a few mm of free play. Not really sure about reverse. There is no grinding of gears just a noise when I let the clutch out and as it warms it will make the noise (albeit a bit quieter) when the clutch is depressed. Gears are easy to select when it is cold.

    Thanks, I like the colour also.

    Paul Tomlinson
    R1135 Gordini 1968.
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  4. #4
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    Hmm. Graphite or needle roller thrust?

    What oil are you using? I've just changed from a multigrade (frowned upon with a history of wearing out synchro rings) to a Redline fully synthetic high impact oil (bright blue!).

    They can be quite rubbery with a strong baulking feel to the synchromesh.

    I can't offer more comments really - "a few mm" is what I use too.

    Better wait for the real experts to chime in. Good luck.
    JohnW

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  5. #5
    Fellow Frogger! Paul T's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnW View Post
    Hmm. Graphite or needle roller thrust?

    What oil are you using? I've just changed from a multigrade (frowned upon with a history of wearing out synchro rings) to a Redline fully synthetic high impact oil (bright blue!).

    They can be quite rubbery with a strong baulking feel to the synchromesh.



    I can't offer more comments really - "a few mm" is what I use too.

    Better wait for the real experts to chime in. Good luck.
    I think its is a graphite bearing but not sure now I think about it. I believe the graphite bearings are supposed to be soaked in oil prior to installing.

    Paul Tomlinson
    R1135 Gordini 1968.
    Jaguar XJ-C V12 1975.
    Alpine GTA- ATMO 1987.
    Jaguar X Type 2002.

  6. #6
    1000+ Posts robmac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul T View Post
    I think its is a graphite bearing but not sure now I think about it. I believe the graphite bearings are supposed to be soaked in oil prior to installing.
    The 203 and 403 have carbon thrust races. They have an oiler tube which the manufacturer suggests to supply with a few drops of oil every thousand or so (miles).

    I wouldn't soak the thrust in oil. Just make provision to apply a few drops of oil every so often.

  7. #7
    Simon's Avatar
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    Any pics of the components used? I'd say it is very unlikely to be a carbon thrust, unless NOS parts were used, the usual (and normally much better) replacement is a roller thrust that bears on the triangular thrust pad on the pressure plate. The Renault carbon thrust bearings are installed as they come out of the box, without needing to be soaked.

    Could it be an occasionally sticky clutch plate? Binding on the splines when it gets hot? Or a sticky input shaft bush (never heard that happen though)?
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  8. #8
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simon View Post
    Any pics of the components used? I'd say it is very unlikely to be a carbon thrust, unless NOS parts were used, the usual (and normally much better) replacement is a roller thrust that bears on the triangular thrust pad on the pressure plate. The Renault carbon thrust bearings are installed as they come out of the box, without needing to be soaked.

    Could it be an occasionally sticky clutch plate? Binding on the splines when it gets hot? Or a sticky input shaft bush (never heard that happen though)?
    Agreed. Odd, isn't it?
    JohnW

    Renault 4CV 1951
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  9. #9
    1000+ Posts geckoeng's Avatar
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    Paul is it a new Meca Parts pressure plate ?????
    Ray geckoeng

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  10. #10
    Fellow Frogger! Paul T's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by geckoeng View Post
    Paul is it a new Meca Parts pressure plate ?????
    Yes, it is a new Meca Parts pressure plate and clutch. I bought it as a kit as I could not get my old one repaired.
    It came with a new bearing and I had a new spare carbon one. I used the Thrust bearing that came with the kit which is the Meca parts Graphite MP1525.

    I was wondering if the rubber blocks connecting the selector arm to the gear box might be defective making it hard to select gears. I will put it on the hoist tomorrow and start looking at what it might be.

    The car has now traveled about 35 miles.

    Thanks everyone for your input. Just hoping I don't have to remove the engine!
    Last edited by Paul T; 16th May 2016 at 11:21 AM.

    Paul Tomlinson
    R1135 Gordini 1968.
    Jaguar XJ-C V12 1975.
    Alpine GTA- ATMO 1987.
    Jaguar X Type 2002.

  11. #11
    1000+ Posts driven's Avatar
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    Had issue with clutch pressure bolt stretch on my R8 many years ago.
    They were tiny bolts so assume same on on R8G
    Drove like a dog.
    I always use new bolts when changing the pressure plate

  12. #12
    Fellow Frogger! Paul T's Avatar
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    Simon,
    I was thinking of a sticking clutch plate as well as the noise it omits is not the normal squeal you sometime get from a clutch. The noise is there with every operation of the clutch it is just selecting gears that gets difficult as it warms up.

    The bearing I used came with the clutch kit from Meca Parts. It shows as MP1525 Graphite on the Meca parts site.

    Paul Tomlinson
    R1135 Gordini 1968.
    Jaguar XJ-C V12 1975.
    Alpine GTA- ATMO 1987.
    Jaguar X Type 2002.

  13. #13
    1000+ Posts alan moore's Avatar
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    My father in law has an R8G that I chased the parts for in its restoration. I bought the Meca parts clutch, but got the "new" bronze type thrust bearing. This always made noise whilst the clutch was disengaged (pushed in)and after a few moths broke the fingers holding the centre pad on the pressure plate, causing much damage. It seemed to have too much friction with the surface of the pad.
    This was rectified by making it up as a standard style clutch, with ball race thrust, pushing on the main pressure plate fingers. All has been well for 18 months or so, in a car that is regularly used, with occasional track days.
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  14. #14
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    If you have to pull it apart ,im thinking it would be easier ,and less likely to damage your engine bay paint to drop the gearbox out ,on your hoist ,or the complete running gear out the bottom ,pugs

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    Hi Paul,
    Have you thought about the clutch spigot bush in the end of the crankshaft?. if it has not been pre lubed before fitment being a bronze bush it could groaning a little when speed difference between flywheel and input shaft occurs.just a thought, jim

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    Quote Originally Posted by dacia4x4 View Post
    Hi Paul,
    Have you thought about the clutch spigot bush in the end of the crankshaft?. if it has not been pre lubed before fitment being a bronze bush it could groaning a little when speed difference between flywheel and input shaft occurs.just a thought, jim
    Just replaced the one on the R17TS. It is a bearing on 800 series engines, but mine was very rough and noisy.

  17. #17
    Fellow Frogger! Paul T's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dacia4x4 View Post
    Hi Paul,
    Have you thought about the clutch spigot bush in the end of the crankshaft?. if it has not been pre lubed before fitment being a bronze bush it could groaning a little when speed difference between flywheel and input shaft occurs.just a thought, jim
    Jim,
    I think you could be on to something. Can't remember now if I did or didn't put a little grease on the bush or not.

    I have just had the car on the hoist and looking at the 2 rubber blocks joining the selector arm to the gearbox I decided to replace them with 2 brand new ones I have. When I removed the old ones they were taller than the new ones and therefore softer. After I replaced them and took the car for a good drive every gear change was more direct even when things warmed up. So I think I have cured the selector problem. Now to work on that horrid noise.
    R8G clutch noise.-dsc_5324.jpg
    I have fitted the smaller size selector block. BTW, the ones in the photo are both used, I replaced them with 2 x new ones. Just wanted to show the size difference.

    Paul Tomlinson
    R1135 Gordini 1968.
    Jaguar XJ-C V12 1975.
    Alpine GTA- ATMO 1987.
    Jaguar X Type 2002.

  18. #18
    1000+ Posts renault8&10's Avatar
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    re rubber blocks - I seem to recall that all we could get for a while were R12 ones locally. Perhaps that is where the difference was?
    KB


  19. #19
    1000+ Posts renault8&10's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul T View Post
    Jim,
    I think you could be on to something. Can't remember now if I did or didn't put a little grease on the bush or not.

    I have just had the car on the hoist and looking at the 2 rubber blocks joining the selector arm to the gearbox I decided to replace them with 2 brand new ones I have. When I removed the old ones they were taller than the new ones and therefore softer. After I replaced them and took the car for a good drive every gear change was more direct even when things warmed up. So I think I have cured the selector problem. Now to work on that horrid noise.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    I have fitted the smaller size selector block. BTW, the ones in the photo are both used, I replaced them with 2 x new ones. Just wanted to show the size difference.
    For later reference, can you quote the two respective heights and how they are measured - ie end to end on bolts or just the height of the "rubber block"

    KB
    KB


  20. #20
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by renault8&10 View Post
    re rubber blocks - I seem to recall that all we could get for a while were R12 ones locally. Perhaps that is where the difference was?
    Yup, that sounds right to me. As does the spigot bush suggestion.
    JohnW

    Renault 4CV 1951
    Renault R8 1965
    Renault Scenic 2005 (wife's)
    Renault Scenic 2007 (mine)
    Renault Scenic 2006 (daughter's)
    CitroŽn CX Pallas 1980

    National Co-ordinator, Renault 4CV Register of Australia

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