Dauphine Aerostable Rubber Pillows
  • Register
  • Help
Results 1 to 22 of 22
Like Tree2Likes
  • 1 Post By JohnW
  • 1 Post By 4cvg

Thread: Dauphine Aerostable Rubber Pillows

  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! geodon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Geelong
    Posts
    511

    Default Dauphine Aerostable Rubber Pillows

    Errm, are these more than a glorified pneumatic bump stop?

    With a coil & a shocker doing most of the work, these only come into play with a severe bump which obviously they would make less severe. Have I got it right?

    Are they serviceable?

    Advertisement
    "Pauses for audience applause......not a sausage!"....Bluebottle

    1949 Citroen Big 6
    1955 MGA1500
    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility (Resto project)
    1962 Renault Dauphine Gordini (Resto project)
    1950 Grey Fergie Tractor

  2. #2
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Perth, WA, Australia
    Posts
    10,763

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by geodon View Post
    Errm, are these more than a glorified pneumatic bump stop?

    With a coil & a shocker doing most of the work, these only come into play with a severe bump which obviously they would make less severe. Have I got it right?

    Are they serviceable?
    Well, yes put crudely, but they are a bit more than that, as they did ensure a progressive compression rate in parallel with the uniform rate of the steel spring. I presume the accompanying steel springs were a tad softer than pre-Aerostable ones. I also doubt they are serviceable from what I remember of them. Simple but made the ride more sophisticated.

    Cheers
    JohnW

    Renault 4CV 1951
    Renault R8 1965
    Renault Scenic 2005 (wife's)
    Renault Scenic 2007 (mine)
    Renault Scenic 2006 (daughter's)
    CitroŽn CX Pallas 1980

    National Co-ordinator, Renault 4CV Register of Australia

  3. #3
    1000+ Posts
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    rosevale/tasmania
    Posts
    2,745

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnW View Post
    Well, yes put crudely, but they are a bit more than that, as they did ensure a progressive compression rate in parallel with the uniform rate of the steel spring. I presume the accompanying steel springs were a tad softer than pre-Aerostable ones. I also doubt they are serviceable from what I remember of them. Simple but made the ride more sophisticated.

    Cheers
    Yes, the aerostable model coil springs were softer, so compressed more easily & then the supplementary aerostable air springs came into play increasing the rate progressively as the gas compressed. Some of the more sophisticated rubber bump stops function in a similar way & are doing more than simply stopping metal from hitting metal.
    cheers! Peter

  4. #4
    Fellow Frogger! geodon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Geelong
    Posts
    511

    Default

    Actually, as a driver of old Beetles for many years, I should have realized that they would lessen the risk of the nastiest feature of swing axles viz. the Dreaded Rear Wheel Tuck-In when hitting a bump. Before double jointed rear axles Beetles were prone to falling over when going around a corner hard, hitting a bump, the back wheel goes up & tucks in & when it came down if you were lucky it spun out & if unlucky, it flipped.
    "Pauses for audience applause......not a sausage!"....Bluebottle

    1949 Citroen Big 6
    1955 MGA1500
    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility (Resto project)
    1962 Renault Dauphine Gordini (Resto project)
    1950 Grey Fergie Tractor

  5. #5
    1000+ Posts
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    rosevale/tasmania
    Posts
    2,745

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by geodon View Post
    Actually, as a driver of old Beetles for many years, I should have realized that they would lessen the risk of the nastiest feature of swing axles viz. the Dreaded Rear Wheel Tuck-In when hitting a bump. Before double jointed rear axles Beetles were prone to falling over when going around a corner hard, hitting a bump, the back wheel goes up & tucks in & when it came down if you were lucky it spun out & if unlucky, it flipped.
    That's not really quite correct but saying why will have to wait for later (it's late).
    cheers! Peter

  6. #6
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Perth, WA, Australia
    Posts
    10,763

    Default

    Not exactly - the VW started with a bit of positive camber, like the very earliest of Renault 4CVs, and didn't locate the swing axle too well with respect to downward travel. Our R8 has hefty straps to limit the amount of positive camber it can generate. No doubt there's a further argument about roll centres and things.
    geodon likes this.
    JohnW

    Renault 4CV 1951
    Renault R8 1965
    Renault Scenic 2005 (wife's)
    Renault Scenic 2007 (mine)
    Renault Scenic 2006 (daughter's)
    CitroŽn CX Pallas 1980

    National Co-ordinator, Renault 4CV Register of Australia

  7. #7
    Fellow Frogger! geodon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Geelong
    Posts
    511

    Default

    Well said JohnW!

    There was a thriving aftermarket in early Beetles for Camber Compensators.

    They bolted to the transmission housing & linked the swing axles via a springy leaf.
    "Pauses for audience applause......not a sausage!"....Bluebottle

    1949 Citroen Big 6
    1955 MGA1500
    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility (Resto project)
    1962 Renault Dauphine Gordini (Resto project)
    1950 Grey Fergie Tractor

  8. #8
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Perth, WA, Australia
    Posts
    10,763

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by geodon View Post
    Well said JohnW!

    There was a thriving aftermarket in early Beetles for Camber Compensators.

    They bolted to the transmission housing & linked the swing axles via a springy leaf.
    I well recall in the mid-1960s a school friend of mine had a 1956 (small window) VW with wide wheels (slightly...) and Pirelli Cinturatos, twin carbs (burn exhaust valves...) and later the camber compensator, which was pretty effective. He also had more money than I could dream of.

    Actually, I reckon a late small window VW would be a great car to own now. They retain much more of the art deco style than the later ones and are charming and robust.
    JohnW

    Renault 4CV 1951
    Renault R8 1965
    Renault Scenic 2005 (wife's)
    Renault Scenic 2007 (mine)
    Renault Scenic 2006 (daughter's)
    CitroŽn CX Pallas 1980

    National Co-ordinator, Renault 4CV Register of Australia

  9. #9
    1000+ Posts Kim Luck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Melbourne, Aus.
    Posts
    17,957

    Default

    I and a mate met a guy in the Tallangatta pub back in about 1963 when we went for a drive in the mates 56 VW from Wagga Wagga. The guy we met said he owned a VW, it was his eighth, and declared he wouldn't own anything else. We asked what was so special about them that he should have owned so many. He replied: "They handle like a Spitfire in the air!"
    Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got 'til it's gone............

  10. #10
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Perth, WA, Australia
    Posts
    10,763

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kim Luck View Post
    I and a mate met a guy in the Tallangatta pub back in about 1963 when we went for a drive in the mates 56 VW from Wagga Wagga. The guy we met said he owned a VW, it was his eighth, and declared he wouldn't own anything else. We asked what was so special about them that he should have owned so many. He replied: "They handle like a Spitfire in the air!"
    And it was his 8th..... Did he come from Tallangatta?
    JohnW

    Renault 4CV 1951
    Renault R8 1965
    Renault Scenic 2005 (wife's)
    Renault Scenic 2007 (mine)
    Renault Scenic 2006 (daughter's)
    CitroŽn CX Pallas 1980

    National Co-ordinator, Renault 4CV Register of Australia

  11. #11
    1000+ Posts Kim Luck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Melbourne, Aus.
    Posts
    17,957

    Default

    I'm sure he was a local!
    Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got 'til it's gone............

  12. #12
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Perth, WA, Australia
    Posts
    10,763

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kim Luck View Post
    I'm sure he was a local!
    Thought so......
    JohnW

    Renault 4CV 1951
    Renault R8 1965
    Renault Scenic 2005 (wife's)
    Renault Scenic 2007 (mine)
    Renault Scenic 2006 (daughter's)
    CitroŽn CX Pallas 1980

    National Co-ordinator, Renault 4CV Register of Australia

  13. #13
    1000+ Posts
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    rosevale/tasmania
    Posts
    2,745

    Default

    [QUOTE
    =geodon
    Actually, as a driver of old Beetles for many years, I should have realized that they would lessen the risk of the nastiest feature of swing axles viz. the Dreaded Rear Wheel Tuck-In when hitting a bump. Before double jointed rear axles Beetles were prone to falling over when going around a corner hard, hitting a bump, the back wheel goes up & tucks in & when it came down if you were lucky it spun out & if unlucky, it flipped.

    =4cvg
    That's not really quite correct but saying why will have to wait for later (it's late).
    cheers! Peter[/QUOTE]

    ok, it's later:

    I can't see how the aero sacks would be part of any causal story concerning tuck-under reduction in & of themselves. The rears of these models did have softer coil spring rates & that would mean a lessor proportion of the car's roll resistance to weight transfer being at the rear end & more at the front compared to a non aero model with stiffer springs. Other things being equal, a relatively softer rear end would thus assist in reducing tuck-under. If there's a benefit, it's due to softer rear mains, not the aerostable pads.

    But other things are possibly not equal.

    Importantly, the rear springs on the aerostable Dauphine Normale are longer than those of a non-aero Normale. Perhaps they compress to the same length (they're softer) but if not, that comfort has been bought with a shift closer to the tuck-under encouraging positive end of the camber spectrum. (It's notable that the aerostable Dauphine Gordini has stiffer, shorter coils &, I'd surmise, would occupy a place closer to the negative end of the camber spectrum than the Normale.) The other thing that might be a difference is that, to preserve the front-rear roll stiffness balance of the previous, non-aero, Dauphine, the front springs might be softer as well (my memory is that this was so & that the rubber bump stops were modified to carry out something of the same increasing-spring-rate role as the aero sacks). If so, then there would not be the tuck-under reducing merit of relatively softer rears having less roll resistance because the fronts would be changed too.

    Some of the premises or the above analysis are possibly false (I can't recall the details of Dauphine variants' specifications - someone else - Simon? - might offer relevant data).

    Camber compensators are, in my view, a good thing. If anyone wishes a copy of a technical article on them which I wrote for car club magazines, then PM me.

    cheers! Peter
    geodon likes this.

  14. #14
    1000+ Posts
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Perth, Western Australia
    Posts
    6,248

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kim Luck View Post
    I and a mate met a guy in the Tallangatta pub back in about 1963 when we went for a drive in the mates 56 VW from Wagga Wagga. The guy we met said he owned a VW, it was his eighth, and declared he wouldn't own anything else. We asked what was so special about them that he should have owned so many. He replied: "They handle like a Spitfire in the air!"
    We all say strange things after our eighth drink.


    2003 PEUGEOT 206 GTi

  15. #15
    1000+ Posts Kim Luck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Melbourne, Aus.
    Posts
    17,957

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Stuey View Post
    We all say strange things after our eighth drink.
    Well done Stuey! Bad grammar on my part! I was attempting to refer to the number of cars he'd had.


    For anyone that ever had a drink there back then, the five ounce glass was very fashionable and the locals could put them away all day at an amazing rate.....
    Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got 'til it's gone............

  16. #16
    1000+ Posts
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Perth, Western Australia
    Posts
    6,248

    Default

    Actually Kim there was nothing wrong with your grammar, it was just me trying to be funny. It does read like it was his eighth VW!

    Ahhhh, six volt headlights. Luckily, they were slow enough so the lights weren't quite dangerous!


    2003 PEUGEOT 206 GTi

  17. #17
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Perth, WA, Australia
    Posts
    10,763

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Stuey View Post
    Actually Kim there was nothing wrong with your grammar, it was just me trying to be funny. It does read like it was his eighth VW!

    Ahhhh, six volt headlights. Luckily, they were slow enough so the lights weren't quite dangerous!
    Missed you at the FCD Stuey. It was a bit moist mind you.

    VWs were terrible in the headlamp department. The equivalent Renaults were much better. And now, if you fit QI bulbs to the 4CV or Dauphine standard Cibie headlamps, and make sure you get a whole 6V to them (relays), the lights are actually quite good. Much better optics and no thick, oblique lamp glass. Mind you, if you drove your VW at the speed appropriate to the headlamps, you'd never roll it!
    JohnW

    Renault 4CV 1951
    Renault R8 1965
    Renault Scenic 2005 (wife's)
    Renault Scenic 2007 (mine)
    Renault Scenic 2006 (daughter's)
    CitroŽn CX Pallas 1980

    National Co-ordinator, Renault 4CV Register of Australia

  18. #18
    1000+ Posts Kim Luck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Melbourne, Aus.
    Posts
    17,957

    Default

    The mate, Dave, cruised his beetle at pretty close to flat out, about 60 mph. At night, the headlights emitted a feeble half beam (couldn't really call it a beam) of a dim yellow light. Dave acquired at some huge cost a Lucas "Flamethrower" driving lamp which he mounted on top of the rhs bumper over-rider. When suitably wired up, we headed for the beach at Wagga on a dark (but not stormy) night to test this magnificent piece of luminosity out. With no alterations to the vehicles wiring we were perplexed when we discovered that the total light output appeared to have no significant or discernable difference between;

    1/. Headlights on high beam
    2/. The Lucas Flamethrower on it's own
    3/. All of the above on

    Apparently the available light output was governed by the 6V battery and the vehicle wiring. So when he drove at night, Dave used the single spotlight, to make himself feel better about it all.
    Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got 'til it's gone............

  19. #19
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Perth, WA, Australia
    Posts
    10,763

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kim Luck View Post
    The mate, Dave, cruised his beetle at pretty close to flat out, about 60 mph. At night, the headlights emitted a feeble half beam (couldn't really call it a beam) of a dim yellow light. Dave acquired at some huge cost a Lucas "Flamethrower" driving lamp which he mounted on top of the rhs bumper over-rider. When suitably wired up, we headed for the beach at Wagga on a dark (but not stormy) night to test this magnificent piece of luminosity out. With no alterations to the vehicles wiring we were perplexed when we discovered that the total light output appeared to have no significant or discernable difference between;

    1/. Headlights on high beam
    2/. The Lucas Flamethrower on it's own
    3/. All of the above on

    Apparently the available light output was governed by the 6V battery and the vehicle wiring. So when he drove at night, Dave used the single spotlight, to make himself feel better about it all.
    I've been there. In 1972, living in Mount Gambier with a 750, we had a top end Bosch foglamp with a 6V QI bulb. The generator had a maximum output of 30 amps (it still has and hasn't been touched since then, apart from oiling the bush at one end). The car could handle either the headlamps or the fog lamp, but not both. AT Mount Gambier in winter, the fog lamp often won the argument! If we used both, the battery would discharge as the headlamps plus foglamp needed more than 30 amps. If you have good earths etc, you can run both for many hours, but only if you have good enough wires to all lamps, rather than having the foglamp just added to a circuit that can't handle the current without voltage drop.

    Ah, the joys. I wouldn't swap today for then...
    JohnW

    Renault 4CV 1951
    Renault R8 1965
    Renault Scenic 2005 (wife's)
    Renault Scenic 2007 (mine)
    Renault Scenic 2006 (daughter's)
    CitroŽn CX Pallas 1980

    National Co-ordinator, Renault 4CV Register of Australia

  20. #20
    1000+ Posts
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Boonah Qld
    Posts
    2,525

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnW View Post
    .

    Ah, the joys. I wouldn't swap today for then...
    May be John if you knew what you know now. Well I think I might. Rob

  21. #21
    1000+ Posts
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Perth, Western Australia
    Posts
    6,248

    Default

    Hi John, yes the FCD was too moist for me...


    2003 PEUGEOT 206 GTi

  22. #22
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Perth, WA, Australia
    Posts
    10,763

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Sunroof View Post
    May be John if you knew what you know now. Well I think I might. Rob
    Point taken Rob. Alex wouldn't, in this particular regard anyway, driving the 750 at Mount Gambier in winter before I had found the parts for the heater (18 years later)!!
    JohnW

    Renault 4CV 1951
    Renault R8 1965
    Renault Scenic 2005 (wife's)
    Renault Scenic 2007 (mine)
    Renault Scenic 2006 (daughter's)
    CitroŽn CX Pallas 1980

    National Co-ordinator, Renault 4CV Register of Australia

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •