R8 copper brake line fitting thread size?
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Thread: R8 copper brake line fitting thread size?

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    Fellow Frogger! forzamacchi's Avatar
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    Default R8 copper brake line fitting thread size?

    Hello all,
    I thought I had purchased the correct size fitting for my R8. I am running all new copper lines and purchased 10mm x 1.0. Turns out this isn't the correct size! Is it truly 3/8" standard size? Thanks, Ben

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    COL
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    Hi Forzamacchi

    I think you will find that the correct thread size is 3/8" UNF 24TPI

    Renault didn't start using the metric sizes until about 1980. You can also tell by the type of flare on the end of the pipe as the metric flares and imperial flares are different.
    Regards Col

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    1000+ Posts geckoeng's Avatar
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    Hi Ben,
    Where did you purchase your copper tubing from ????
    Because if it is not specific for brake lines it is not up to the needs of the brake system, as originally used by Renault and some other continental manufacturers. Just be aware.

    Ray
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    Fellow Frogger! forzamacchi's Avatar
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    Hello Ray..it is for brake lines... its actually good stuff. A local supplier had the 3/8" fittings and all is well. It is a bit claustrophobic under the car just using jacks! I also installed a new master cylinder and brake switch.....

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    I was wondering about the rubber sheaths on the pipes. I have seen pics of other cars, where new pipes have been fitted, but the sheaths were omitted Thoughts?

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    Rubber sheaths were/are used for stone protection damage

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    great... I imagine a small diameter rubber hose will be suffice?

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    Hi Ben.

    I'm very sure that for Australian registration conditions Copper brake tube/lines are a not allowed, but having said that I'm sure the officers doing the registration checks don't get under the cars and go looking for them.
    Unfortunately cooper brake lines tend to work harden and crack so brake lines are now steel to give maximum strength without fracturing.

    You will also find a great improvement with your R8 braking if you swap over the brake pressure limiter valve at the back of the car (underneith next to gearbox) with a 'Tee' piece. Most brake places will know what you mean if you ask them for a 'Tee' Piece for the brake lines.

    Cheers

    phil

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    Hello Phil,
    I have purchased a tee which I will be installing in the rear of the car. The tubing is here 3 16" x 25' Cupro Nickel Brake Line Easy Bend Flare | eBay according to the ad this meets modern US safety regulations...

    In the US we do not have scrutineering like MOT... It is truly the responsibility of the vehicle owner to ensure safety. I am not sure if that is a good or bad thing haha!

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    Fellow Frogger! forzamacchi's Avatar
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    But as for a sheath, can I just use heat shrink as used on wiring?

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    1000+ Posts geckoeng's Avatar
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    Hi Phill,
    I have been a Renault mechanic for over 50 years, and your "copper brake line work hardening" is an Aussie Myth. I have never seen a split or leaking brake line due to fatigue. I have on the other hand seen plenty of corroded and cracked steel brakelines, including the fancy "bundi tube". If it is the correct brake copper tube, it will outlast any other material.

    As for CAMS I have have had cars passed, as the brake line are orriginal equipment, and needed to take it to the Clark of the Course on a few occasions.

    Ray
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    Quote Originally Posted by geckoeng View Post
    Hi Phill,
    I have been a Renault mechanic for over 50 years, and your "copper brake line work hardening" is an Aussie Myth. I have never seen a split or leaking brake line due to fatigue. I have on the other hand seen plenty of corroded and cracked steel brakelines, including the fancy "bundi tube". If it is the correct brake copper tube, it will outlast any other material.

    As for CAMS I have have had cars passed, as the brake line are orriginal equipment, and needed to take it to the Clark of the Course on a few occasions.

    Ray
    I agree. My tandem trailer had copper pipe for 40 years with no trouble. Replaced it with steel just because I thought I should. In the last 10 years I've had to replace the steel twice as it has rusted through. I think the copper steel thing is a myth promoted by the steel industry, and the car manufacturers, as copper was more expensive than steel. My Floride and sons R10 still run copper with no problems. Just make sure it is copper brake pipe and not copper petrol pipe. Two different animals.

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    Fellow Frogger! R8 Dream's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by forzamacchi View Post
    But as for a sheath, can I just use heat shrink as used on wiring?
    Ben
    I used vinyl 1/4 (6mm ID) tube purchased from a hardware store (Masters). Cost something like $1/Metre
    It slipped on nicely. I used steel tubing to replace all my copper tubing which had badly perished.
    Angelo

    Attachment 56900

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    Fellow Frogger! forzamacchi's Avatar
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    Thanks Angelo...that is what I was looking for.... Also, stock installation is a single flare on the piping... Is that recommended or are people now doing a double flare? Ben

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    Quote Originally Posted by R8philSA View Post
    Hi Ben.

    I'm very sure that for Australian registration conditions Copper brake tube/lines are a not allowed, but having said that I'm sure the officers doing the registration checks don't get under the cars and go looking for them.
    Unfortunately cooper brake lines tend to work harden and crack so brake lines are now steel to give maximum strength without fracturing.

    You will also find a great improvement with your R8 braking if you swap over the brake pressure limiter valve at the back of the car (underneith next to gearbox) with a 'Tee' piece. Most brake places will know what you mean if you ask them for a 'Tee' Piece for the brake lines.

    Cheers

    phil
    Hi Phil,
    I did some research on this topic a while back.
    Legality of Cu brake lines ?
    Cheers jaahn

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    Ben, must be a double flare.
    You can buy a tool to do all these easily. Not sure how it will work with copper though, as someone else may know the affect the double flaring will have on the copper - work harden?
    Angelo
    Attachment 56904Attachment 56903

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    1000+ Posts renault8&10's Avatar
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    Where do you guys buy your flaring tools, tubing and fittings?
    I'm pulling out the master cylinder and replacing hoses with braided lines. I suspect I will need to replace some of the solid lines too. The master cylinder is not giving up easily.
    KB


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    Quote Originally Posted by renault8&10 View Post
    Where do you guys buy your flaring tools, tubing and fittings?
    I'm pulling out the master cylinder and replacing hoses with braided lines. I suspect I will need to replace some of the solid lines too. The master cylinder is not giving up easily.
    The flaring tool I got from ebay: Flaring Tool Index Type Heavy Duty Steel Fuel Brake Lines | eBay

    You will also need a decent bending tool also from ebay: Brake Line Tube Bender Roller Style 4 Sizes T70750 | eBay

    use 3/16 steel tube and practice a little. You will be a master in no time.

    angelo

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    1000+ Posts renault8&10's Avatar
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    Thanks Angelo,
    What about the tubing and fittings? where did you get those from; and were they the thread size COL mentions above?
    KB


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    Tubing and end fittings from Super Stop in Surrey Hills, Vic
    you need to make sure the end fittings are the right type.
    if you want me to get them for you, pm me and we can discuss.
    alternatively any good brake place can help, but best take in a sample.
    you will need the 1/4 line for the brake reservoir also.
    Angelo

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    1000+ Posts renault8&10's Avatar
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    Angelo,
    I've got some 3/8 UNF fittings coming from eBay so should be Ok but if I get stuck I'll give you a shout.
    Which is the 1/4 line? I thought they were all 3/16?
    KB


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    Quote Originally Posted by renault8&10 View Post
    Angelo,
    I've got some 3/8 UNF fittings coming from eBay so should be Ok but if I get stuck I'll give you a shout.
    Which is the 1/4 line? I thought they were all 3/16?
    It's the single line running from reservoir to master cylinder. It's easily identified as it's slightly thicker than that standard 3/16 lines going to the wheels ( only need to worry about it you are going to change this as well).
    Be careful as I recall the end fittings may screw in but it's the slightly longer ones you need. Good luck and take your time and you may need a few goes at the first one until you get the hang of it. Angelo

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    Quote Originally Posted by R8philSA View Post

    You will also find a great improvement with your R8 braking if you swap over the brake pressure limiter valve at the back of the car (underneith next to gearbox) with a 'Tee' piece. Most brake places will know what you mean if you ask them for a 'Tee' Piece for the brake lines.
    Will removing the pressure limiter valve at the back really give you better brakes or will it just be easier to lock your rear brakes?

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    1000+ Posts Frans's Avatar
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    R8RX,

    Yes, it will. The weight of the engine and gearbox will help with not locking up. I think 99% of the rear-engined Renaults on AF have T-pieces in.

    Regards, Frans.
    Old enough to know better
    Young enough to do it anyway.

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    I have also found a vast improvement as Frans said. Wet or dry surface it improves braking and also the pedal "feel" which is an advantage in competition driving.

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