4cv Wheels and Tyres
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Thread: 4cv Wheels and Tyres

  1. #1
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    Default 4cv Wheels and Tyres

    Contemplating replacing the original cheesecutters, on my 1958 4cv with wheels from R10S, slightly wider, what would the recommended tyre be for those wheels and also for the car, without doing any damage, appreciate some feedback.
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    1000+ Posts J-man's Avatar
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    G'day Renosprite, if your 4CV is running the 135 michelins, you could increase to the 145 michelins but you'll increase your overall tyre diameter in the process, so slightly taller geared with speedo slightly out too.

    Your car looks so mint original. I'd keep it that way. Just my 2 cents ...
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    cheers,

    John

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    Tks, will have a think about it, thanks for the feedback..

    Quote Originally Posted by J-man View Post
    G'day Renosprite, if your 4CV is running the 135 michelins, you could increase to the 145 michelins but you'll increase your overall tyre diameter in the process, so slightly taller geared with speedo slightly out too.

    Your car looks so mint original. I'd keep it that way. Just my 2 cents ...

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    Hi,

    I also think the original 135s are ok. A friend with a 750 put 145s on and while they were ok on the rear they scraped the inner guard when turning. Something else to consider if changing from the original.

    David

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    Are there any other modifications on the car that warrant an extra amount of rubber on the road? As it looks like a real cutie, and it is always nice to see the contrasting painted wheels. There would also likely be only a minimal, if any, difference in price between the 135 or 145 section tyres.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RENOSPRITE View Post
    Contemplating replacing the original cheesecutters, on my 1958 4cv with wheels from R10S, slightly wider, what would the recommended tyre be for those wheels and also for the car, without doing any damage, appreciate some feedback.
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    I'm not entirely clear what your motivation is.

    Do you just want it to look different?

    If so, you could switch to the 4.5 inch wheels for the slotted grey/silver appearance (or to standard 4" ones for that matter). All a matter of taste & I happen to prefer them to the original wheels but then I don't give a stuff about originality (anyway, it's reversible). Obviously it's all a matter of what you like best.

    Do you want it to handle more crisply or to hold the road better &, if the latter, is wet grip a priority?
    Speaking to these:

    - Handling tautness? Keeping 135 tyres but upping width of rim a bit will pre-tension the sidewalls more & allow crisper translation of rim movement to tread movement. One can, however, achieve much the same effect by upping pressures. In 135, one can have Michelin ZX, a Nankang or, I think, a Firestone (F560?). None of these have a particular crisp structure. Moving up to 145 gives you the XZX instead of the ZX & my memory about them is that that tyre is inherently tauter than the ZX. They will happily fit on your 4" rims as well as on the 4.5.
    With either wheel, but especially the wider ones, they'd be crisper than the 135 options, I think. Not much in it though & probably not worth the effort. There's another option I'll come to shortly.

    Roadholding? In my view, wet roadholding, especially under braking, & the tyres' behaviour at the point of grip loss (do they recover grip tidily?) should be of maximum priority. If you currently have ZX or Nankangs, then you should already realise that they are very poor wet tyres indeed (I gather that the Firestone is dubious too but I have less information about it). The XZX is better than the ZX, but also poor (although Simon has elsewhere hypothesised plausibly that the compound would be different now to when they were a standard offering, none of Michelin's current or past small-tyre offerings are well-compounded for the wet). The heavy siping helps in slick conditions but both ZX & XZX have poor drainage in potential aquaplaning conditions. My advice? None of the above tyres are good wet tyres & a wheel change makes no difference to the options. Again, there's another option I'll come to shortly.

    Does changing the gearing matter much? I don't think so; it's easy to make mental adjustments (both my Djet & my Moke are undergeared owing to smaller O.D. tyres). Anyway there are more important things than that - grip.

    Does inner arch fouling matter much? Yes, but it's easy to adjust the shape of the inner guard to get clearance. (I remember when I bought the Moke new in 1979, the rather chunky 175/80-13 SP44 Dunlops it came on fouled the inner guards. 'Yes', the salesman said when I complained, 'they all do that, it's made for 165s'. Solution? He grabbed a well-used hunk of wood & a club hammer & gave each inner guard a few whacks. It worked fine but wasn't mentioned in their advertising.)

    What would I do? Fit the 4.5" wider rims for appearance's sake & for slightly crisper handling & junk whatever tyres you have now & fit 145/65-15 Continental Ecocontact EP tyres (fronts for the first Smart) for vastly improved handling crispness, wet grip and benign limit behaviour. They are tubeless and you should not fit tubes (it's dangerous).

    The 145/65s have about the same O.D. as a 115/80-15 would have & will lower the gearing by about 5% compared to a 135/80. No big deal I suggest.

    If it's not an urgent decision & you are going to the 4CV muster next year, then I use the 145/65s as spares on 4" R8/10 wheels for my "otherly-wheeled" toys &, whatever I take to the muster (probably the Djet to be a bit different) will have such a spare & you can try one on.

    cheers! Peter
    Last edited by 4cvg; 30th April 2014 at 02:30 AM.

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    Tks everyone for your input, not a priority, but did wonder on a couple of things that Peter has explained, will it clear the guards, and what are advantages if any, apart from it would look good, Simon, I would paint the wheels to contrast with the car for sure, Peter, I am going to the Muster, and I like your suggestion, I would have tried it before buying anyway, as I have a very friendly tyre dealer, that i am sure would help out in this regard, thankyou for suggesting different brands, I have zx Michelin fitted, but they have been on the car for quite some time now. I know to replace them would be expensive, as the prices have gone through the roof in the last couple of years, the last set I purchased for my R10 were $100 each, should have purchased a few extra then.
    Not sure on the prices of 145 will make some enquiries.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RENOSPRITE View Post
    Not sure on the prices of 145 will make some enquiries.
    Longstone tyres in the UK are still doing fairly good deals, although freight is no longer free and our dollar is heading the wrong way.
    I got a set of Michelin 145s for my father in law about a year ago. I think $675 for 4 tyres and 5 michelin tubes landed. Ordered them on a Friday night, arrived the next Wednesday morning to the door.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RENOSPRITE View Post
    Tks everyone for your input, not a priority, but did wonder on a couple of things that Peter has explained, will it clear the guards, and what are advantages if any, apart from it would look good, Simon, I would paint the wheels to contrast with the car for sure, Peter, I am going to the Muster, and I like your suggestion, I would have tried it before buying anyway, as I have a very friendly tyre dealer, that i am sure would help out in this regard, thankyou for suggesting different brands, I have zx Michelin fitted, but they have been on the car for quite some time now. I know to replace them would be expensive, as the prices have gone through the roof in the last couple of years, the last set I purchased for my R10 were $100 each, should have purchased a few extra then.
    Not sure on the prices of 145 will make some enquiries.
    Just one brief comment: probably a good thing that you did not buy extra ZX back then. First, they are an awful tyre & second, they'd be time-expired by now if they were over 10 years old.

    (Actually, our dollar is climbing gently & predicted to appreciate further.)

    See you at the muster then, Peter

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    Quote Originally Posted by alan moore View Post
    I got a set of Michelin 145s for my father in law about a year ago.

    And if Renosprite is using Australian ROK manufacture welded rims, a saving can be made by not needing to buy tubes, just double check the tyres to be bought are tubeless type.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simon View Post
    And if Renosprite is using Australian ROK manufacture welded rims, a saving can be made by not needing to buy tubes, just double check the tyres to be bought are tubeless type.
    Even if they're not the ROH rims, I'd still fit tubeless (much safer). Even the riveted rims seem to hold air if my 3 spares are a good sample & if not, get them sealed rather than using tubes.

    cheers! Peter

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