replacing 504 KF injection with aftermarket? anybody done this yet
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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! leftcoast's Avatar
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    Default replacing 504 KF injection with aftermarket? anybody done this yet

    hello, i am keen/not so keen to replace all to do with the KF injection on my 504, while it is not giving me trouble yet, i would like to look at this option, has any body done this to the 504 lti befor, i feel it would declutter the engine bay a little bit and add a few horses to the car, was thinking a microtech setup with a custom fuel rail/pump.

    but doing this i would like to remove the old pump all together and idears, will start to pull her apart soon

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  2. #2
    1000+ Posts Wildebeest's Avatar
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    Leftcoast,
    A 504 with running KF injection etc is what 504 dreams are made of.
    Leave it as is mate. Don't pull it apart, it will turn out as a rusting 504 in your backyard.

  3. #3
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftcoast View Post
    hello, i am keen/not so keen to replace all to do with the KF injection on my 504, while it is not giving me trouble yet, i would like to look at this option, has any body done this to the 504 lti befor, i feel it would declutter the engine bay a little bit and add a few horses to the car, was thinking a microtech setup with a custom fuel rail/pump.

    but doing this i would like to remove the old pump all together and idears, will start to pull her apart soon
    Key phrase there for me is "not giving me trouble yet.............".

    Why mess with it? You could get organised with some KF bits, which might take a while, so you can recondition it sometimes with the good gear.

    504 dream = KF. I'm with Wildebeeste. Keep using the car (and taking the medicine of course).

    Cheers
    JohnW

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  4. #4
    1000+ Posts Mike Tippett's Avatar
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    Either that or do the conversion and send me all of the KF parts for free.

    1966 Peugeot 404 Coupť Injection post-restoration reassembly underway!
    Register your 404: https://recensement.leclub404.com/submit.php

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftcoast View Post
    hello, i am keen/not so keen to replace all to do with the KF injection on my 504, while it is not giving me trouble yet, i would like to look at this option, has any body done this to the 504 lti befor, i feel it would declutter the engine bay a little bit and add a few horses to the car, was thinking a microtech setup with a custom fuel rail/pump.

    but doing this i would like to remove the old pump all together and idears, will start to pull her apart soon
    Yes, has been done quite a few times with good results, the hardest bit is arranging a fuel rail, the rest is dead easy.
    Probably best to ditch the dissy and use a toothed wheel for ECU triggering as the dissy complicates things re the fuel rail.
    I agree though, get everything ready to fit before you take the car off the road or it will end up a rusty wreck just stting there.
    Graham

  6. #6
    1000+ Posts 504-504-504's Avatar
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    so leftcoast whats the plan for the camshaft?
    I believe KF fitted engines have a cam that optimises the operation of the KF system.
    With aftermarket fuel injection a different cam could be used to advantage.
    Perhaps the cam from the carburettored engine might be more suitable.
    Somebody with more knowledge of these engines would know better than I.

    Paul

    ďA straight is merely the distance between two corners.Ē

    Current: Peugeot 205 GTi Mi16 1987
    Peugeot 205 Si, one red one silver, both 1991.
    Peugeot 504 Wagon, V6 and 5 speed gearbox.
    Isuzu (Holden) Rodeo, 4WD dual cab, extended chassis.
    Past: Goliath, Isuzu Bellett, Austin A30, Peugeot 203, 403, 404, 504,505.
    Subaru 4WD wagon, Toyota Hilux Dual Cab Diesel 4WD.

  7. #7
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    if it's working and not playing up leave the thing alone

    don't let anyone play with it

    don't be tempted to play with it

    enjoy it the way it is

    if you want to play then buy another car and fit a later model engine to it and go for it

    leave a genuine TI/LTI as it is
    3 x '78 604 SL

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  8. #8
    Fellow Frogger!
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    The 504 engine in my clubman has a Microtech computer, I built it 12 years ago, still going strong, will attempt a pic, fingers crossed.

    Cheers
    Graham Lewis
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails replacing 504 KF injection with aftermarket? anybody done this yet-under-bonnet.jpg  

  9. #9
    Fellow Frogger! Rally's Avatar
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    I have built 4 or 5 Ti motors with electronic injection for use in rally cars . These motors were built with thge express intention of more horse power.
    There are no real problems in converting to EFI , there is even a Nissan electronic dissy that fits in the origional location and will give both crank position and a home signal for sequencial injection and direct fire coils. there is a Ford fuel rail that is the correct spacing , just cut 2 cylinders off .
    To make the most of an EFI set up you would need more compression and a bigger cam lift , have part numbers for both pistons and cam if you need them.
    However if your car is just for road use stay with the KF it is the nicest 504 to drive , and they are reliable!!
    I have 2 road 504s and they are both Tis with KF.
    If you do want to go ahead I could help you with the project in exchange for all the KF bits you will no longer need.
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  10. #10
    1000+ Posts Peter Chisholm's Avatar
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    It depends on your point of view. For some, like me, it's all about originality. I'd rather fix what the car came with and agree with most of the others - a 504 Ti is a great car just the way it is.

    For others, it's about replacing old, worn out systems and parts with new improved, technology.

    If you really want to go down the latter path then go for it but keep the old KF parts or pass them on to someone else.

    There's not really a right or wrong approach.

  11. #11
    1000+ Posts Wildebeest's Avatar
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    Leftcoast,
    After reading all the replies sent I can visualise your reply being....

    " EH?"

  12. #12
    Fellow Frogger! callipygous's Avatar
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    What about:
    Peugeot 504 Intercooled T04 Turbo.

  13. #13
    Fellow Frogger!
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    I agree with Peter Chisholm; if you want to modify it then go for it - it'd be great to see an aftermarket injected 504. I built a TI engine with twin sidedraught carbs because I wanted to hear the noise. There was only a relatively small increase in power, but I still enjoyed it. Whatever your reason for making the modifications, be sure to keep us informed.

    Andrew

  14. #14
    pur-john, not pew-john! peujohn's Avatar
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    I'm glad this came up. I was planning to keep my TI injection system original when I get around to restoring the car, and this thread has convinced me that keeping it original is the right thing to do!

    Some reproduction KF parts are available on Ebay France.
    John W

    1979 Peugeot 504 GTI 2.2 litre 5 speed - 72 kW at the wheels

    1974 Peugeot 504 TI
    - now on the road

    2009 Peugeot 407 HDI wagon - family car

    Previous: 2005 407 HDI manual sedan, 1980 504 GL, 1990 405 Mi16, 1977 504 GL Special, 1984 505 SRD Turbo



  15. #15
    1000+ Posts BIGRR's Avatar
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    Default Ti Ti Ti!

    Quote Originally Posted by peujon View Post
    I'm glad this came up. I was planning to keep my TI injection system original when I get around to restoring the car, and this thread has convinced me that keeping it original is the right thing to do!

    Some reproduction KF parts are available on Ebay France.

    THE ONLY WAY TO GO!

    365000km.

    Main pump diaphragm and hoses replaced once.

    10km/l (recorded on trips over the past 38 years).
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails replacing 504 KF injection with aftermarket? anybody done this yet-dsc02974.jpg  
    Present fleet:-
    Peugeot 93' 205 Gti 16v
    Peugeot 73' 504 Ti from new
    Peugeot 08' 407 Hdi Coupe from new

    Previous fleet:-
    Peugeot 95' 605 Sv
    Peugeot 92' 205 Gti
    Renault 72' 16TS from new
    Renault 69' 10
    Renault 71' 10s
    Renault 68' 10 from new

    "Be reasonable do it my way!"


  16. #16
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BIGRR View Post
    THE ONLY WAY TO GO!

    365000km.

    Main pump diaphragm and hoses replaced once.

    10km/l (recorded on trips over the past 38 years).
    nearly due for spark plugs ?
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

  17. #17
    1000+ Posts Wildebeest's Avatar
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    Leftcoast,
    You say you'd like to "declutter the engine bay"? Well why not start there. I think I know the previous owner of your 504 so it wouldn't be too flash under bonnet. BIGRR's is a good example to aim for.

    Replace any daggy hoses both water, fuel and breather using new quality clamps. Tidy up any electric cabling and conceal it with split convoluted insulation.

    Remove the tappetcover, airfilter and any other painted surfaces, strip off old paint and respray with black engine enamel including the radiator top tank.

    Pull back the brake master cylinder, clean up the brake booster respray with hammer finish paint, green or grey looks OK. Also mask off the brake pipes and fluid reservoir repaint m/cyl silver [wheel paint].
    Degrease the fuel pump and engine block.

  18. #18
    pur-john, not pew-john! peujohn's Avatar
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    callipygous,

    Is that the engine bay of your 504? Looks impressive! It deserves its own thread, yes?
    John W

    1979 Peugeot 504 GTI 2.2 litre 5 speed - 72 kW at the wheels

    1974 Peugeot 504 TI
    - now on the road

    2009 Peugeot 407 HDI wagon - family car

    Previous: 2005 407 HDI manual sedan, 1980 504 GL, 1990 405 Mi16, 1977 504 GL Special, 1984 505 SRD Turbo



  19. #19
    1000+ Posts robmac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildebeest View Post
    Leftcoast,
    You say you'd like to "declutter the engine bay"? Well why not start there. I think I know the previous owner of your 504 so it wouldn't be too flash under bonnet. BIGRR's is a good example to aim for.

    Replace any daggy hoses both water, fuel and breather using new quality clamps. Tidy up any electric cabling and conceal it with split convoluted insulation.

    Remove the tappetcover, airfilter and any other painted surfaces, strip off old paint and respray with black engine enamel including the radiator top tank.

    Pull back the brake master cylinder, clean up the brake booster respray with hammer finish paint, green or grey looks OK. Also mask off the brake pipes and fluid reservoir repaint m/cyl silver [wheel paint].
    Degrease the fuel pump and engine block.
    I did exactly as Wildy suggested on my friend's car after the engine rebuild...
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails replacing 504 KF injection with aftermarket? anybody done this yet-z-engine-fitted-1.jpg  

  20. #20
    Fellow Frogger!
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    This picture shows the workings in a bit more detail, the 4 T/B's fuel rail, 4 coils, Mazda crank angle sensor at the front of the engine driven by a T drive gearbox from camshaft, the lower leg drives the external oil pump, partly obscured by diagonal brace, ground clearance issues were the reason for moving the pump.

    Cheers
    Graham Lewis
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails replacing 504 KF injection with aftermarket? anybody done this yet-lewis-clubman-engine.jpg  

  21. #21
    1000+ Posts BIGRR's Avatar
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    Default PugPower

    Graham,

    how about a few pics of the rest of the car.
    Present fleet:-
    Peugeot 93' 205 Gti 16v
    Peugeot 73' 504 Ti from new
    Peugeot 08' 407 Hdi Coupe from new

    Previous fleet:-
    Peugeot 95' 605 Sv
    Peugeot 92' 205 Gti
    Renault 72' 16TS from new
    Renault 69' 10
    Renault 71' 10s
    Renault 68' 10 from new

    "Be reasonable do it my way!"


  22. #22
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    Photo taken at Clubman Nationals held in and around Jindabyne in 2009 . A couple of other Pug nutters were in attendance, one has a beard and a red clubby and the other had a V8 203 many years ago.

    Cheers
    Graham Lewis
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails replacing 504 KF injection with aftermarket? anybody done this yet-lewis-clubman-jindabyne-1.jpg  

  23. #23
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    superb effort Graham !

  24. #24
    1000+ Posts BIGRR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Graham Lewis View Post
    Photo taken at Clubman Nationals held in and around Jindabyne in 2009 . A couple of other Pug nutters were in attendance, one has a beard and a red clubby and the other had a V8 203 many years ago.

    Cheers
    Graham Lewis
    Thanks for the pic, I like it, and would love to own it, will an (average) 6'-4" size 13 foot person fit in it?
    Present fleet:-
    Peugeot 93' 205 Gti 16v
    Peugeot 73' 504 Ti from new
    Peugeot 08' 407 Hdi Coupe from new

    Previous fleet:-
    Peugeot 95' 605 Sv
    Peugeot 92' 205 Gti
    Renault 72' 16TS from new
    Renault 69' 10
    Renault 71' 10s
    Renault 68' 10 from new

    "Be reasonable do it my way!"


  25. #25
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BIGRR View Post
    Thanks for the pic, I like it, and would love to own it, will an (average) 6'-4" size 13 foot person fit in it?
    their made for normal blokes
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

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