My S16 just died :cry:
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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! Wintermute's Avatar
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    Default My S16 just died :cry:

    Was on the way home from work. Gear change from 1st to 2nd seemed a bit crunchy, thought maybe I mistimed it. 2nd to third clutch felt odd and small sound of protest from the gearbox. Decided to drive the rest of the way home in third. Unfortunately It didn't make it. got most of the way, engine light came on and engine just stopped. Clutch now wont go all the way in.

    I rolled to the side of the road and that was that. Oil coming out of the clutch housing, burnt clutch smell, The oil looks too thin to be gearbox oil but it sure smells like gearbox oil.

    Will ring Paul V in the morning, but I'm not feeling particularly optimistic right now.

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    I'm thinking it might be the main seal has gone, I hope so as I guess that would be a much lesser death nell for the car than the gearbox going.

    SO watch this space, there maybe a good S16 Body available for wrecking if the repairs will be too much.

    Tony.
    306 S16 1995 black
    Morris 1100 1965 green

  2. #2
    Fellow Frogger! trihardthlete's Avatar
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    How much would it cost to fix, just dropped $4600 getting a thrashed GTi6 on the road. Paid $2300 for the car and a whole lot more time and $$$ on RWC and rego but wouldn't think twice about doing it again once I start it everytime.

  3. #3
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Main seal is on the engine not the gearbox.
    Usually the diff blows up and shoots debris into the bell housing destroying the pressure plate.

    Sounds like you need a new gear box is all.

    1k to fix it I'd say

    Gil

  4. #4
    Fellow Frogger! Wintermute's Avatar
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    1k would be awesome, I can live in hope. I love the car (have had it for 15 1/2 years), but wonder what would go next, so if it is a lot (say 5K) it could be throwing good money after bad.... (I still have my morris 1100 in storage waiting till I have a garage when I can restore it. I was planning on keeping the S16 as well, sort of a I've never sold a car I owned thing Have only had the two cars in 28 years of driving.

    I admittedly don't know the configuration of the clutch and flywheel (on the 1100 if the main seal went the clutch was the first thing the oil would hit). The oil looks like engine oil but has a strong sulphur smell which makes me think it is gearbox oil. The weird thing is that the first symptoms seemed to be clutch related, and I didn't hear any bangs or gearbox failing noises, just some knashing on gear change that sounded more like trying to change without syncros or clutch. The other very odd thing is why has the engine just stopped working. I did the flash codes and no fault codes recorded. I guess oil could have got in the electrics.

    Anyway hopefully I will know more tomorrow.

    Tony.
    306 S16 1995 black
    Morris 1100 1965 green

  5. #5
    Fellow Frogger! trihardthlete's Avatar
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    Good luck, could re coup some cash if you parted it out. But hopefully it's not that $$$ to fix

  6. #6
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    No way it will be just $1K. It's the same labour as a clutch change + new clutch + another gearbox + LSD if you don't want it to happen again.

    $2600-$2800 would be my estimate

    '92 205 Mi16
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  7. #7
    Fellow Frogger! Wintermute's Avatar
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    Sounds more like it PeterT even more wouldn't surprise me It definitely needs a new clutch, I'd been considering getting it done as it has been slipping. So Diff is the most likely culprit then, LSD would be nice. I just hope it isn't like when my morris broke a tooth off the crown wheel, I made the mistake of getting an exchange box and had lots of gearbox troubles right up until I snapped the back off the diff and decided enough is enough and bought the S16

    Thought I'd attach a pic, was taken about 5 years ago in Melbourne but apart from a few more car park door ding dimples it is mostly the same.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails My S16 just died :cry:-s16.jpg  
    306 S16 1995 black
    Morris 1100 1965 green

  8. #8
    Fellow Frogger!
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    PeterT you are spot on, I'm not sure why I didn't think about replacing the clutch kit.

    Gbox 300
    Oil 50
    Clutch kit 300
    Flywheel machine 90
    Labour 600
    = 1400
    +
    Quaife 1000
    Lab 200
    = 2600

  9. #9
    Fellow Frogger! Wintermute's Avatar
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    I assume gearbox 300 is for a second hand one from the wreckers.... If the gearbox needs replacing (provided it hasn't exploded) I'd get it reworked. Too many bad gearbox experiences in the past with exchange "reco" gearboxes.

    Thanks,

    Tony.
    306 S16 1995 black
    Morris 1100 1965 green

  10. #10
    Fellow Frogger! Balki's Avatar
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    Default s16

    sound to me like you had the same thing happen that happened to mewe had a preasure plate bolt come out of the flywheel it then swam around in the bellhousing and got picked up by the ring gear smashed a hole into the gearbox and then went round and smashed the crank angle sensor which stopped it altogether all in 5 seconds

    we weled up the gearbox fitted new clutch all is good

  11. #11
    Fellow Frogger! Wintermute's Avatar
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    Hi Balki, I hope it is something that simple! I talked to Paul V this morning and he is up to the eyeballs in work and has a number of dead cars already. He also said the crank angle sensor was most likely taken out. though he thought that the diff had probbly gone... Certainly though what you are describing seems to fit better as the problem seemed to start with the clutch, not the other way around.

    Did you fix it yourself? Where did you get it welded? There used to be a guy at Woy Woy, Barry Lang I think was his name, who could weld just about anything.

    Tony.
    306 S16 1995 black
    Morris 1100 1965 green

  12. #12
    Fellow Frogger! Balki's Avatar
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    Default s16

    yep fixed it new cluctch, and got my brother in law to weld it, we didnt even pull the box apart just drain and welded changed oil a couple of times afterwards still going strong

    i have also had the fingers on the diafram brake of and fly around in the bell housing

  13. #13
    Fellow Frogger! Wintermute's Avatar
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    Hi Balki have you got any pics? I'm starting to wonder if I shouldn't have a go at pulling it out myself. Sounds a bit complex from the haynes manual (I changed the gearbox on my Morris 1100 myself a few times). Paul said depending on where the hole was that it may or may not be able to be welded, due to risk of warping. I'll do some checking for some aluminium welding specialists.

    Tony.
    306 S16 1995 black
    Morris 1100 1965 green

  14. #14
    Fellow Frogger! trihardthlete's Avatar
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    Good luck mate, another pug off the road is a sad thing indeed. But there a lot of people on here that could offer advice and parts to help get her right again.

  15. #15
    1000+ Posts cam85's Avatar
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    Where abouts in sydney are you? I could possibly check it out?

    Cam
    94 205 Gti Classic #9
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  16. #16
    Fellow Frogger! Wintermute's Avatar
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    Hi Cam I just sent you a PM. As the car is sitting on the street at the moment I'd rather not say in public

    Tony.
    306 S16 1995 black
    Morris 1100 1965 green

  17. #17
    Sans Pond. STALLED's Avatar
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    I paid not much for my BE3 - Can't remember the exact figure, but it was sub $500 with only 40k on it since new (as the donor car was rolled)...

    Shame to hear about it - If the 406 were to suffer a similar fate, I'd be thinking the same questions!
    2005 Renault Clio 182 Cup

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  18. #18
    Fellow Frogger! Wintermute's Avatar
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    I'm seriously considering bringing it home and having a go at fixing it myself. I've pulled the engine out of my morris 1100 at least 5 times, Changed the gearbox on it, pulled the engine down and rebuilt it twice, so I'm not completely a newb when it comes to mechanical things, but that is 1960's technology.

    I've not done anything more than change thermostat, coils, speedo cable and vacuum pots on the pug.

    Anyone who has pulled the gearbox out of an S16, is there anything in particular to watch out for?

    How long roughly to do it? I'm thinking I should be able to get it out in a day...

    The clutch is what actually worries me the most (putting it back in), any special tools required?

    cheers,

    Tony.
    306 S16 1995 black
    Morris 1100 1965 green

  19. #19
    I might be slow... DRTDVL's Avatar
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    My mechanic mentioned to me that the s16 boxes would sometimes work loose the nuts closest to the passenger wheel behind that small end plate that covers the end of the gearbox... Might be worth checking while the box is empty.

    Box isn't too hard to get from what I remember...

  20. #20
    Fellow Frogger! Wintermute's Avatar
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    Thanks DRTDVL, I'm going to tow the car back to home shortly. Whether I'll look at it today or not I'm not sure yet. Have to get myself a trolley jack as my old one died ages ago and I haven't replaced it. Also have to get myself a set of 1/2 drive metric sockets as I only have imperial.

    edit: The car is now home safely. It was pretty uneventful no nasty noises or vibrations during the trip home. The main concern was when turning on full lock coming into the garage. The steering seemed to be resisting and I couldn't turn sharply enough then bang and came good..... Not very optimistic about what caused that!! I had a quick look underneath no obviously exploded CV joints, drive shafts feel firm. Guess I'm not going to find out the extent of the damage until I start pulling it apart. Time to read the haynes manual a few times (and hope that it is relevant enough since it doesn't cover the S16) .

    Tony.
    Last edited by Wintermute; 10th March 2012 at 09:51 AM.
    306 S16 1995 black
    Morris 1100 1965 green

  21. #21
    Tadpole
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    Icon3 S16 motor

    Corrado at Eurocare (Burswood) in Perth has a second hand S16 (exc cond) if the motor is dead.

  22. #22
    Fellow Frogger! Wintermute's Avatar
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    Thanks ephjuan I think it is more likely a gearbox that I will need. Hopefully will have a better understanding of the problem by this evening depending on how the extraction goes

    Tony.
    306 S16 1995 black
    Morris 1100 1965 green

  23. #23
    Fellow Frogger! Wintermute's Avatar
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    OK Well the diff has definitely gone. found half a cog in the bottom of the bell housing (accessed through the hole) The diff housing is cracked as well.

    I've hit a snag at the moment. The Haynes manual says I should remove the starter motor, but I can't see how to get to it. I traced the main wire so I know roughly where it is but it is in a really awkward spot and I just can't see how to get it out (I can't even see the actual starter).

    I found a gti6 gearbox removal walkthrough and it doesn't actually mention removing the starter, so I'm wondering if I can just leave it in place.

    Tony.
    306 S16 1995 black
    Morris 1100 1965 green

  24. #24
    Fellow Frogger!
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    It must come out. You should be able to get to the bolts if you remove the battery and air ducts. 3x 8mm allen key I think.

    Gil

  25. #25
    Fellow Frogger! Wintermute's Avatar
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    Thanks bobomacho! I just started a new thread. I've removed the battery box and plate. Not the air intake tubing though. I just realised I've been dumb, I followed the main earth wire not the positive! back to have another look Thanks!

    Tony.
    306 S16 1995 black
    Morris 1100 1965 green

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