504 Seized Engine
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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! Tom_95's Avatar
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    Default 504 Seized Engine

    Hi,

    Picked up a second 504 today, as a parts car, and it seems that the engine has seized.

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    We removed the starter motor and tested to make sure it was working, which it was, and removed the plugs. One plug's electrode (The front cylinder) was rusted.

    We can push it to free the motor either, being an automatic...

    So, I guess what I am trying to ask is their really any way of getting the thing turning again??

    Thanks
    Thomas

  2. #2
    Fellow Frogger! callipygous's Avatar
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    How did you test the starter motor? With it off the engine? There is always the chance that it turns when off, but not with a load on it.

    Perhaps filling the cylinders with penetrating oil, waiting a day then turning the engine over using a socket on the crankshaft pulley nut with the plugs still out would be how I'd go about it.

    If that doesn't work, it's rebuild time or find someone with an engine they don't want.
    Peugeot 504 Intercooled T04 Turbo.

  3. #3
    Fellow Frogger! Tom_95's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by callipygous View Post
    How did you test the starter motor? With it off the engine? There is always the chance that it turns when off, but not with a load on it.

    Perhaps filling the cylinders with penetrating oil, waiting a day then turning the engine over using a socket on the crankshaft pulley nut with the plugs still out would be how I'd go about it.

    If that doesn't work, it's rebuild time or find someone with an engine they don't want.
    Excuse my ignorance but I haven't a clue what penetrating oil is... A brand name would be helpful.

    Anyway, it isn't essential that car goes... just means I have to push the car whenever I want to move it...

    Thanks

  4. #4
    Fellow Frogger! callipygous's Avatar
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    A penetrating oil was made by Mobil called 'penetrating oil'.

    You could substitute it with a thin oil such as Redex or an oil/diesel mixture that has a chance to soak in and loosen things up.
    Peugeot 504 Intercooled T04 Turbo.

  5. #5
    1000+ Posts jo proffi's Avatar
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    Start by decompressing it, just in case the coolant or some other fluid is causing hydro lock.

    Pull the spark plugs out, in other words.


    Jo

  6. #6
    Fellow Frogger! Tom_95's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by callipygous View Post
    A penetrating oil was made by Mobil called 'penetrating oil'.

    You could substitute it with a thin oil such as Redex or an oil/diesel mixture that has a chance to soak in and loosen things up.
    Oh, I feel very stupid at the moment...

  7. #7
    Veni Vidi Posti 68 404's Avatar
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    I was told a story about this a long time ago.

    Chick in a Gemini cooked her 1584 and kept driving it until it wouldn't drive no more!!

    She was a long was from home (in the bush) and had no funds to do the proper thing. She was told by her mechanic that the engine was cactus and had seized.

    Begged him to do something (not sure if she went down on her knees...)
    .
    .
    .
    .
    .
    I meant to beg...

    The mechanic (on the understanding the engine was rooted) removed the plugs and put thin oil (penetrating or otherwise) down the plug holes. Left it there (plugs out) for a day and then tried to turn the engine over with a dirty big bar and socket on the harmonic balancer. It turned minutely. Twice a day he returned, getting a bit more each time.

    Several days later he managed to get full rotations and the old mill started up and did its best imitation of a cold diesel.

    The chick was able to drive the Gemini back to Sydney (I'm sure there were petrol and oil stops along the way) and managed another 4 months before that Gemini sighed its last breath.

    So it's possible...

    Dave
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  8. #8
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 68 404 View Post
    I was told a story about this a long time ago.

    Chick in a Gemini cooked her 1584 and kept driving it until it wouldn't drive no more!!

    She was a long was from home (in the bush) and had no funds to do the proper thing. She was told by her mechanic that the engine was cactus and had seized.

    Begged him to do something (not sure if she went down on her knees...)
    .
    .
    .
    .
    .
    I meant to beg...

    The mechanic (on the understanding the engine was rooted) removed the plugs and put thin oil (penetrating or otherwise) down the plug holes. Left it there (plugs out) for a day and then tried to turn the engine over with a dirty big bar and socket on the harmonic balancer. It turned minutely. Twice a day he returned, getting a bit more each time.

    Several days later he managed to get full rotations and the old mill started up and did its best imitation of a cold diesel.

    The chick was able to drive the Gemini back to Sydney (I'm sure there were petrol and oil stops along the way) and managed another 4 months before that Gemini sighed its last breath.

    So it's possible...

    Dave
    i know that story except it was my sister, it was a 504 and it was still in town but a frantic phone call to you know who to save her
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  9. #9
    1000+ Posts Wildebeest's Avatar
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    Default seized...

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom_95 View Post
    Oh, I feel very stupid at the moment...

    Tom,
    Try a half cup of auto trans oil down the plug 'oles. Leave for a day or three.

    "I feel very stupid at the moment". Not so Tom, a stupid person is one who doesn't ask.

  10. #10
    Fellow Frogger! 1pugnut's Avatar
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    I know a guy that restores old stationary engines some times he will find one that has been sitting in a paddock with no cylinder head so the piston is really rusted in .
    His remendy is eucalypus oil and every time he would walk past it he would give the piston a hit
    and he manage's to to get them going again.
    so try eucalypus oil.
    regards jamie

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  11. #11
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    But sadly sometimes nothing moves them. A 203 I wrecked had a seized piston in the bore. Nothing I could do would free it. I wasn't going to use it but it was frustrating. Needed a 20 ton press.
    Bloke seized his old Landcruiser. Tow by a Range Rover got it turning and that motor was still going several years later. After that, I've always thought it worthwhile to get them turning again.

  12. #12
    1000+ Posts Gamma's Avatar
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    Having owned may old holdens and being an old hand at rescue mechanicals......

    +1 thin oil...take your pic...Diesel, tranny oil,(boy don't they squeel when squeezed), 1/4 of a can of WD40 down each plug hole, Rycol (the runny one) and 2stroke oil mix.

    Give it time and do not rush....Zen moments await you........

    A socket and breaker bar...note ..... rock both ways as you get a little movement.
    I still have Holden special tool # move you bastard...plate which bolts onto the balancer inner holes welded onto a axel shaft....yes it worked and I lost a lot of skin and sweat in the process.

    I don't hold out too much hope for a cooked/siezed motor in the long run if you get it going....
    Its worth a try and you might be lucky for a time anyway.

    Do not tow unless you want to risk damaging the rest of the drive train.

    Also if there are any siezed lifters or valves there may be bending....so take off the rocker cover and see that the valves are going upsy-downsy as they should as you start to move the crank.

    If using vairious 'Hules de serp' make sure you flush and change out the oil if sucessfull.

    You can fill the block with diesel and leave it for a month or so, (empty the water jacket and leave it empty) and then try the BIG BAR......
    Last edited by Gamma; 7th January 2012 at 10:15 AM. Reason: Speelink
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  13. #13
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom_95 View Post
    Excuse my ignorance but I haven't a clue what penetrating oil is... A brand name would be helpful.

    Anyway, it isn't essential that car goes... just means I have to push the car whenever I want to move it...

    Thanks
    "Penetrene"
    JohnW

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  14. #14
    Fellow Frogger! callipygous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnW View Post
    "Penetrene"
    Not to be confused with Petetrol.
    Peugeot 504 Intercooled T04 Turbo.

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