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Thread: GTi 180 - rough first 1min after cold start - ideas?

  1. #26
    Fellow Frogger! kinroh's Avatar
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    if battery is fine it could be hydraulic lifters / tappets? ..sorry its already been said

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  2. #27
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    The battery itself is an R & J Batteries MF55 branded AC Delco with no manufactured date stamped anywhere I can see. Good point though - I will get the battery tested.

  3. #28
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    It may be the variable cam adjuster. Get someone to test the codes on the car and they should be able to see if that's an issue or not.

    My car has had this problem, never got the really bad idle problems, it is a bit rough.

    Got it sorted out and it runs perfectly now

    Hope this helps.

  4. #29
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    Hello, I had a rough idle at start up and sometimes stalling.

    The fix for this was to charge my battery. The battery is now 7 years old and it probably needs replacing, however the charge and regular driving has stopped this problem.

    The cold weather could be giving your battery a hard time. Recharge the battery it will cost you nothing. If it fixes it temporarily you'll know if you're due for a battery.

  5. #30
    Demannu-facturing! Demannu's Avatar
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    I know this might sound obvious, but have you changed the spark plugs? Has oil leaked from the rocker cover into the spark plug tubes, contaminating the ignition coil ends?
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  6. #31
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    Hi all this problem cannot be fixed no matter what tune or new lifter you put in the engine,you just have to wait the one minute thirty seconds till coldstart phase is finished. I have had my 180 since 2006 and I too have the tune that magic sells and it is good for power and not leaning out at 7000rpm but the engine being the EW10J4S has an air pump that at start up actually puts O2 into the exhaust tract inside the cylinder head behind the exhaust valves, because of the amount of fuel an engine like this needs below 30 degrees celsius at cold start. This idea is so because when they bought this engine out, the emissions this engine put out was too much, so thus the added O2 makes levels read safe at the end of the exhaust and at the same time helps heat the catalytic converter up quicker. We had a lot of complaints during the warranty period for this ew10j4/j4s engines and some ew10j4 engines didn't come out with the air pump in early 100kw gti so these customers never experienced the fault.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by 180 View Post
    Hi all this problem cannot be fixed no matter what tune or new lifter you put in the engine,you just have to wait the one minute thirty seconds till coldstart phase is finished. I have had my 180 since 2006 and I too have the tune that magic sells and it is good for power and not leaning out at 7000rpm but the engine being the EW10J4S has an air pump that at start up actually puts O2 into the exhaust tract inside the cylinder head behind the exhaust valves, because of the amount of fuel an engine like this needs below 30 degrees celsius at cold start. This idea is so because when they bought this engine out, the emissions this engine put out was too much, so thus the added O2 makes levels read safe at the end of the exhaust and at the same time helps heat the catalytic converter up quicker. We had a lot of complaints during the warranty period for this ew10j4/j4s engines and some ew10j4 engines didn't come out with the air pump in early 100kw gti so these customers never experienced the fault.
    LOL

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  8. #33
    1000+ Posts mr bern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 180 View Post
    some ew10j4 engines didn't come out with the air pump in early 100kw gti so these customers never experienced the fault.
    Aha! I wondered what all the fuss was about ...
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  9. #34
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    Just to chime in, mine has always been rough at cold start also. A new battery improves it slightly.
    As is always mentioned, waiting for the fuel pump to prime before starting also improves it, but ultimately mine starts fine, then is temperamental for about a minute or so until the engine warms slightly.
    I don't really mind, as it forces me to be nice to the cold engine and letting it idle for a minute rather than roaring off like a maniac.

    The hack to improve cold start emissions mentioned above sounds perfectly plausible to me. Maybe it'll go away with my new Group N ecu which apparently ignores emissions problems. Maybe Brett could chime in, I know he already has one installed...

  10. #35
    Fellow Frogger! Mi16 Man's Avatar
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    I had this issue on my MY05 GTi180. There's even a clip on YT that I posted;

    http://youtu.be/5DLXj41LkVo


    A complete ECU delete/reprogram fixed it in 2008, via Allan Mackay Autos in NSW. This was after a coil pack was replaced under warranty by Melrose Automobiles in the ACT in 2007.
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  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by silverware View Post
    The battery itself is an R & J Batteries MF55 branded AC Delco with no manufactured date stamped anywhere I can see. Good point though - I will get the battery tested.
    Thanks for the informed responses. Battery was manufactured in 2010. It was tested & rated as "good" 12.43v, measured 463CCA\rated500CCA. This was after 4 days of no use & when started this evening required a stab of the accelerator to prevent stalling as per usual. I intend to purchase (the subject of another thread?) a CTEK's MXS 5.0 or Projects Pro Charger battery charger in the future just to keep the battery in tip top condition. Spark plugs replaced at last service 4 months ago. Previous owner's service record had a similar problem with cold starts way back in August 2011. Peugeot diagnostics didn't return a fault code & suggested an overnight stay at the garage... which never occurred. Its only been a problem for me since the onset of colder weather having not owned it long enough to enjoy all seasons!

  12. #37
    Fellow Frogger! Mi16 Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by silverware View Post
    Thanks for the informed responses..............

    ........Peugeot diagnostics didn't return a fault code & suggested an overnight stay at the garage... which never occurred. Its only been a problem for me since the onset of colder weather having not owned it long enough to enjoy all seasons!
    This is all eerily familiar.

    I failed to mention, no fault code ever occurs. It seems to be a software fault hence why the car was 'hooked up' to Peugeot in Singapore (IIRC) to get a complete new ECU program.
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  13. #38
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    my 180 suffers from this most mornings. I dont have any solutions to the fault but try turning the car off immediately after starting (start car only after full pump is primed and once oil indicator has finished), and then restart it. this strangely stops the idle problem every time, with out fail. i am not sure what that means from a mechanical sense, but hey it works.

    the 180 is a quirky machine!

  14. #39
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    Mine is the same..... want a few mins of idling before moving anywhere.... I did tell the mechanic about this every service time, but have given up on there being an answer.....

    Warming up the car is good for it in any case.... So I don't really mind anymore......
    Remember, its not a game, its a state of mind......

  15. #40
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    Just curious if this is something specific to the 206 GTi engine? I read the that 306 GTi6 runs rich on a cold start as well but I can't say I've ever had a lack of power.
    2000 306 GTi6 'Josie'

  16. #41
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    I wouldn't call my 180 running rich.... its more than that..... If you press the accelerator after starting the engine, it gurgles and splutters, and sometimes even stalls.....

    its like this for maybe 2 mins. After that its fine.
    Remember, its not a game, its a state of mind......

  17. #42
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    Default GTi 180 - rough first 1min after cold start - ideas?

    Hi guys,

    After doing a search I came across this post which is a similar scenario to what I am now experiencing.

    It's only really been these last couple of weeks where I am getting the cold start, the car shuddering like it's just about to stall.

    After a touch on the accelerator and waiting for a couple of minutes to warm up the car is fine, it's just on the first turn of the key.

    Even with the recent Sydney heat I didn't think the warm weather would be a contributing factor.

    Prior to this it was getting a perfect start. The 180 is my daily driver.

    Just wondering how the other owners are going with this issue.

    Some suggestions throughout this post and others have been:

    Could the battery be on it's way out?
    Is it all part of the VVT?
    Tempreture sensor?

    Or it just a normal trait of the EW10J4S engine?

    Cheers
    2006 Peugeot 206 GTi 180

  18. #43
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    I have had the problem for a long time.... years.... haven't been able to fix it. I just spend a min or two warming up the car.
    Remember, its not a game, its a state of mind......

  19. #44
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    G'day,
    have a look at post No. 24. That is the recommended starting procedure for a 180.
    If the problems still persist, it might need a bit of a service and tune.
    regards,
    Les W.


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  20. #45
    Tadpole silverware's Avatar
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    "A good idea is to let all the warning lights finish their routine and turn off, and the oil level turn back to the odo."

    The above advice is now my cold start routine - I agree that it is a trait of the engine without spending a 'lorry' load of time 'n' money investigating why.

    My car did less than 4000km in the last year so it was interesting to know that daily drivers are also experiencing the same start up gremlin!

    I was advised by my mechanic recently to try starting with Air con switched on? It also benefitted from a throttle body cleaner - something that Subaru insist on at each service I recall.

  21. #46
    Contented Peugeot Driver addo's Avatar
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    The Suby throttle body cleaner is good gear - it's on par with the Wurth item.

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by silverware View Post
    "A good idea is to let all the warning lights finish their routine and turn off, and the oil level turn back to the odo."
    My car did less than 4000km in the last year so it was interesting to know that daily drivers are also experiencing the same start up gremlin!
    I was advised by my mechanic recently to try starting with Air con switched on? It also benefited from a throttle body cleaner - something that Subaru insist on at each service I recall.


    G'day,
    Its not a gremlin. its the correct way to start.
    My [non dealer] mechanic also cleans the throttle bodies each service.
    It does seem to make a difference.
    regards,
    Les W.


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  23. #48
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    My car had a major service in October last year - incl. timing belt and water pump.

    Since my last post the starts have improved and I haven't done anything different!

    Love my Pug
    2006 Peugeot 206 GTi 180

  24. #49
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    Hi, I hope this helps someone as I had this same fail on my Peugeot 307 2.0 2004 Petrol EW10J4 Engine.

    My trouble was hard to start on cold mornings would and run rough for a minute or so until the car warmed up. Giving it a quick rev usually helped as well. Pulling out into busy traffic was a bit stressful as the car would lose power suddenly. I had the car checked out by numerous mechanics and none of them could find the problem. Searching around the internet I found some threads that suggested problems with the Hydraulic Lifters on the early EW10J4 engines which is an expensive repair. Not wanting to spend big money to find out if it was the lifters causing this I decided to remove the 4 x Fuel Injectors and clean them manually as one of the mechanics did seem to think it was injector related. I rigged up a cleaning jig using a can of carb cleaner, Syringe casings and a power supply to power the injectors - see youtube video here - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NMM6Mk79rg I reverse flushed the injectors as well.

    After cleaning the injectors and re-installing them the car starts perfectly every morning and has increased power as well. My 307 did not come out with a fuel filter which is a big reason the injectors are getting clogged up and causing problems. I added a fuel filter to the fuel line.

    The car was now starting perfectly but after starting was still idling rough. I plugged the car into Peugeot planet and checked the Engine ECU faults and it had 2 x faults.

    - Engine ECU Intermittent Fault. Exhaust Gas Recycling (EGR) Excessive Recycling

    - Engine ECU Intermittent Fault. Position of EGR solenoid valve Coherence

    I removed the EGR solenoid valve and cleaned out the soot with carby cleaner and made sure the solenoid pin was moving freely then lubricated the solenoid pin with a high temp lubricant as the carby cleaner will clean everything but will dry it out.

    I also removed the EGR valve that connects to the air pump and cleaned it.

    Now my 307 is starting perfectly every morning with more power, no more flat spots and idles correctly from cold.

    I hope this helps someone else and saves them some time and money

  25. #50
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    I will second that, as I had some issues with my EW10J4S related to injectors. Cleaning helped, replacing fixed. Though a professional ultrasonic clean might have been just as good as new injectors if Id gone down that route.
    New coil rail helped with idle after starting, and especially proper iridium spark plugs removed a lot of engine stutter

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