308 HDi Automatic Transmission
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  1. #1
    Tadpole
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    Default 308 HDi Automatic Transmission

    I have a 308 2.0 HDi with a six speed automatic transmission. *The transmission frequently shudders when it is on the brink of shifting up. *I can stop this by decelerating which may allow it to short up, or accelerating preventing it from wanting to shift up. *Also, when I decelerate to turn a corner for example, when I accelerate again it doesn't go anywhere as it has remained in too high a gear, it will eventually shift down and then literally take off. *When I report this to my Peugeot dealership they tell me that they have plugged it into the computer and because there are no error messages then there is nothing wrong with it. *Has anyone else experienced these problems?

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  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by whiskers View Post
    I have a 308 2.0 HDi with a six speed automatic transmission. *The transmission frequently shudders when it is on the brink of shifting up. *I can stop this by decelerating which may allow it to short up, or accelerating preventing it from wanting to shift up. *Also, when I decelerate to turn a corner for example, when I accelerate again it doesn't go anywhere as it has remained in too high a gear, it will eventually shift down and then literally take off. *When I report this to my Peugeot dealership they tell me that they have plugged it into the computer and because there are no error messages then there is nothing wrong with it. *Has anyone else experienced these problems?
    Our 308 2 litre HDi auto has only 13000 k's on it but on a very few occasions has felt like the engine was 'hunting' after pulling up at the 'lights. This usually happened when cold and I don't know whether it is an engine or transmission related phenomenon. It may have also occured when ascending slight rises, but it was difficult to determine as it may have been road surface related.
    We haven't had any of the symptoms you describe.
    This is probably not much help...Sorry!

    John

  3. #3
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    Thanks John,

    Mine certainy does sometimes hunt when ascending hills. When I mentioned it to the Peugeot the first time the woman checking it in did obliquely acknowledge that other owners had reported the same thing. I'll raise the problem with them again.

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    If you have the paddle shifters you could use them to override the system.
    Chadi

    1982 504 SR white manual sedan with A/C (257 000 Km)
    2012 308 1.6 VTi Vapor Grey manual H/B (35000 Km)
    1994 405 1.6 white manual sedan (208 000 Km)
    1992 605 SV24 (91 000 Km)
    2005 406 2.0L automatic (Replaced with a 2013 C5)
    1983 505 GR white manual sedan with A/C (170000 Km)

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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doush_504 View Post
    If you have the paddle shifters you could use them to override the system.
    Hi Doush,
    No; the 6 speed auto used with the 2 litre Hdi is floorshifted only.

    John

  6. #6
    Tadpole
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    It's true what you say, if I had paddle shifts I could override. I could also override with the floor shift but then I might as well drive a manual car. The 'pause' is rather disconcerting at times, I have on occasions had to abort quick lane changes because I have accelerated and nothing has happened. I might try raising it with Peugeot directly to see what response I get from them.

  7. #7
    Gone Fishin' Haakon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whiskers View Post
    they have plugged it into the computer and because there are no error messages then there is nothing wrong with it.
    Nice to see the dealer's diagnostics skills are as good as ever

  8. #8
    1000+ Posts Capago's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haakon View Post
    Nice to see the dealer's diagnostics skills are as good as ever
    Well if it cant be faulted during roadtesting or even a coldstart test, theres no fault codes logged and no infoflashes (recall/info bulletins) to look at, and say for this case, checking the solenoid pressures against guide pressures etc (if its all correct in parameter measurements) what more can they do? as frustrating as it is for a customer, you have to understand how frustrating it is for the dealership to tell the customer there is nothing they can find.

    A similar issue i recall was once on a 307 HDi, an incorrect tyre BRAND (not size) caused the ABS to play havoc with the gearbox shift patterns. Sounds odd i know. Check all the same brand and size/rating, and similar wear.

    Try it in sports, does that make any difference? occurs when hot cold or all the time?

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capago View Post
    Well if it cant be faulted during roadtesting or even a coldstart test, theres no fault codes logged and no infoflashes (recall/info bulletins) to look at, and say for this case, checking the solenoid pressures against guide pressures etc (if its all correct in parameter measurements) what more can they do? as frustrating as it is for a customer, you have to understand how frustrating it is for the dealership to tell the customer there is nothing they can find.

    A similar issue i recall was once on a 307 HDi, an incorrect tyre BRAND (not size) caused the ABS to play havoc with the gearbox shift patterns. Sounds odd i know. Check all the same brand and size/rating, and similar wear.

    Try it in sports, does that make any difference? occurs when hot cold or all the time?
    I understand the frustration that you allude to Capago.
    Sometimes taking the dealer for a drive , or getting them to drive you so you can highlight the symptom when it occurs can pay dividends.
    Of course the "intermittent syptoms" are the ones to drive everyone crazy.
    The worst such experience for me was with my first company car --a four cylinder Commodore no less-- wipers would only refuse to work on cold frosty mornings...all other times they were fine...talk about funny looks from the service guys!

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capago View Post
    A similar issue i recall was once on a 307 HDi, an incorrect tyre BRAND (not size) caused the ABS to play havoc with the gearbox shift patterns. Sounds odd i know. Check all the same brand and size/rating, and similar wear.
    This ABS 'phantom' fault problem can also happen with some Citroens, which is not surpirsing as they share similar technology. Mismatched tyres or having one new and one quite worn can occasionally trigger ABS and other faults that have no immediate explanation. In fairly late cars only the ABS is used to determine the vehicle speed, so that might also affect the gearbox. Certainly, not to be dismissed as a myth and worth checking the tyres.

    Perhaps, leave it with the dealer and ask them to drive it around for a few days or take it for the weekend? Some dealers would be happy to do so, but maybe other won't??? Sometimes a problem is not apparent until the car has been driven for an hour, more even, or until it's driven in specific road/traffic conditions. If a technician is unable to drive the car under similar conditions to those the owner experiences, they may be unable to replicate the symptoms.

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    Quote Originally Posted by whiskers View Post
    I have a 308 2.0 HDi with a six speed automatic transmission. *The transmission frequently shudders when it is on the brink of shifting up. *I can stop this by decelerating which may allow it to short up, or accelerating preventing it from wanting to shift up. *Also, when I decelerate to turn a corner for example, when I accelerate again it doesn't go anywhere as it has remained in too high a gear, it will eventually shift down and then literally take off. *When I report this to my Peugeot dealership they tell me that they have plugged it into the computer and because there are no error messages then there is nothing wrong with it. *Has anyone else experienced these problems?
    Hi Whiskers, et al,

    I had a Citroen C5 with 6-speed auto and HDi. (The same engine/transmission combo, I believe.) While mine never showed the hunting you refer to, on overrun, it would send a judder through the car as if it could not decide if it should be in top or fifth. My far-from-wonderful dealer network told me nothing was wrong...

    The issue regarding corners was alive and well for the 85,000 km I owned the car. Press the accelerator and nothing happens for about 2-3 seconds, then it selects a lower gear and takes off? Dealers told me the transmission computer was deciding which gear it should be in and it took time for the signals to get to the bit that selected a gear. (I suggested that since it had no more than six at most, and that the signals didn't have far to go, it should be able to do so in a reasonable time.)

    Mine was never fixed, but my experience with Citroen dealers indicates Peugeot cannot possibly be so inept - it would stagger my imagination if they were. On the Citroen forum, a couple of members said some slight pause was normal, but seconds' worth was not. Mine also never sent a message to the memory thingy (even when it was working properly), so I got a similar story to you.

    I don't know how you should proceed, but it seems to me there is an unusual and uncommon problem with this transmission. Perhaps Peugeot customer service?

    Sorry I can't be more help, but feel free to grill me if you have further questions.

    Michael P

  12. #12
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    Very interesting. My 308 Hdi has a similar lurch / shudder. Mostly it occures when cold and usually under light acceleration after decending a hill. Its not just a single bump however. I notice a series of shudders like a misfire (can a diesel misfire?). Perhaps its a crook injector? The only thing I know for sure is that its frustrating.
    As for the delay on acceletation. I have noticed something similar. Only I don't get a change in gear before the power is applied. My car just seems to ignore the accelerator pedal. In frustration I give it more acceleration just as it wakes up. The result is warp speed! The delay however is not as long as some have indicated. Perhaps I have the "normal" delay. So I'm realy no help either, sorry.

  13. #13
    1000+ Posts Capago's Avatar
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    they can misfire, but not what i would call it. different flow rates or even an obstructed/broken injector will feel like it is misfiring. usually involves replacing an injector but very expensive! unless your sure what it is.

    In regards to the delay. updating the software on the car may help, but again is not free unless you go to the dealer and complain of that issue whilest under warranty. to be completely honest, sometimes i think that its "just the way they are" unfortunately

  14. #14
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    Default 308 egc gearbox

    I have a 308 1.6L Hti with 4,500 K and I have the same issues. It will frequently not move off without extra acceleration and then it lurches forward as if a learner is driving with a manual clutch. Does anyone else get the clunk under the floor when coming to a stop sometimes? There doesn't seem to be a pattern to it, put is quite off putting for a new car. I also get the misfire type problem as well.I have approached the dealer who took the car overnight, I got the can't find a fault message. I am due to return again this week after contacting Peugeot direct. Has anyone had any success with their dealership on this issue? I have told mine that I no longer want the car if they can't fix it and will have a manual instead, needless to say they want me to wear the cost of the changeover.

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    Quote Originally Posted by humper View Post
    I have a 308 1.6L Hti with 4,500 K and I have the same issues.
    They cannot be the "same issues" as your car has an automated manual with a clutch (EGC), and the 2L model has the AM6 torque convertor automatic. I would suggest starting a new thread regarding your matter.

  16. #16
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    Thanks tonch 504 and Metal Mick, at least I know now that I am not imagining it. Both the shuddering and the acceleration delay are intermittent, there is no pattern to when it will do it. Sometimes when I press the accelerator it responds immediately and other times not. I have begun to wonder if it is not the transmission as it doesn't always shift back when I accelerate and responds like it should. Even the shuddering is inconsistent as sometimes it will do it in 6th gear under light acceleration and high speed when I wouldn't expect it to be wanting to change down, adjusting my foot fixes the problem.

    The Peugeot dealership mostly seem to want to deny that it is occurring. Having the light (beige) interior I put my own mats in the car to protect the carpet. They said the problem was being caused by the mat and removed it. Of course it continued to do it without the mat. I have noticed that when I take it to the dealership with this problem when I pick it up it has generally only done 3 or 4 kms.

    This is the first new car I have ever owned and have mostly always had old cars. As I have a reasonable mechanical knowledge I have always been able to deal directly with the mechanics and discuss issues that I have had. However, with this Peugeot I only get to deal with receptionist who play the role of information conduit between me and what are now called technicians. It feels to me that if no errors appear on the car's log, then according to the technicians there is nothing wrong. It seems that the cars are treated like computers and the fact that they are still running mechanical components is ignored.

  17. #17
    Fellow Frogger! matt_molon's Avatar
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    try speaking to a 'non peugeot' peugeot specialist and see if he has encountered these problems you might find that he has a solution.
    2004 206 GTI 180 BLACK
    1998 406 2.0L auto ST WHITE

    [email]matt_mo[email protected][email]

  18. #18
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    Yeah thanks matt_molon, i think there is a fella at Hornsby that meets that description, I had been thinking about that.

  19. #19
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    Or ask a Citroen dealer - same drivetrain.

    Do you think this an engine surging/pulsing problem with a short period on light throttle? Or is it a transmisison shudder on a change? If it's the engine, you might even suspect the EGR valve operation.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by whiskers View Post
    The Peugeot dealership mostly seem to want to deny that it is occurring. Having the light (beige) interior I put my own mats in the car to protect the carpet. They said the problem was being caused by the mat and removed it. Of course it continued to do it without the mat. I have noticed that when I take it to the dealership with this problem when I pick it up it has generally only done 3 or 4 kms.
    That's Toyota territory
    the 3-4 extra Kms are supposed to be a test drive, to make sure everything is OK.
    Chadi

    1982 504 SR white manual sedan with A/C (257 000 Km)
    2012 308 1.6 VTi Vapor Grey manual H/B (35000 Km)
    1994 405 1.6 white manual sedan (208 000 Km)
    1992 605 SV24 (91 000 Km)
    2005 406 2.0L automatic (Replaced with a 2013 C5)
    1983 505 GR white manual sedan with A/C (170000 Km)

    All since new


  21. #21
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    David S, I have had the shuddering at high speed under light acceleration where I would not expect and gear change is required.

    I contacted Peugeot Australia who are very apologetic in their response but have referred me back to the dealer. The Customer Service Officer advised that I would be contacted by the service manager - that was three days ago but still no contact.

    When I raised with the Peugeot Customer Service Officer that I had read on discussion forums others having had the same problem, she told me that they do not take any notice of anything that is written on discussion forums and manage each case individually!

  22. #22
    Fellow Frogger! Morpheus's Avatar
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    Interesting thread this. It just confirms my opinion about avoiding any modern car with an automatic transmission. My company supplied car - an Aurion - has a trendy 6 speed 'intelligent automatic', and while it does not have intermittent problems, its characterstics are terrible. The time between hitting the gas and foward propulsion can be very disconcerting at times. Especially when youre in a hurry.
    But back to the Peu. I am SO disappointed with firstly Peugeot and secondly their dealer network. That Peugeot, with thier historic reputation, can produce a car fitted with such crap transmissions is criminal. And a dealer network which seeks to treat consumers with such disdain is very dissappointing. Still, karma happens and it will come back to haunt them.
    If a customer comes in complaining about some performance issue with the vehicle, their default position should be "the customer has a valid concern and we will get to the bottom of it". What we see here is a "how can we make this go away" attitude. That they wont even offer to drive the car indicates that they do not "manage each case individually". If the computer doesnt detect a fault there isn't one??!!
    Next time you're in hospital wired up to some monitoring equipment, you'd better hope they don't follow the same philosophy.



    2011 Peugeot 207 HDi Touring Outdoor

    2004 Peugeot 206 XT 1.6 Manual.

    Past: 1953 Thames 100E van, 1966 Austin 1800, 1972 XA Falcon V8, 1973 Peugeot 504,
    1984 Mitsubishi Colt, Holden HX Kingswood, 1983 Toyota Corolla XX, 1988 Toyota Corolla 4WD, 2007 Peugeot 307XSE. + various company Falcauriodores.

    Next: 2007 Peugeot 407HDi Coupe

  23. #23
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    Hi Whiskers, et al,

    just something a little further (though it may not help), I found that when I did take the vehicle back to my Citroen dealer, they would "reset" the computer's adaptive memory thing, and the transmission gave crisp changes and behaved satisfactorily.

    However, this would not last and after a day or so, the symptoms would return. The dealership blamed this on me, saying it was adapting to how I was driving the thing. Of course, asking for a demonstration on how to drive the vehicle to the behavior remained acceptable brought no response.

    I'm not sure if my experiences are exactly the same as yours though. To me, the shaking or judder of the vehicle on overrun was a similar feeling to the entire engine/transmission moving on its mounts, but I was told this was impossible. (Aeons ago I had an Austin Kimberley, and th engine mounts were large blocks of rubber attached to metal brackets one end of which was bolted tot he engine, the other to the chassis.) I'm trying to be clear, but can't help but think I'm getting vaguer with each attempt... My apologies, if so.

    Cheers,

    Michael P

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    Quote Originally Posted by Morpheus View Post
    Interesting thread this. It just confirms my opinion about avoiding any modern car with an automatic transmission. My company supplied car - an Aurion - has a trendy 6 speed 'intelligent automatic', and while it does not have intermittent problems, its characterstics are terrible. The time between hitting the gas and foward propulsion can be very disconcerting at times. Especially when youre in a hurry.
    Hi Morpheus, et al,

    I wouldn't be too hard on modern transmissions, though my brother-in-law has the same complaints about his Aurion.

    Poor autos seem to be the domain of French cars - the Germans seem to have it down pat. As do the Koreans - my wife's i30 is just wonderful for smoothness, speed of changes, and being in the right gear.

    Cheers,

    Michael P

  25. #25
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    I am pretty sure that the french dont make the auto gearbox in the 308 2.0 L diesel. From memory its "Aisin" brand from Japan. I am pretty happy with the auto on my Mazda 3 sp23.
    I own a 206 as my runabout car, but stories like this really put me off getting another Pug for a family car. I hope Peugeot can get a handle on quality pretty soon.

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