Braided brake lines - 205 Si
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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Default Braided brake lines - 205 Si

    Hi all,

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    A colleague has gifted me a set of unused braided brake lines from his 205 GTi. I'm trying to work out whether they would fit onto the Si.

    A few questions:

    (1) Does anyone have any experience with fitting braided lines to the Si, and even better specific knowledge of fitting lines that are specced for the GTi?

    (2) These lines are unused but have been in storage for several years. Are there any concerns re: rubber deterioration etc?

    (3) The lines don't have any markings on them re: standards etc. I assume this will make them illegal for road use in Australia?

    Cheers
    1992 205 Si
    Current: shortened diff (4.4), short shifter, group N top mounts, rebuilt engine and box, solid engine mounts, 1.75" exhaust, strut brace, OMP wheel, GTI suspension & subframe front and rear, lowered 30mm front and rear, solid rear bush, Koni yellows, 306 XT front discs and calipers, ADR compliant braided brake lines, 14" rallye wheels, Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Spec tyres, immobiliser

  2. #2
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    Well, had them fitted by accident (forgot they were in the boot of the car and were installed at the same time as the 306 calipers and discs) and now 2 weeks later the pedal has gone straight to the floor.

    Going to see what it will cost to have Pittwater Brake and Clutch make up some custom, ADR compliant lines.
    1992 205 Si
    Current: shortened diff (4.4), short shifter, group N top mounts, rebuilt engine and box, solid engine mounts, 1.75" exhaust, strut brace, OMP wheel, GTI suspension & subframe front and rear, lowered 30mm front and rear, solid rear bush, Koni yellows, 306 XT front discs and calipers, ADR compliant braided brake lines, 14" rallye wheels, Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Spec tyres, immobiliser

  3. #3
    1000+ Posts alan moore's Avatar
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    I am very happy with the Goodridge lines I bought from the UK for the Alpine. About 50 Pounds posted for the four hoses. They are compliant with our regs.
    '56 Renault 750 (16TS Power)
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  4. #4
    1000+ Posts robmac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Langers View Post
    Well, had them fitted by accident (forgot they were in the boot of the car and were installed at the same time as the 306 calipers and discs) and now 2 weeks later the pedal has gone straight to the floor.

    Going to see what it will cost to have Pittwater Brake and Clutch make up some custom, ADR compliant lines.
    Any company that has the Brakequip hose and crimp system can make ADR approved braided lines.

    The same fittings as neoprene lines are used except a neoprene crimping sleeve is fitted over the braided line under the crimp ferrule.

    Typical 300mm hoses in neoprene cost around $22 each, in braided around $ 38 each. These are trade inc GST prices.

    http://www.brakequip.com.au/media


    http://www.brakequip.com.au/braided-hoses

  5. #5
    1000+ Posts jo proffi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Langers View Post
    Going to see what it will cost to have Pittwater Brake and Clutch make up some custom, ADR compliant lines.
    His blank stock has a slightly different collar to what the fuego has, and althought they look identical on the bench, the difference becomes obvious when you try and fit a horse shue clip in and it wont go on without a heap of swear words.

    I'm not saying they wont fit your car, but like any after market non OE product, there is usually some degree of incompatibility.

    If I had mine re made, and I might well do that in a year or so, I'd be getting these collars machined right before the hose was crimped together.



    Jo

  6. #6
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    The car will be at their workshop so they can sort out the fittings.
    1992 205 Si
    Current: shortened diff (4.4), short shifter, group N top mounts, rebuilt engine and box, solid engine mounts, 1.75" exhaust, strut brace, OMP wheel, GTI suspension & subframe front and rear, lowered 30mm front and rear, solid rear bush, Koni yellows, 306 XT front discs and calipers, ADR compliant braided brake lines, 14" rallye wheels, Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Spec tyres, immobiliser

  7. #7
    1000+ Posts robmac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jo proffi View Post
    His blank stock has a slightly different collar to what the fuego has, and althought they look identical on the bench, the difference becomes obvious when you try and fit a horse shue clip in and it wont go on without a heap of swear words.

    I'm not saying they wont fit your car, but like any after market non OE product, there is usually some degree of incompatibility.

    If I had mine re made, and I might well do that in a year or so, I'd be getting these collars machined right before the hose was crimped together.



    Jo
    Take in some old hoses and they can refit them to new lines.

    It's best to remove the ferrule your self. I grind the steel off with the hose in place and shave the hose with a sharp blade.

    Mark sure there are no marks or scratches on the fitting where they go into hose.

    Or ask the the dude to supply brakequip clips as well.

  8. #8
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    Car was towed up this morning, will find out this arvo how much braided lines for a 205 cost...
    1992 205 Si
    Current: shortened diff (4.4), short shifter, group N top mounts, rebuilt engine and box, solid engine mounts, 1.75" exhaust, strut brace, OMP wheel, GTI suspension & subframe front and rear, lowered 30mm front and rear, solid rear bush, Koni yellows, 306 XT front discs and calipers, ADR compliant braided brake lines, 14" rallye wheels, Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Spec tyres, immobiliser

  9. #9
    1000+ Posts jo proffi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Langers View Post
    Car was towed up this morning, will find out this arvo how much braided lines for a 205 cost...
    DO you live up the back of nth Narrabeen by chance??


    Jo

  10. #10
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    No, if I did I would have pushed it to the workshop!
    1992 205 Si
    Current: shortened diff (4.4), short shifter, group N top mounts, rebuilt engine and box, solid engine mounts, 1.75" exhaust, strut brace, OMP wheel, GTI suspension & subframe front and rear, lowered 30mm front and rear, solid rear bush, Koni yellows, 306 XT front discs and calipers, ADR compliant braided brake lines, 14" rallye wheels, Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Spec tyres, immobiliser

  11. #11
    1000+ Posts jo proffi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Langers View Post
    No, if I did I would have pushed it to the workshop!
    Dont laugh, being brought up on Powderworks road(the main road that leads down to narabeen brakes) I have rolled down the hill and either pushed it to the caltex, or to the sparky at the far end of the shops.

    I only asked because there is a nest of 205's and pugs up the back end of NN, and I thought maybe it was you who owned them.


    Jo

  12. #12
    I might be slow... DRTDVL's Avatar
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    any chance it's the master cylinder's seals and not the lines?

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRTDVL View Post
    any chance it's the master cylinder's seals and not the lines?
    Of course, but common sense says that it would be one of the components replaced in the past 3 weeks - the front calipers, rear hard line or one of the braided hoses - unless the MC was damaged somehow during the bleeding process.

    Funnily enough, the brake shop said that testing the master cylinder with braided lines in place is difficult as normally you'd clamp off the brake hoses and test the MC, but you can't do that with braided lines.
    1992 205 Si
    Current: shortened diff (4.4), short shifter, group N top mounts, rebuilt engine and box, solid engine mounts, 1.75" exhaust, strut brace, OMP wheel, GTI suspension & subframe front and rear, lowered 30mm front and rear, solid rear bush, Koni yellows, 306 XT front discs and calipers, ADR compliant braided brake lines, 14" rallye wheels, Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Spec tyres, immobiliser

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by jo proffi View Post
    Dont laugh, being brought up on Powderworks road(the main road that leads down to narabeen brakes) I have rolled down the hill and either pushed it to the caltex, or to the sparky at the far end of the shops.

    I only asked because there is a nest of 205's and pugs up the back end of NN, and I thought maybe it was you who owned them.


    Jo
    How many constitutes a nest?

    Quite a shame that when I see a 205 on the road (very rarely) it's usually a cosmetic sh!tbox. Where are the mint, one owner, 10,000kms pared in an airconditioned bubble 205s?
    1992 205 Si
    Current: shortened diff (4.4), short shifter, group N top mounts, rebuilt engine and box, solid engine mounts, 1.75" exhaust, strut brace, OMP wheel, GTI suspension & subframe front and rear, lowered 30mm front and rear, solid rear bush, Koni yellows, 306 XT front discs and calipers, ADR compliant braided brake lines, 14" rallye wheels, Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Spec tyres, immobiliser

  15. #15
    I might be slow... DRTDVL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Langers View Post
    Of course, but common sense says that it would be one of the components replaced in the past 3 weeks - the front calipers, rear hard line or one of the braided hoses - unless the MC was damaged somehow during the bleeding process.

    Funnily enough, the brake shop said that testing the master cylinder with braided lines in place is difficult as normally you'd clamp off the brake hoses and test the MC, but you can't do that with braided lines.
    i've had the same problem twice now, both times it's been the old seals on the master after a bleed.

    Is there any fluid missing? You'd expect that if your lines where damaged and leaking.

  16. #16
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    Didn't even bother looking. I leave for work in the dark and come home in the dark so if there's an issue, off to the mechanic it goes.
    1992 205 Si
    Current: shortened diff (4.4), short shifter, group N top mounts, rebuilt engine and box, solid engine mounts, 1.75" exhaust, strut brace, OMP wheel, GTI suspension & subframe front and rear, lowered 30mm front and rear, solid rear bush, Koni yellows, 306 XT front discs and calipers, ADR compliant braided brake lines, 14" rallye wheels, Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Spec tyres, immobiliser

  17. #17
    1000+ Posts jo proffi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Langers View Post
    How many constitutes a nest?

    Quite a shame that when I see a 205 on the road (very rarely) it's usually a cosmetic sh!tbox. Where are the mint, one owner, 10,000kms pared in an airconditioned bubble 205s?
    More than one.
    Jo

  18. #18
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    So, labour $88 p/h, with 3 hrs required lines about $70 each, so total will be >$550. Once those are installed we can determine whether it is OK or whether the MC needs replacement.

    Expensive exercise.
    1992 205 Si
    Current: shortened diff (4.4), short shifter, group N top mounts, rebuilt engine and box, solid engine mounts, 1.75" exhaust, strut brace, OMP wheel, GTI suspension & subframe front and rear, lowered 30mm front and rear, solid rear bush, Koni yellows, 306 XT front discs and calipers, ADR compliant braided brake lines, 14" rallye wheels, Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Spec tyres, immobiliser

  19. #19
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    Diagnosis: dead MC. $212 for genuine replacement plus about another hour's labour. So, will get a small amount of change from $1000.
    1992 205 Si
    Current: shortened diff (4.4), short shifter, group N top mounts, rebuilt engine and box, solid engine mounts, 1.75" exhaust, strut brace, OMP wheel, GTI suspension & subframe front and rear, lowered 30mm front and rear, solid rear bush, Koni yellows, 306 XT front discs and calipers, ADR compliant braided brake lines, 14" rallye wheels, Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Spec tyres, immobiliser

  20. #20
    I might be slow... DRTDVL's Avatar
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    damm sorry to hear that man... Did you get the old lines back? You could sell them off to recop some $$$

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Langers View Post
    Diagnosis: dead MC. $212 for genuine replacement plus about another hour's labour. So, will get a small amount of change from $1000.
    You should have looked for any leaks first.
    If none then the only thing it could have been was the MC.
    In any case why would new hoses split for no reason? I've got hoses that are 60 years old on one of my cars, no not the rally 203 I'm not that mad!
    I think you bought the wrong car if you want to pay people to fix it, just not economical.
    Graham

  22. #22
    1000+ Posts cam85's Avatar
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    He did say he leaves in the dark and gets home in the dark ( at the moment, exscuse expires in summer langers...)

    I hear your frustrations though mate, you sometimes just want things fixed and cant be arsed yourself, saves throwing a spanner through the windscreen too... !

    Cam
    94 205 Gti Classic #9
    91 205 Si
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    http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/res...-race-car.html

  23. #23
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    Usual work day is 14 - 18 hours plus travel time, at least 5 days a week, so no chance during the week, and the 1 - 2 day weekend has to be for relaxation or I'd go mad. Fighting with rusty fasteners on a 20 year old French car isn't my idea of therapy!
    1992 205 Si
    Current: shortened diff (4.4), short shifter, group N top mounts, rebuilt engine and box, solid engine mounts, 1.75" exhaust, strut brace, OMP wheel, GTI suspension & subframe front and rear, lowered 30mm front and rear, solid rear bush, Koni yellows, 306 XT front discs and calipers, ADR compliant braided brake lines, 14" rallye wheels, Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Spec tyres, immobiliser

  24. #24
    1000+ Posts cam85's Avatar
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    Far out man. You work down deep holes or something? I work 7days but only from 630 till about 330 with Sunday arvos off. When you get 18seconds to think about meeting up or if you need some work done on the 205, let me know.

    Cam
    94 205 Gti Classic #9
    91 205 Si
    87 205 GTi Race Car
    http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/res...-race-car.html

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS View Post
    You should have looked for any leaks first.
    If none then the only thing it could have been was the MC.
    In any case why would new hoses split for no reason? I've got hoses that are 60 years old on one of my cars, no not the rally 203 I'm not that mad!
    I think you bought the wrong car if you want to pay people to fix it, just not economical.
    Graham
    On the hoses, they were years old with no known history (but believed to be at least 8 years old), weren't a complete set and weren't ADR compliant. They were accidentally installed (I left them in the boot at the last service) and was planning on having ADR compliant lines fitted anyway, the MC failure just expedited the work so I can't complain about that.
    1992 205 Si
    Current: shortened diff (4.4), short shifter, group N top mounts, rebuilt engine and box, solid engine mounts, 1.75" exhaust, strut brace, OMP wheel, GTI suspension & subframe front and rear, lowered 30mm front and rear, solid rear bush, Koni yellows, 306 XT front discs and calipers, ADR compliant braided brake lines, 14" rallye wheels, Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Spec tyres, immobiliser

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