Rear Parcel Shelf For Speakers
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  1. #1
    Member PugFunk's Avatar
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    Icon7 Rear Parcel Shelf For Speakers

    Hey everyone.

    Currently I have a system installed but i wish to put my speakers on the parcel shelf hanging up so they dont take up the precious boot space in my hatch back.

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    Ive seen 'acoustic parcel shelfs' for sale in England etc. But not in Aussie. Im probably more interested in making my own because i wanted to make it out of plexi glass but then theifs would see my setup...

    Anyway does anybody know where i can get those in Adelaide or know where i can get plans or specs on how to make my own.

    Cheers
    From your fello content french car owner

  2. #2
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
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    Pugfunk
    You have a sub in your boot, yes? Speakers in your parcel shelf could run into some loading issues beacuse the bass pressure causes undue push on the back of the (parcel shelf) speakers. You wont hear it but it is there. This will eventually ruing your cone or your spider/voice coil & your loosing valuable bass sound if they are not necesarily playing in phase. (Meaning the small amount of bass sound the rear speakers are making is out of time with the sub, this can cause distortion & some bass sound loss.)

    BUT!.... you can still build a parcel shelf. I suggest you make your own from MDF sheeting and then cover it in black cabinet cloth. Then run the better/bigger/louder speakers up front (you want the sound infront of you coming at you, not from behind you) and run smaller speakers in the rear parcel shelf. Then bandpass the smaller speakers (150Hz to 3Khz) so they worlk as fill in, not overpowering any of the other speakers and let the sub (which works from 100Hz and down) do what its gotta do.

    If you need more detail let me know, but you need to be handy with wood, glue & power tools if you want a good DIY job.... - Chris

    ps. I know you don't like spending money on so called "pros" but there is an art to making car audio sound good. What you have now might seem/sound good to you, but when compared to a car thats been done properly the difference will be obvious...



    PSS, i noticed in your other thread you wanted to mount a sub on there, mate PLEASE don't do this. I don't recommend free-to-air sub set ups nor do i they sound good. They are dangerous (in heavy braking/collision they rip out and turn into missiles!!) & just not a good way to go about things. Hope you decide on a removable boxed sub for your 206.
    Last edited by CHRI'S16; 28th February 2006 at 12:41 PM.
    ... ptui!

  3. #3
    sans witticism SLC206's Avatar
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    For the same reasons I'm always wary of suggesting "home-made" parcel trays out of wood with heavy speakers mounted to them. As long as it's designed a little like the original (ie. sandwiched in when the hatch is shut so it can't come loose) then it's ok.
    Regards,

    Simon

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    Default Hey

    thanks guys. Good input.

    Not sure i understand about the mistiming of the speakers and sub though.

    Today i built my own parcel shelf. Went out and got 18mm MDF white board material and got cracking. I decided a little while ago that i wouldnt put the sub in the parcel shelf. If you buy a 'open air sub' made for open air use it can sound good. But not in small air spaces i found out (did more research today).

    Thing is.. I was planing on putting the amp mounted to the home made parcel shelf. With 2 speaker outputs (going to my 6x9's on the top) and the 1 sub output.

    Im not sure what you ment about the displacement. But by having the amp so close to both units, same length of wire etc fix the problem or is the problem about the air displacement made by the sub.

    Btw. I saw the nicest sub for my car today.. It comes in 15" boxed.. Orange like my car... perfect match.. i think its way to big though so im going to get its littler brother in the 10" and i was going to put the sub mounted upwards from the boot floor directed at sound ports i am making in my parcel shelf.

    I dont know the brand of speaker, starts with a C, cladence or something but they have a range of orange speakers. Would look soooo nice in my car:p.

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    Oh also. My parcel tray worked out alot better than i expected actualy. Made of MDF and it has a metal dowl at one end that fits into that hook shaped plastic part so it lifts up and secures nicely. It is also buffeted by the rubber knobs on the boot door.

    All up. I am very glad with how it worked out... Took a while to plan but i was a carpenter for a while so im good with a jigsaw and glue. Im also thinking of securing the shelf to the main body of the car through the boot floor or something. That way it wont come out in a accedent and also if i secure my stuff into the parcel shelf it will be almost un-nickable if i conect the parcel shelf to the car.

    Otherwise some DUD! could just brake in and take the whole shelf.. LOL

    Any sugestions where i could conect it - eg seat bolt but i dont want to fiddle wit the seats

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    Icon13

    one more thing.. lol.. sorry

    What do people think of those hatchback subs you can buy with the amp included in the cylinder shape thing.

    Ive only hurd of them recently. I relise there are some sound pro's here so id love to know if im better off getting my own sub with box + amp or getting that little packaged thing.

    It is alot of money for me to buy sub and amp and im thinking in terms of im going be shitting myself if it all gets stolen because im at the age where nothing is insureable unless im willing to spend 2 grand a year

  7. #7
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PugFunk
    thanks guys. Good input.

    Not sure i understand about the mistiming of the speakers and sub though.

    If you buy a 'open air sub' made for open air use it can sound good. But not in small air spaces i found out (did more research today).

    Thing is.. I was planing on putting the amp mounted to the home made parcel shelf. With 2 speaker outputs (going to my 6x9's on the top) and the 1 sub output.

    Im not sure what you ment about the displacement. But by having the amp so close to both units, same length of wire etc fix the problem or is the problem about the air displacement made by the sub.
    You have lots to learn my friend. This is why a good installer is worth his money.
    Ok the miss timing refers to the SOUND WAVES. Sound maves that are 180degress out of phase (all in the timing) cancels each other out. In previous posts you said that you had loud speakers in the rear. This works against your sub set up, because the bass frequencies that they play cancel out some of the sub sound/frequencies. Its minor but it is there.
    You can do lost of reading & studiying about how sound waves travel & about how sine (music waves too) work, but it more than I car to type.
    Doesn't matter if the shelf is tight, if the speaker is not in extra tight they will rip out of its mount and come flying out. Why do you think to end comp cars DO NOT have big speakers in the back?? I suggest you do more research mate.
    BTW so I don't seem like a knooob, I' did car audio at a very high level for years for a living, and now just do odd jobs here and there. Soon you will learn to get over the huge sound in your car, as just a simple 2 speaker set-up in your home can sound soooo much better.
    BUT its your car so do as you please. - Chris
    ... ptui!

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    Hmmm i am a technical engineer / co producer at a record company in Adelaide. I know about sound, just not car sound, never had to deal with the speaker side of it. In terms of sound i really need to have good quality speakers so i can listen to clients work etc without having to think about the differnce in sound because of the speakers.

    All this car set up stuff actualy sounds interesting, its making me think in looking into a TAFE course or something on it. Coz i really wana get it right, and one of the main reasons i am putting it in myself is i enjoy doing things. Its not just the fun of buying all the stuff and listening to all the equipment but also putting it together.

    I could tell you how to set up a sound studio but not a car:s.

    My studio has 10 grand worth in 2 speakers... lol... there not outragiously loud speakers, but they just are really good quality, able to play all frequencies corectally.

    As for this statment Chris "Why do you think to end comp cars DO NOT have big speakers in the back??"

    I didnt buy a peugeot to go fast. Im not into fast cars, more into cruising but yeah i did mention about securing my speakers very firmly... locking them into place mainly for the reason of theft but also sudden stops etc.

    Where would you go to learn more about car audio?
    Where did you guys learn??

  9. #9
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PugFunk
    Hmmm i am a technical engineer / co producer at a record company in Adelaide. I know about sound, just not car sound, never had to deal with the speaker side of it. In terms of sound i really need to have good quality speakers so i can listen to clients work etc without having to think about the differnce in sound because of the speakers.
    I too have worked in the Music Business. My family owned our own digital (although we did have a reel to reel too) recording studio, with A&H desk, countless Alesis modules on miles of racks. Cubase PRO at the time was the program to have, both an Apple Mc & a PC, countless MIDI modules etc... So in short I too know about sound. Hence I'm suprised you didnt' realise that two exact sound waves 180' out of phase cancel eahc other out. Hence when you have loud rear speakers producing bass, and a sub producing bass you are going to see loses. You say you want good quality, but why at the back.... In the other thread you clearly wrote that you had bigger & louder speakers at the back, you don't sit/drive in the back.... unless you stop to listen to all your clients music at the park? For REAL quality sound, your money yould be spent on source (head unit), amplification, front stage and INSTALLATION... the best gear in the world sounds crap when you don't know how to get the most from it. Excessive Subs, parcel shelf and rears speakers are for amatuers. < thats a full stop.

    All this car set up stuff actualy sounds interesting, its making me think in looking into a TAFE course or something on it. Coz i really wana get it right, and one of the main reasons i am putting it in myself is i enjoy doing things. Its not just the fun of buying all the stuff and listening to all the equipment but also putting it together.

    I could tell you how to set up a sound studio but not a car:s.
    I'm sure you could tell me how to do a studio, so could I. Difference is I know both (cars & studios). I might not be Al Sealrsmen or Fishman, but my customers are rearely unhappy, and we have stacks of trophies to show for old work too.
    There is a TAFE course you can do, it covers car audio, alarm & central locking, mobile comms/sat nav & some trimming.

    My studio has 10 grand worth in 2 speakers... lol... there not outragiously loud speakers, but they just are really good quality, able to play all frequencies corectally.
    I think you mean it plays music with minimal colouration or distortion. BTW 10K is not heaps in speakers, Focal make top end hi-fi speakers for over 100K each..... I have personally heard Duntechs ($20k a pair), Triangles 5's ($10k a pair) and Mission ($3000 a pair) but they all seemed coloured next to my trusty pair of old Tannoy studios.... $$$ only takes you so far.

    As for this statment Chris "Why do you think to end comp cars DO NOT have big speakers in the back??"

    I didnt buy a peugeot to go fast. Im not into fast cars, more into cruising but yeah i did mention about securing my speakers very firmly... locking them into place mainly for the reason of theft but also sudden stops etc.
    I think you missed the point, fast or not, competition car audio cars have their money spent at the front stage (thats amplification & front speakers & installation) because good installers know you listen to music from the front, not from the rear. If your worried about theft then a good installer can make your set up invisible, or like it was a factory installation. Not all installs are about bling & neons.
    Unfortunately you have a problem in that you got a pug & a 206 is worse. (I'm pug man too) but they are just poor for car audio. Poor materials combined with questionable build quality and the crap off-axis speaker placement for the front door speaker mean the 206 is not a car audio friendly car.... Look how close the tweeter & mid on your $$$ speakers are, then look at how far away they are on a 206... you end up with a poor front stage and vauge channel seperation. Or just plain poor sound. Sorry.

    Where would you go to learn more about car audio?
    Where did you guys learn??
    I learnt through several magazines, websites and countless hours of research, plus its what I did for work. - Chris
    Last edited by CHRI'S16; 2nd March 2006 at 06:21 PM.
    ... ptui!

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by CHRI'S16
    BTW so I don't seem like a knooob, I' did car audio at a very high level for years for a living, and now just do odd jobs here and there. Soon you will learn to get over the huge sound in your car, as just a simple 2 speaker set-up in your home can sound soooo much better.
    BUT its your car so do as you please. - Chris
    Totally true. I spent countless hours tweaking my car stereo, sound deadening doors AND built my own Parcel shelf with a 8" free to sub built in (thanks to Chris) and yeah, It sounded OK for a very small outlay. Just spent the time installing things properly and making everything fit just right.

    BUT, after buying a decent home stereo, I realised good sound is not for the car. Youd have to spend thousands in a car to come anywhere near a home stereo.

    Anyway, everythings been taken out now. All I have is the headunit CD and I left the small kenwood amp in to power the fronts (cheap JBL co-axials) thats all you need. I rarely actually have the sound up anyway.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by CHRI'S16
    You have lots to learn my friend.
    BTW so I don't seem like a knooob, I' did car audio at a very high level for years for a living, and now just do odd jobs here and there. - Chris
    Yeah, Chris installed cassette players at a shop in Perisher-Smiggins

    Dave
    Last edited by 68 404; 2nd March 2006 at 07:43 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by PugFunk
    Hmmm i am a technical engineer / co producer at a record company in Adelaide. I know about sound, just not car sound, never had to deal with the speaker side of it. In terms of sound i really need to have good quality speakers so i can listen to clients work etc without having to think about the differnce in sound because of the speakers.

    All this car set up stuff actualy sounds interesting, its making me think in looking into a TAFE course or something on it. Coz i really wana get it right, and one of the main reasons i am putting it in myself is i enjoy doing things. Its not just the fun of buying all the stuff and listening to all the equipment but also putting it together.

    I could tell you how to set up a sound studio but not a car:s.

    My studio has 10 grand worth in 2 speakers... lol... there not outragiously loud speakers, but they just are really good quality, able to play all frequencies corectally.

    As for this statment Chris "Why do you think to end comp cars DO NOT have big speakers in the back??"

    I didnt buy a peugeot to go fast. Im not into fast cars, more into cruising but yeah i did mention about securing my speakers very firmly... locking them into place mainly for the reason of theft but also sudden stops etc.

    Where would you go to learn more about car audio?
    Where did you guys learn??
    Jeeze man, last week you were parking everyone's cars at a hotel (and assessing their abilities in 5 minutes around a city block) and now you are a technical engineer/producer at a record company! And a carpenter!!

    I'll tell you what. Just stop pretending, buy a dictionary, and be yourself instead of trying to impress us. We'd be much more engaging...

    Dave
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  13. #13
    Veni Vidi Posti 68 404's Avatar
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    I love subs!
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    Quote Originally Posted by 68 404
    Yeah, Chris installed cassette players at a shop in Perisher-Smiggins

    Dave
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    Quote Originally Posted by 68 404
    Jeeze man, last week you were parking everyone's cars at a hotel (and assessing their abilities in 5 minutes around a city block) and now you are a technical engineer/producer at a record company! And a carpenter!!

    I'll tell you what. Just stop pretending, buy a dictionary, and be yourself instead of trying to impress us. We'd be much more engaging...

    Dave
    I was thinking the same thing Dave

    Oh and I love subs too. Except my dog chewed through the power cord to it yesterday. Luckily it was switched off at the time. Still tripped the earth leakage protection thing too. So now I have to spend my weekend putting a new power cord on the amp for it.
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by 68 404
    Jeeze man, last week you were parking everyone's cars at a hotel (and assessing their abilities in 5 minutes around a city block)
    Dave
    Whats ironic is I too was a valet driver for the ANA Hotel & Westin Sydney Hotel... but I never worked for a record label.... - Chris

    ps, despite it having any credibility you can tell so much from a cars handling by just parking. You would be suprised how much you can push in a tight car park. My advice to every one, NEVER have your car valet parked. If their anything like me it would be thrased... hows flar changing through the gears with no oil warm up time sound to you
    ... ptui!

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    Quote Originally Posted by CHRI'S16
    You're bored aren't your Dave? - Chris
    Yeah....

    No one else was taking the bait

    Dave
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    Hey. I have 4 jobs guys... i know.. 4 jobs

    i do alot of things. I am a musician, i play almost every instrument but piano. Ive played with people like james morrison etc. I work at a record company and i am going to start my own up soon as possible. I am a licenced roofer and i work in multimedia as well as at a hotel vallet parking.

    And yes , I to would never get my car vallet parked. Im not one that trashes them but my mates there do sometimes... makes it obvious why insurence is so high for under 25 males. pfft.

    I did know about acoustic noise canceling chris mate but ive never had to bother with it kinda thing. I took a few music-physics classes on how to build instruments and stuff and i know about you can play certain frequencies that drown out others. Hence acoustic noise canceling headphones.

    I just figured that it wouldnt be to much of a hassle. BTW i do listen to my music from the boot sometimes:p when im out at parks and stuff with mates on a ovel. Just lift the boot and crank it:p...

    I always wanted to aim the 6x9s towards the driver. Even if i put them in the back seats lol.. i did think of that.. would look odd though:p

    Thanks for the help though guys i might look into the more expensive sound deadening. or even more of the spray on stuff, just fill up the entire doors with it:s... i still havnt touched the dash yet though. Im afraid to fiddle around inside there with sound proofing, you dont know what wires you might disrupt.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 68 404
    Jeeze man, last week you were parking everyone's cars at a hotel (and assessing their abilities in 5 minutes around a city block) and now you are a technical engineer/producer at a record company! And a carpenter!!

    I'll tell you what. Just stop pretending, buy a dictionary, and be yourself instead of trying to impress us. We'd be much more engaging...

    Dave
    Mate you know nothing about me. Dont accuse me of lying. Why would i ever try to impress you...

    Im on this forum for friendly advice like Chris just gave me (thanks chris) not to be judged by someone i dont give a dam about.

    Also a guy told me a pair of 2way coaxles are far better then a pair of 3way 6x9s. Is that true and for wat reason? better signal to the speaker??

    I thought the whole reason behind the 6x9 was that it resembles a 8" thereore plays a larger range of frequencies in some cases illiminating the need for a sub for people who dont want to outlay them.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by PugFunk
    Mate you know nothing about me. Dont accuse me of lying. Why would i ever try to impress you...

    Im on this forum for friendly advice like Chris just gave me (thanks chris) not to be judged by someone i dont give a dam about.

    Also a guy told me a pair of 2way coaxles are far better then a pair of 3way 6x9s. Is that true and for wat reason? better signal to the speaker??

    I thought the whole reason behind the 6x9 was that it resembles a 8" thereore plays a larger range of frequencies in some cases illiminating the need for a sub for people who dont want to outlay them.
    I DO know that you have driven ALL cars, can assess their abilities in minutes around a city block, and now know that you can play almost EVERY instrument save a piano. You must be a hoot on the harpsichord though...

    Errata:

    'Mate you know nothing about me'. [Well for a start, I know you have bad grammar...]

    'Dont accuse me of lying'. [If there is ANY instrument (apart from a piano) that you cannot play with some proficiency you have exposed yourself to derision. Oh, and the word 'don't' is a shortened version of 'do not' and the apostrophe goes where the missing letter would be]

    'Why would i ever try to impress you...' [Apart from the lack of capitalisation of the 'i', a sentence beginning with the word 'why' is surely a question, and therefore needs the appropriate end marker]

    'Im on this forum...not to be judged by someone I don't give a dam about' ['I'm' is a shortened form of 'I am' therefore you are missing an apostrophe (again). A 'dam' is a body of water and sometimes even a female horse but I think the homophonic name you are looking for is 'damn'. Yes, it has an entirely different meaning!]

    '2 way coaxles' [Sounds like something you should have next to a differential. Surely you mean 'coaxials'??? I'll forgive your use of the word 'wat']

    'illiminating the need for a sub for people who don't want to outlay them' [Just bad grammar again. And 'thereore', 'illiminating', and 'dont' should, of course, be 'therefore' and 'eliminating' and 'don't'].

    I am pleased to be of assistance with your English skills.

    I agree that Chris is well qualified to provide audio and JA information but for someone who is so deeply involved in the sound industry on what seems to be on a multi level basis your lack of basic accoustic knowledge is profound. And that, my friend, casts serious doubt upon all your claims.

    Four jobs? 1. Musician 2. Record Company guy. 3. Roofer 4. Valet
    What about the carpentry? Or have we forgotten that claim already?

    Dave
    Last edited by 68 404; 4th March 2006 at 10:03 AM.
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    Making fun of someone because there dislexic. How low could you go man...

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    Default Grammar what about spelling??

    I thought this was a friendly sight, what is with all the negativity.

    By the way Dave the word 'acoustic' has one "C" at the start not 2. So when you start bad-mouthing someone on their grammar. You might want to back it up by using a dictionary.

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    Being dyslectic is a learning disorder, not an excuse to omit punctuation and use poor spelling. I also think you that if you were diagnosed with this malady you would know how to spell it. It must make reading music hell, and have been a severe impediment to attaining all your achievements across fields as diverse as music to roofing.

    Sorry, I simply don't believe anything you say.

    I don't want to pick a blue with you, just stop trying to impress by making stuff up. This is not a chatroom for 15 year olds. Every post you make gets more far fetched and erodes your credibility. Ask a question without embellishment and tap into this vast reservoir of knowledge. I think you will be surprised at what you can get out of it.

    So here's the deal. 'Post without boast' should be your mantra. Humour is always welcome, but remember humility. Ignorance is not a bad thing, why do you think we are all on here? We want to learn from each other. We have young guys still at school posting, the lovely ladies, lovers of old and new Pugs, and cranky pr1cks like me. We go all the way up to God aka Graham...

    Dave
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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by BIKEPUG
    I thought this was a friendly sight, what is with all the negativity.

    By the way Dave the word 'acoustic' has one "C" at the start not 2. So when you start bad-mouthing someone on their grammar. You might want to back it up by using a dictionary.
    Ahh, the voice of a new member.

    'Acoustic' does have 2 c's but not together. I will self flagellate for this oversight.

    BTW, how about a question mark after 'negativity'? And it's a site, not a 'sight'. Oh, and your last two sentences are clauses (in their current usage), not sentences...

    BikePug, I seem to be Robinson Crusoe questioning the veracity of PugFunk's claims. If no one else objects to be treated like a fool (blankly accepting whatever is posted), so be it. You may recall that each of my posts has told him to just leave the lies behind and post 'normally'.

    Remember, blithely accepting a poster's claim is not what a forum is all about...

    Dave
    Last edited by 68 404; 4th March 2006 at 08:11 PM.
    2008 Renault Laguna 2.0 dCi break
    ​1997 BMW K1200RS

    IR655
    (George Bush Snr): "I'll never apologize for the United States of America. Ever, I don't care what the facts are."


  25. #25
    Member PugFunk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Adelaide
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    Reading music has nothing to do with dislexia dude.

    Not being able to read and write till year 6 and getting d's and b's backwards etc has nothing to do with reading black dots on a page. But then your not dislexic. so how would you know.

    This isnt a limbo contest but you sure have stooped the lowest. Im not a lier. How bout you come to Adelaide and ill not only prove all i have said but also pull ya hand out of your ass. Dont be so agressive. Get out more !

    Your clearly married or just dont get any because of how agrivated you are... i never asked you to respond to post so why dont in future you just not...

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