Fitting GTDT engine to petrol Peugeot 505
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  1. #1
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    Default Fitting GTDT engine to petrol Peugeot 505

    Does anyone have any experience of having effectively fitted a GTDT engine and gearbox to a petrol 505. Is it worth the effort?

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  2. #2
    Demannu-facturing! Demannu's Avatar
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    If you can find a source of GTDT motors, I'll take one too

    If you do do the job, make sure you get the following with the engine:

    Engine
    Gearbox (different bell housing and input shaft)
    Flywheel (about twice the thickness, and different stud pattern)
    Clutch (heavier)
    Clutch fork and thrust bearing
    Clutch slave cylinder (there are two types, make sure you have the one for your bell housing)
    Turbo dump pipe (very expensive to have made if you haven't got it)
    Engine mounts (different)
    Engine bay fuel filter and lift pump (bastard to start from first build or if you run out of fuel without this)
    Radiator, hoses, fans, overflow bottle, etc (a completely different system)
    Alternator and brackets (saves mucking around getting pulleys lined up)
    Power steering pump, hoses and brackets (as above, and the brackets are different to the petrol ones)
    Differential (much taller ratio - about 3.7:1 as opposed to 3.889:1 for petrol)
    Speedo cable, and if possible, correct speedo (you'll never get it anywhere near accurate again, otherwise)

    If you've got all of the above, it is a fairly bolt-out-bolt-in affair.
    My question would be why not just get a GTDT? It would also probably be easier to start with a diesel car, then you've got the right diff, gearbox, etc.

    Good luck, and keep us posted.
    Scotty

    Melbourne - Dandenong Ranges

    1956 Peugeot 403 - 'Francois' - resto project

    1969 Peugeot 504 - 'Pascal' - daily driver project

    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility - 'Brutus' - resto project

    1978 Peugeot 604 - as yet unnamed - V6 on straight LPG

    1987 Peugeot 505 - as yet unnamed - project car

    1999 Peugeot 406 Coupé - 'Chloe' - 5 speed manual

    2011 Peugeot 3008 XTE HDi - 'Zoe' - hatchback on steroids

    2014 Peugeot RCZ - 'Remy'

    1999 Range Rover 4.6 HSE - 'Grover' - tow car

  3. #3
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    Dear Scott,
    Many thanks for your helpful reply. I have been travelling hence my slow response! My situation is that I have a 1986 GTDT that has been in an accident with all the left hand side damaged. The mechanics are fine except for the steering mechanism and I am looking for an option with a very good motor. When I bought it, I had trouble with the cylinder head in the pre-combustion chamber and ended up buying a new head. When fitting it, I found that the new head had been modified, probably to correct a design fault. This particular vehicle was one of eight imported into Australia. Another diesel seems hard to find and I have just purchase a 1990 S/W 505GR .At least I have a few things I can put on the new vehicle to dress it up, including the mag. wheels. I have been told I would also need to change the wiring loom.I would appreciate any further comments!
    Regards, Peter
    Quote Originally Posted by Demannu
    If you can find a source of GTDT motors, I'll take one too

    If you do do the job, make sure you get the following with the engine:

    Engine
    Gearbox (different bell housing and input shaft)
    Flywheel (about twice the thickness, and different stud pattern)
    Clutch (heavier)
    Clutch fork and thrust bearing
    Clutch slave cylinder (there are two types, make sure you have the one for your bell housing)
    Turbo dump pipe (very expensive to have made if you haven't got it)
    Engine mounts (different)
    Engine bay fuel filter and lift pump (bastard to start from first build or if you run out of fuel without this)
    Radiator, hoses, fans, overflow bottle, etc (a completely different system)
    Alternator and brackets (saves mucking around getting pulleys lined up)
    Power steering pump, hoses and brackets (as above, and the brackets are different to the petrol ones)
    Differential (much taller ratio - about 3.7:1 as opposed to 3.889:1 for petrol)
    Speedo cable, and if possible, correct speedo (you'll never get it anywhere near accurate again, otherwise)

    If you've got all of the above, it is a fairly bolt-out-bolt-in affair.
    My question would be why not just get a GTDT? It would also probably be easier to start with a diesel car, then you've got the right diff, gearbox, etc.

    Good luck, and keep us posted.

  4. #4
    Demannu-facturing! Demannu's Avatar
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    With a bit of creative adaptation, you can get away without changing your wiring loom. Just modify the ends of some of the wires so they still fit on the new connections. For example, the ignition switched 12v wire would go to the injector pump solenoid instead. The pulsed ignition coil lead would go to your tacho pickup. Oil pressure switch wires, alternator wires, etc, all have to go to the same item, just perhaps a different spot in the engine bay, so some lengthening or shortening may be required.

    My only other comment is that the wagon differential is usually up around 4.11:1 or 4.22:1, so it is definately too high for the diesel. Unfortunately, they're the only diffs avaliable for the RWD pug wagons, but if you know a good machinist you can dismantle a sedan diff and have the crown wheel and pinion fitted to the wagon diff. A lot of mucking around though.

    If you decide not to use the GTDT engine, I would be interested in it. Was it automatic or manual? If it's a manual box, you would also need to extensively modify your rear gearbox mount to support it in a wagon.

    Scott



    Quote Originally Posted by PeterR
    Dear Scott,
    Many thanks for your helpful reply. I have been travelling hence my slow response! My situation is that I have a 1986 GTDT that has been in an accident with all the left hand side damaged. The mechanics are fine except for the steering mechanism and I am looking for an option with a very good motor. When I bought it, I had trouble with the cylinder head in the pre-combustion chamber and ended up buying a new head. When fitting it, I found that the new head had been modified, probably to correct a design fault. This particular vehicle was one of eight imported into Australia. Another diesel seems hard to find and I have just purchase a 1990 S/W 505GR .At least I have a few things I can put on the new vehicle to dress it up, including the mag. wheels. I have been told I would also need to change the wiring loom.I would appreciate any further comments!
    Regards, Peter
    Scotty

    Melbourne - Dandenong Ranges

    1956 Peugeot 403 - 'Francois' - resto project

    1969 Peugeot 504 - 'Pascal' - daily driver project

    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility - 'Brutus' - resto project

    1978 Peugeot 604 - as yet unnamed - V6 on straight LPG

    1987 Peugeot 505 - as yet unnamed - project car

    1999 Peugeot 406 Coupé - 'Chloe' - 5 speed manual

    2011 Peugeot 3008 XTE HDi - 'Zoe' - hatchback on steroids

    2014 Peugeot RCZ - 'Remy'

    1999 Range Rover 4.6 HSE - 'Grover' - tow car

  5. #5
    1000+ Posts HONG KONG PUGGY's Avatar
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    Hey Peter,
    Hope the trip is going well.
    I don't remember if I told you about the availability of TD wagons in the UK and USA. I never got much of a chance to look when we were there recently but I do remember emailing a guy a while back when I had similar aspirations with the GR.
    I would do some searches through the parts locaters in the US particularly and see what you get. I am sure there would be Pug wreckers in the states who have Diesel wagons available. I've seen Diesel wagons on UK ebay also, so that's worth a look.

    Cheers,
    Chris.
    2016 Renault Sport Clio Cup EDC 200



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    2001 Rx-4 Privilege
    R17TL, 1973
    R20TS x 3
    R18 GTS wagon x 2
    R10





    "When you hit the tree between the headlights thats understeer. Oversteer is when you hit the tree between the Tail Lights" - Wayne Bell

  6. #6
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    Default Brisbane to Bruny

    Quote Originally Posted by HONG KONG PUGGY
    Hey Peter,
    Hope the trip is going well.
    I don't remember if I told you about the availability of TD wagons in the UK and USA. I never got much of a chance to look when we were there recently but I do remember emailing a guy a while back when I had similar aspirations with the GR.
    I would do some searches through the parts locaters in the US particularly and see what you get. I am sure there would be Pug wreckers in the states who have Diesel wagons available. I've seen Diesel wagons on UK ebay also, so that's worth a look.

    Cheers,
    Chris.
    Hi Chris!
    Thought you might like to know that, We made it! 1791 Kms from Brisbane and about 196 litres of fuel later. We did quite a bit of travelling in Sydney but after two weeks there, was glad to get out of it! The trip was fantastic!
    Some rough stuff about 4.00am when as the captain said, "we hit a few pot-holes"- but I slept through it anyway. The car went well all the way. My only comment is that I found it a bit sluggish on the Southern Outlet out of Hobart, but then it was well loaded. So the 505 now graces Bruny Island with many thanks to you for your part in keeping it in good condition.
    Regards, Peter

  7. #7
    1000+ Posts HONG KONG PUGGY's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterR
    Hi Chris!
    Thought you might like to know that, We made it! 1791 Kms from Brisbane and about 196 litres of fuel later. We did quite a bit of travelling in Sydney but after two weeks there, was glad to get out of it! The trip was fantastic!
    Some rough stuff about 4.00am when as the captain said, "we hit a few pot-holes"- but I slept through it anyway. The car went well all the way. My only comment is that I found it a bit sluggish on the Southern Outlet out of Hobart, but then it was well loaded. So the 505 now graces Bruny Island with many thanks to you for your part in keeping it in good condition.
    Regards, Peter
    Peter,
    Thats good to hear. So glad the car kept up it's end of the bargin. Now it'll possibly be due for a transplant? The rest of the car is in vgc qhich is the main point too.
    That's not bad going either, 9.1 l/100km over that distnce. EDIT...I think that's wrong...I'll get a correct figure shortly. Wow, even better at about 8.95l/100kms. Any thing I can ever help with, let me know.
    Chris.

    P.S. Actually, cleaning up the other day I found a couple of panhard rod bushes for the wagon. WOuld you like me to post them to you? I'd forgotten I had even bought them, as they came in a lot of parts I got form some guy who approached me in a car park once. Stalker..
    Last edited by HONG KONG PUGGY; 16th October 2005 at 10:35 PM.
    2016 Renault Sport Clio Cup EDC 200



    Previous

    2001 Rx-4 Privilege
    R17TL, 1973
    R20TS x 3
    R18 GTS wagon x 2
    R10





    "When you hit the tree between the headlights thats understeer. Oversteer is when you hit the tree between the Tail Lights" - Wayne Bell

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