Manual Box's for the PRV
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  1. #1
    1000+ Posts bowie's Avatar
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    Default Manual Box's for the PRV

    Just to get my head around all this, what manual box's bolt up to the PRV and associated pug torqure tubs,

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    Now the BA10/5 of course does.. Was there a BA10/4sp at all,

    basically ba10/5 are seemingly expencive and or rare, would mind using a 4sp if they be plentiful

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    Previous: SuperGrumpy fuel spitting 504ti(ish), SuperComfortable 505 STI, SuperDoper carried my groceries Mi16, Choo Choo'd Volvo S40
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    Quote Originally Posted by bowie
    Just to get my head around all this, what manual box's bolt up to the PRV and associated pug torqure tubs,

    Now the BA10/5 of course does.. Was there a BA10/4sp at all,

    basically ba10/5 are seemingly expencive and or rare, would mind using a 4sp if they be plentiful
    BA10/5 speeds are very easy to find.
    BA10/4 speeds are very difficult to find.

    What is nearly impossible to find is the correct input shaft and bell housing for either gearbox.

    Having said that, I know a guy with a V6 BA10/5 for sale. Just might take a few $$$ to convince him. Nothing rare is cheap.

    The other problem you'll have is flywheel and clutch setup. A friend of mine works at a performance clutch place, and they have the pattern required to make a flywheel and clutch setup to operate the system. For the really high performance setup, they can even produce (for a price, of course) a flywheel and clutch combination with 4 tonnes clamping pressure from titanium alloy that only weighs 2.8 kgs

    Let me know if you need to be put into contact with either of these people.
    Scotty

    Melbourne - Dandenong Ranges

    1956 Peugeot 403 - 'Francois' - resto project

    1969 Peugeot 504 - 'Pascal' - daily driver project

    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility - 'Brutus' - resto project

    1978 Peugeot 604 - as yet unnamed - V6 on straight LPG

    1987 Peugeot 505 - as yet unnamed - project car

    1999 Peugeot 406 Coupé - 'Chloe' - 5 speed manual

    2011 Peugeot 3008 XTE HDi - 'Zoe' - hatchback on steroids

    2014 Peugeot RCZ - 'Remy'

    1999 Range Rover 4.6 HSE - 'Grover' - tow car

  3. #3
    1000+ Posts bowie's Avatar
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    cheers thanks for clearing that up ... Titanium you say Hmmmmmm

    Works: 2003 YV Commodore (That is Cecil to you)
    Playing: R12, SuperPos, thinks It's a race car and Sunny the R12 Lego set.
    Previous: SuperGrumpy fuel spitting 504ti(ish), SuperComfortable 505 STI, SuperDoper carried my groceries Mi16, Choo Choo'd Volvo S40
    Wanted Will hoard 12/15/17 Junk.

    "More and more of less and less" - Marina Abramović

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    Quote Originally Posted by Demannu
    BA10/5 speeds are very easy to find.
    BA10/4 speeds are very difficult to find.

    What is nearly impossible to find is the correct input shaft and bell housing for either gearbox.

    Having said that, I know a guy with a V6 BA10/5 for sale. Just might take a few $$$ to convince him. Nothing rare is cheap.

    The other problem you'll have is flywheel and clutch setup. A friend of mine works at a performance clutch place, and they have the pattern required to make a flywheel and clutch setup to operate the system. For the really high performance setup, they can even produce (for a price, of course) a flywheel and clutch combination with 4 tonnes clamping pressure from titanium alloy that only weighs 2.8 kgs



    Let me know if you need to be put into contact with either of these people.
    The early 604s had a BA10/4, these were probably the strongest and most reliable box that Peugeot has ever made.
    The V6 rally car that i am involved with has one of these and has not given any trouble despite being caned for four and a half years, to say nothing of the previous 25 years in the donor 604!
    Graham

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    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS
    The early 604s had a BA10/4, these were probably the strongest and most reliable box that Peugeot has ever made.
    The V6 rally car that i am involved with has one of these and has not given any trouble despite being caned for four and a half years, to say nothing of the previous 25 years in the donor 604!
    Graham
    Indeed, but how often do you come across a manual 604 (that isn't a diesel)?
    I've only seen one, and there is no way that car is ever going to be wrecked! 40,000kms on the clock and garaged all it's life - looks like it's just come out of the factory.

    BA10/5 speeds were in all of the early 5 speed 505s with XN motors, early 2 litre STI ZEJ motors (didn't make it to Australia), 505 Turbo-Injection (didn't make it to Australia) and all of the turbo-diesel motors. Of these, only the STI box has the same input shaft as the V6, and none of the bell housings are anywhere near close.

    The early V6 BA10/4s and V6 and STi BA10/5s I find are most suited to a modified V6. The later ones are geared a bit too short in first and second.
    Scotty

    Melbourne - Dandenong Ranges

    1956 Peugeot 403 - 'Francois' - resto project

    1969 Peugeot 504 - 'Pascal' - daily driver project

    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility - 'Brutus' - resto project

    1978 Peugeot 604 - as yet unnamed - V6 on straight LPG

    1987 Peugeot 505 - as yet unnamed - project car

    1999 Peugeot 406 Coupé - 'Chloe' - 5 speed manual

    2011 Peugeot 3008 XTE HDi - 'Zoe' - hatchback on steroids

    2014 Peugeot RCZ - 'Remy'

    1999 Range Rover 4.6 HSE - 'Grover' - tow car

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    Quote Originally Posted by Demannu
    Indeed, but how often do you come across a manual 604 (that isn't a diesel)?
    I've only seen one, and there is no way that car is ever going to be wrecked! 40,000kms on the clock and garaged all it's life - looks like it's just come out of the factory.

    BA10/5 speeds were in all of the early 5 speed 505s with XN motors, early 2 litre STI ZEJ motors (didn't make it to Australia), 505 Turbo-Injection (didn't make it to Australia) and all of the turbo-diesel motors. Of these, only the STI box has the same input shaft as the V6, and none of the bell housings are anywhere near close.

    The early V6 BA10/4s and V6 and STi BA10/5s I find are most suited to a modified V6. The later ones are geared a bit too short in first and second.

    The 604 it came out of was so rusty that you could pull pieces of metal off the body! No great loss to wreck it although a pity because it was the first 604 in the PCCV in 1977. Its early life in England (1975 to 1977) was no doubt to blame for the rust.
    Graham

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    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS
    The 604 it came out of was so rusty that you could pull pieces of metal off the body! No great loss to wreck it although a pity because it was the first 604 in the PCCV in 1977. Its early life in England (1975 to 1977) was no doubt to blame for the rust.
    Graham
    A shame really. Why is it that 604s seem to rust out so much quicker than their 504 and 505 counterparts, anyway? I had an '81 604 that was very rusty just about everywhere, and my '69 504 only has a couple of little spots.

    At least the gearbox went to a good home Graham. Did you get the motor as well? Was there much difference between the UK and Australian spec motors?
    Scotty

    Melbourne - Dandenong Ranges

    1956 Peugeot 403 - 'Francois' - resto project

    1969 Peugeot 504 - 'Pascal' - daily driver project

    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility - 'Brutus' - resto project

    1978 Peugeot 604 - as yet unnamed - V6 on straight LPG

    1987 Peugeot 505 - as yet unnamed - project car

    1999 Peugeot 406 Coupé - 'Chloe' - 5 speed manual

    2011 Peugeot 3008 XTE HDi - 'Zoe' - hatchback on steroids

    2014 Peugeot RCZ - 'Remy'

    1999 Range Rover 4.6 HSE - 'Grover' - tow car

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    Quote Originally Posted by Demannu
    A shame really. Why is it that 604s seem to rust out so much quicker than their 504 and 505 counterparts, anyway? I had an '81 604 that was very rusty just about everywhere, and my '69 504 only has a couple of little spots.

    At least the gearbox went to a good home Graham. Did you get the motor as well? Was there much difference between the UK and Australian spec motors?

    i have a UK spec engine here and it is no different from the aus spec

    many have told me there is yet with both pulled apart and checked out i found nothing different between the two
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by pugrambo
    i have a UK spec engine here and it is no different from the aus spec

    many have told me there is yet with both pulled apart and checked out i found nothing different between the two
    So the compression ratio is the same? Camshaft profiles?

    I was led to believe that the UK spec cars didn't have the EGR system or thermostatically operated distributor vacuum advance system that ours did.
    Scotty

    Melbourne - Dandenong Ranges

    1956 Peugeot 403 - 'Francois' - resto project

    1969 Peugeot 504 - 'Pascal' - daily driver project

    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility - 'Brutus' - resto project

    1978 Peugeot 604 - as yet unnamed - V6 on straight LPG

    1987 Peugeot 505 - as yet unnamed - project car

    1999 Peugeot 406 Coupé - 'Chloe' - 5 speed manual

    2011 Peugeot 3008 XTE HDi - 'Zoe' - hatchback on steroids

    2014 Peugeot RCZ - 'Remy'

    1999 Range Rover 4.6 HSE - 'Grover' - tow car

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    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    the one that i stripped down didn't have the pollution gear but internally it was the same as an aus spec

    this is the reason i went the way i did with the engine i built

    i used the 604 block blored out to suit the 91mm volvo liners and then used the 604 heads with volvo camshafts

    the UK pistons and heads are the same as the aus spec as are the cams

    you can get some nice cams though if you get the GTI cams from a 604 though which i have been thinking of doing but i don't really feel like pulling the heads back off to change them
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

  11. #11
    Demannu-facturing! Demannu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pugrambo
    the one that i stripped down didn't have the pollution gear but internally it was the same as an aus spec

    this is the reason i went the way i did with the engine i built

    i used the 604 block blored out to suit the 91mm volvo liners and then used the 604 heads with volvo camshafts

    the UK pistons and heads are the same as the aus spec as are the cams

    you can get some nice cams though if you get the GTI cams from a 604 though which i have been thinking of doing but i don't really feel like pulling the heads back off to change them
    You don't need to take the heads off to change the camshafts. But the engine does need to be out of the car, or at least have everything disconnected and drop the crossmember/engine/drivetrain so the heads are clear of the firewall. Otherwise cut a couple of holes in the firewall to pass the camshafts through, then patch them up with a grommet once you're done
    Scotty

    Melbourne - Dandenong Ranges

    1956 Peugeot 403 - 'Francois' - resto project

    1969 Peugeot 504 - 'Pascal' - daily driver project

    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility - 'Brutus' - resto project

    1978 Peugeot 604 - as yet unnamed - V6 on straight LPG

    1987 Peugeot 505 - as yet unnamed - project car

    1999 Peugeot 406 Coupé - 'Chloe' - 5 speed manual

    2011 Peugeot 3008 XTE HDi - 'Zoe' - hatchback on steroids

    2014 Peugeot RCZ - 'Remy'

    1999 Range Rover 4.6 HSE - 'Grover' - tow car

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    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Demannu
    You don't need to take the heads off to change the camshafts. But the engine does need to be out of the car, or at least have everything disconnected and drop the crossmember/engine/drivetrain so the heads are clear of the firewall. Otherwise cut a couple of holes in the firewall to pass the camshafts through, then patch them up with a grommet once you're done

    true but it's a hell of a job to do them

    i have seen a couple of volvos over the years with holes in the firewall
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Demannu
    A shame really. Why is it that 604s seem to rust out so much quicker than their 504 and 505 counterparts, anyway? I had an '81 604 that was very rusty just about everywhere, and my '69 504 only has a couple of little spots.

    At least the gearbox went to a good home Graham. Did you get the motor as well? Was there much difference between the UK and Australian spec motors?
    No Pollution gear, air pump etc.
    Actually I preferred the 604 engine to the even fire which replaced it. I had put Volvo ignition and Renault 30 carby and manifold on it.
    The Renault 30 set up gives less power than the Solexes but MUCH better torque and drivability.
    I wish I'd just put a set of rings into this rather than fitting the B280E.
    Graham

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    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS
    No Pollution gear, air pump etc.
    Actually I preferred the 604 engine to the even fire which replaced it. I had put Volvo ignition and Renault 30 carby and manifold on it.
    The Renault 30 set up gives less power than the Solexes but MUCH better torque and drivability.
    I wish I'd just put a set of rings into this rather than fitting the B280E.
    Graham
    Better in what way? I've heard that if the B280s have standard inlet ports, they don't rev as well. Is this true?

    What engine management are you running on the B280? Standard? Does it use a mass air flow meter?
    Scotty

    Melbourne - Dandenong Ranges

    1956 Peugeot 403 - 'Francois' - resto project

    1969 Peugeot 504 - 'Pascal' - daily driver project

    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility - 'Brutus' - resto project

    1978 Peugeot 604 - as yet unnamed - V6 on straight LPG

    1987 Peugeot 505 - as yet unnamed - project car

    1999 Peugeot 406 Coupé - 'Chloe' - 5 speed manual

    2011 Peugeot 3008 XTE HDi - 'Zoe' - hatchback on steroids

    2014 Peugeot RCZ - 'Remy'

    1999 Range Rover 4.6 HSE - 'Grover' - tow car

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Demannu
    Better in what way? I've heard that if the B280s have standard inlet ports, they don't rev as well. Is this true?

    What engine management are you running on the B280? Standard? Does it use a mass air flow meter?
    It just seemed to have more usuable power, it felt bloody quick in third and fourth gears between the trees whereas the even fire, although sounding great just doesn't seem to have it.
    Yes, the torque curve of the 280 drops lke a stone after 5000.
    It has Autronic engine management with MAP sensor.
    Graham

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