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  1. #26
    Fellow Frogger! pips's Avatar
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    I was thinking about it, but... the Leader of the Opposition. READ: The woman has said, "I want a 90's model that we don't need to work on or spend money on for atleast a year."

    Otherwise my front and back yards would be full of cars I'd like to restore and keep. One day.

    I showed her many cars. She likes the Pugs (All looks ofcourse - doesn't care for the performance, etc. As long as it works).

    Thank you very much for the info on the gearboxes. So ideally. I'd want to look for a late 89 or higher 405 for a BE2 gearbox? I'd like a stronger box as I am a rough shifter... driving a massive 4X4 with a gear stick throw of about 12 inches does that to you. HAHA, also, the clutches feel so light after driving my 4X4. I have a mate, his leg shakes when he presses the clutch in my car. Me, I use it like its a bicycle pump. HAHA.

    Re; my Duc. Its in pieces. I had a major accident years ago where a "driver" turned left in peak hour from the far right lane (3 lane road). I was in the far left lane. He went to get into that lane to turn left at the next street. Driving straight at me, he didn't see me. hmm, Bright Red bike. Fluro yellow jacket. This happened while moving and when I noticed him, it was too late. All I could do was accelerate as hard as I could or brake. It put me in Hospital for a long time. And three years later, I am still struggling with injuries, still waiting on my insurance money. All because I was in a bus lane, which bikes are allowed in. The Duc was a 900 SuperSport. I don't like the 748 or the 916/996/998/999 whatever it is these days. I don't like things that sparkle and grab the wrong peoples attention.

    Well, Bowie posted two 405's for sale in the trading post. for some reason I could not find myself. But eventually tunneled through and called up. they are nice. around $5K. One of them is really nice, I got the pics. Leather, sunroof, etc. it looks immaculate. Not my fav colour. But meh. beggars can't be choosers.

    I'll ask more questions as I think of them.

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    Thanks to all that respond so quick. This is such a great forum. Hepling out a complete n00b at the froggy cars.

    Thanks
    pips

  2. #27
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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  3. #28
    Fellow Frogger! pips's Avatar
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    Yes, it is way out of my price range, and its also Auto. I hate driving them.

    But thanks anyway.

    I have two Mi16's to look at this and next week.

    pips

  4. #29
    1000+ Posts David Shearer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pips
    Yes, it is way out of my price range, and its also Auto. I hate driving them.

    But thanks anyway.

    I have two Mi16's to look at this and next week.

    pips

    You know.....

    there is a hell of a MI16 dwn here in Melbourne for sale if you're interested. Wont have to spend a fortune on it as you probably would on a not so well looked after MI16. Got any rello's in Melb who can have a look. Check my adds.

    Dave
    78 Fiat X1/9, Peugeot 406 ST, Peugeot 407 V6 SW

    Previous:

    05 Megane Turbo
    2x 89 405 Mi16
    67 404

    Peugeot, Francais pour "Putain qu'c'est vite"[/FONT]

  5. #30
    Fellow Frogger! pips's Avatar
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    you mean your car?

    I have no relos in Melb. And I think your car is out of my range.

    I have spoken some more to the guy with very nice Pug 405 mi16 I saw in the trading post. Its red. Its immaculate. Leather, Sunroof, etc. only thing....its got 240,000kms on the clock. But its been a country car all its life, only just moving down to Sydney.

    My question is....this is relatively high mileage, definately way more then the other cars I have seen, and obviously, this depends on the maintenance of the car and condition of it. But, is this excessively high? Will I really need to look at the engine or anything else in particular, more so then usual?

    It has been confirmed that its got a BE1 gearbox. Just got a new clutch, its first replacement at 240K kms. Its had its timing belt replaced 80K, 160K and 240K kms. Its immaculate, except for the stone chips on the front...country car.

    I might go see it tomorrow or Sunday. He's asking for $5K but I think I'll offer around $4K because of the high mileage.

    pips
    Last edited by pips; 23rd December 2004 at 06:46 PM.

  6. #31
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    Pips, the water in the rad can look like it's half empty because it's meant to be about 10-12cm below the top. There's a hockey stick shaped thing that shows the level inside. And yes, many Mi's have that plastic thing under the windscreen cracked.


    2003 PEUGEOT 206 GTi

  7. #32
    Fellow Frogger! pips's Avatar
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    I understand that the level should be lower in the tank considering that there is no reserviour, there would be a requirement for expansion. But this was excessively low.

    Regarding the crack...ah well. I guess I'll just have to live with that.

    I will be seeing this Red one I have been talking about tomorrow.

    It looks really nice in the photos. I think it might be the one. Fingers crossed.

    pips

  8. #33
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pips
    you mean your car?

    I have no relos in Melb. And I think your car is out of my range.

    I have spoken some more to the guy with very nice Pug 405 mi16 I saw in the trading post. Its red. Its immaculate. Leather, Sunroof, etc. only thing....its got 240,000kms on the clock. But its been a country car all its life, only just moving down to Sydney.

    My question is....this is relatively high mileage, definately way more then the other cars I have seen, and obviously, this depends on the maintenance of the car and condition of it. But, is this excessively high? Will I really need to look at the engine or anything else in particular, more so then usual?

    It has been confirmed that its got a BE1 gearbox. Just got a new clutch, its first replacement at 240K kms. Its had its timing belt replaced 80K, 160K and 240K kms. Its immaculate, except for the stone chips on the front...country car.

    I might go see it tomorrow or Sunday. He's asking for $5K but I think I'll offer around $4K because of the high mileage.

    pips

    out of curiosity check under the drivers side rear passenger footwell for me and let me know if it has a slight dent there
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

  9. #34
    Fellow Frogger! pips's Avatar
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    Will do! - ouf of curiousity, why?

    So, considering the mileage this one has on it. Besides my own judgement of its condition, is there anything I should be concerned about at 240,000 kays?

    I just got word that I might be able to get an extra bit of cash too, so I might be able to look for a later model or maybe even a 306XT.

    We shall see.

    pips
    Last edited by pips; 24th December 2004 at 08:58 AM.

  10. #35
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pips
    Will do! - ouf of curiousity, why?

    So, considering the mileage this one has on it. Besides my own judgement of its condition, is there anything I should be concerned about at 240,000 kays?

    I just got word that I might be able to get an extra bit of cash too, so I might be able to look for a later model or maybe even a 306XT.

    We shall see.

    pips

    just curious

    i had a red lux pick Mi-16 and it was imaculate and i always wondered where it ended up

    the only way i can tell if it is my old one is it had a dent under the floor on the dirvers side rear passenger footwell fairly close to the brake lines

    damn good car and one i wish i had never parted company with so not withstanding what life it has had since i had it it would be a damn good car for someone to pick up

    the bloke that had it after me looked after it very well but i don't know where it went from there

    you can see pics of it from the link in my sig for my site

    the only series 1 i had ever been in that didn't have one little rattle or squeek in the dash
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

  11. #36
    Fellow Frogger! pips's Avatar
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    I shall look for you. Would be very interesting if it were the same one.

    I had a look at your photos of the red one. This one has a different number plate and no bonnet protector. But I shall look under the car.

    My question still stands though. Should I be wary of a high milage engine such as the one I am about to look at?

    I will be going to check it out tonight.

    Thanks
    pips

  12. #37
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pips
    I shall look for you. Would be very interesting if it were the same one.

    I had a look at your photos of the red one. This one has a different number plate and no bonnet protector. But I shall look under the car.

    My question still stands though. Should I be wary of a high milage engine such as the one I am about to look at?

    I will be going to check it out tonight.

    Thanks
    pips

    the number plate on that car was transfered to another car and the bonnet protector may have been taken off by now as they can get brittle and break

    the mileage shouldn't be a problem so long as the car has been looked after

    these motors go for a very long time before any major heart surgery is required so long as they are looked after, it's a pug thing

    i rebuilt a 604 motor that had done 400k and only because it blew a head gasket otherwise it would still be going

    the Mi-16 i had had 199K on it when i sold it so it could well be the same car
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

  13. #38
    Fellow Frogger! pips's Avatar
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    Thanks for the insight. Glad to hear that these engines can last the distance. I have been assured that it was looked after, but I can only tell when I go there, start her up, take her for a spin and decide if its worth it.

    I'm still going to bargain the price down due to the stone chips and high mileage. Hey, I am a self-employed, just out of TAFE person with no money. And there's nothing like getting a bargain.

    Merry Christmas to everyone and fingers crossed this is a worth while Mi16.

    pips

  14. #39
    Fellow Frogger! pips's Avatar
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    Well, abit of an update.

    First of all, Its not your car mate. No bump under the rear passanger floor pan on the drivers side.

    Secondly, a car that was advertised as immaculate, was infact a bomb. Paint was peeling off every panel. The Pug Badge at the front was ewww, the leather, seen better days. I know this is all cosmetic. But wait for it...

    The engine went like a headless chook with deep heat rubbed on its anus. The new clutch was very nice compared to all the others I have driven.

    The hole in the exhaust, hmmm. Easy fix, but the guy kept saying, "$20, they'll fix it no worries." The engine idling at 2.5K RPM. With him saying that its the idle motor, and its "gummed up". Which may be the case, but the sunroof leaks, the Aircon is stuck on, a CV Joint is abit noisy around some corners, or while turning the wheels on a speed hump, only when the wheels turned, the noise was apparent.

    To bring this car back to something pleasant to look at, it would need a new coat of paint. new exhaust, fixing of the sunroof leak, fixing the idle, giving the interior a nice refurbishment. And it will be on par with the other 405 Mi16's I've seen in the same price range.

    I was not happy. But the Engine in this one has been the sweetest so far. Man, it went so much harder then any other the other Mi16's Ive driven.

    Now, after all this. Would any of you say that its worth it. How much would the idle motor cost to repair or replace? CV Joint, same question? Keeping in mind, I'd do both CV's cause I'm anal...but then again, maybe you're suppose to..I duno, I'm a bike mechanic.

    What would the sunroof cost to repair, and who would I take it to? Who repairs sunroof leaks? The exhaust? well, any exhaust shop I suppose.

    The guy wants $5K, I offered $4K but said I was being nice. Realistically, I'd say $3.5K as I can only assume that the work to be undertaken by a qualified "professional" would cost about $1.5K to get it to reasonable nick.

    What is your opinion, information and ellaboration on the above mentioned things that the car has wrong with it? Is it worth it, for an otherwise mechanically awsome car. 240,000kays on the clock, I revved the tits off it at the lights, I was shocked at the acceleration over the previous ones I test drove. All the while, looking in the rear view, to see signs of smoke, carbon, etc. Not a whimper.

    I will see another one tomorrow and make up my mind between the two, but also take into consideration, the opinions you guys leave me.

    Thanks
    pips

  15. #40
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
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    The sunroof leaking?

    Do they have like the 404s and 504s etc? A tray under the sunroof that drains down pipes in the door pillars? If so, one of them being blocked will create problems.

    Do you think the guy is trying to hide anything on this car?

  16. #41
    Fellow Frogger! pips's Avatar
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    I am not too sure if he's hiding something.

    But, he didn't meantion all the things wrong with it until I got there, where he was honest and open to the issues with the car.

    I had the intentions of buying this one cause he did honestly say that it was an excellent example.

    I will be looking at another one today..if this storm settles.

    But I was mainly asking about the issues with this car I just looked at to see if it was worth getting it and just fixing it up.

    I'll see what this other one is like though. Its a 90 model, one lady owner (which I would not normally touch - long story). No sunroof, I'd like one but I am tall and the possibilities of a leak... might not be worth my while. So maybe looking at this one would be worth it, and leaving this previous one alone.

    I just mainly wanted everyones advice on what they would think in regards to the issues with the car, if they could be easily and cheaply fixed.

    pips

  17. #42
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    The stepper motor sounds a typical Mi16/BX16V type needing a good washing out with WD and a bit of wriggling around; more times than not they seem to get a bit of white rust inside.
    Sunroof I presume is the same as the BX; shits of things. On the BX two common problems;
    First is a piece of Velcro that is stuck inside the hood lining supposedly as part of the anti rattling devices that unglues and rolls itself into a thing that looks like a black cigarette and the air passing through pushes it into the rear drain usually on the passengers side. With the BX, you remove the tail light assembly (10 seconds if you take your time), pull the drain hose out of the mounting hole and blow through it whilst having the sunroof open at the time.
    Second one is that the outer frame tends to vibrate down over the years and leaves a gap around the top.
    Grab a Torx driver, loosen half dozen screws, get someone to push it upwards whilst you then retighten screws and problem solved.
    Drive shaft, with as many having been wrecked or bought as wrecks for parts by guys on this board, I'd go looking for a secondhand driveshaft as the cheapest option.

    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  18. #43
    Fellow Frogger! pips's Avatar
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    That all sounds very good.

    Thanks for that advice, makes it sound like I can get out of it pretty cheap.

    But then there's the paint job. It will need a respray, cause a patch will look exactly like that, a Patch up.

    I will look at another one today, and toss up between the two. This other one sound really neat. And the woman who owns it calls it "my pug" so it sounds as though she really loves the car. But that's just my first impression over the phone.

    It's a 90 model, so it's newer then the last one, with less kays, but the timing belt will need doing in 20K kays and the clutch is still the same one. The dodgey one has a new clutch. I will compare them mechanically.

    Thanks
    pips

  19. #44
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    Doesn't the Mi16 blow out smoke under hard acceleration? The GTi6 let out a nice puff of dark smoke under hard acceleration where excess fuel was being burnt. It was perfectly normal... just not sure about the Mi16 engines...

  20. #45
    Fellow Frogger! pips's Avatar
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    I couldn't see any smoke at all.

    But the thing was, this car seemed to launch, compared to all the other 405 Mi16's I've driven looking for one. Some have been 1993 models, mostly 1990, with this one being 1989. But it went the hardest.

    I'll be seeing this other one at midday. Compare the two as they are both equally priced, this one is a year newer, and has a history with it. Whereas the dodgey one has got nothing but a bag of troubles according to me.

    pips

  21. #46
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
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    I understand that the engine change after 1989 resulted in the later cars being less capable in the urge department... if that's your priority, why not just look at the earlier ones?

    Really, it's a shame about the paint on that one, because everything else sounds like fairly cheap and easy fixing.

    Paint, however, is a right pain...

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by pips
    It's a 90 model, so it's newer then the last one, with less kays, but the timing belt will need doing in 20K kays and the clutch is still the same one. The dodgey one has a new clutch. I will compare them mechanically.
    get them to do the timing belt or factor it into your offering price

  23. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Bell
    I understand that the engine change after 1989 resulted in the later cars being less capable in the urge department... if that's your priority, why not just look at the earlier ones?
    Ray, if you mean the change to the 2.0 iron block with the dual inlet manifold, this was in early '93.

    Stuey


    2003 PEUGEOT 206 GTi

  24. #49
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
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    I stand corrected then...

    I only know that the earlier one went better than the later one. I did think it was 1989 that they changed.

  25. #50
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    series 2 was the change over motor and other parts and that happened in 93
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

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