504 engine replaced!
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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Default 504 engine replaced!

    G'day,
    i've finally got my 504 back on the road again, with a new engine. I had a mate and my brother Dave help me put it in, and we encountered some problems lining it up on the gearbox shaft, but eventually got it on.
    After finding an open manifold pipe, the car idled very nicely, very smooth.
    It's a brand new engine, new pistons, hot cam; and i had it balanced also.

    I retorqued the cylinder head bolts today and reset the valve clearances, and it's driving nicely. The only problem i'm having is that there is a leak in the carby gasket, which i'll fix tomorrow; and the exhaust is rattling around really badly, hitting the gearbox and floor. I'll tighten this up, and put on a mount for it where there is meant to be one (one is missing), that should quiten it down. Stop it from vibrating on startup, take off and when i turn it off. The clutch works fine and feels good, so i'm pretty sure the vibrations is from the exhaust, especially when it is missing a mount.
    Replacing the thrust bearing has quietened down the gearbox noises i was hearing previously; the old thrust bearing was buggered.

    I'll hazard a guess that my engine troubles will be over now, touch wood. Cheers,
    Andrew

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  2. #2
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
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    Sounds good...

    You let it cool down for a full eight or ten hours before retensioning the head?

    Now all you have to do is run it in! Nothing over 6500 revs for the next week...

  3. #3
    Fellow Frogger! Ralph's Avatar
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    Andrew, what did you do to it and how much did it cost? Did you do it all yourself? Are you still after the boot springs? When are you up in Wodonga?

    So many questions, so little time!

    Matt.
    On the internet, no one knows that you are only wearing a fez.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Bell
    Sounds good...

    You let it cool down for a full eight or ten hours before retensioning the head?

    Now all you have to do is run it in! Nothing over 6500 revs for the next week...
    G'day,
    yeah Ray i let it cool down overnight, would have been a bit over 8 hours (drove it at 3am, retorqued it at 12 the next day!).
    Running it in is awful, bloody hate it! I'm driving under 4000 RPM, and i'm driving round 3-3500 RPM usually to ensure the engine doesn't labour.
    To answer you Ralph, yep i'm coming to Wodonga next week, on Wednesday. Will i still be able to pop round and pick up those boot springs? Back Wednesday lunchtime, leaving Friday after lunch some time.
    This will allow me to clock up some K's on the engine to run it in; sooner it's run in, sooner i can cane it!


    What did i do?
    Bought new pistons, sleeves, cam reground by Wade into a 112 profile (fairly hot), cam followers done also, engine balanced by CW Engine Reconditioning, square port head repaired (not my old round port), flywheel shaved, new clutch. I did alot of cleaning work, sand blasted things like oil breather pipe, oil pump and inlet manifold - this all looks really good. Also painted the engine, timing cover, sump and rocker cover - also looks pretty awesome.
    Got new replacable bits (eg: waterpump, leads (bougicord on sale at EAI for club members now), plugs etc.
    The engine balancing firm als resized the big ends of the conrods for me too, wanted to make sure they were right!
    I got a bloke in the PCCV to put the engine together for me, Dennis Edwards. He knows a heap about 2 litres, and has built many hot 2 litres in his time.
    All up it cost me a bit; would be something bewteen $2000 and $2500, but i know i have a good reliable, fast engine that'll last me for ages.
    I'll come over and show you the car next week Matt.

    Cheers Andrew

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roo504
    G'day,
    yeah Ray i let it cool down overnight, would have been a bit over 8 hours (drove it at 3am, retorqued it at 12 the next day!).
    Running it in is awful, bloody hate it! I'm driving under 4000 RPM, and i'm driving round 3-3500 RPM usually to ensure the engine doesn't labour.
    To answer you Ralph, yep i'm coming to Wodonga next week, on Wednesday. Will i still be able to pop round and pick up those boot springs? Back Wednesday lunchtime, leaving Friday after lunch some time.
    This will allow me to clock up some K's on the engine to run it in; sooner it's run in, sooner i can cane it!


    What did i do?
    Bought new pistons, sleeves, cam reground by Wade into a 112 profile (fairly hot), cam followers done also, engine balanced by CW Engine Reconditioning, square port head repaired (not my old round port), flywheel shaved, new clutch. I did alot of cleaning work, sand blasted things like oil breather pipe, oil pump and inlet manifold - this all looks really good. Also painted the engine, timing cover, sump and rocker cover - also looks pretty awesome.
    Got new replacable bits (eg: waterpump, leads (bougicord on sale at EAI for club members now), plugs etc.
    The engine balancing firm als resized the big ends of the conrods for me too, wanted to make sure they were right!
    I got a bloke in the PCCV to put the engine together for me, Dennis Edwards. He knows a heap about 2 litres, and has built many hot 2 litres in his time.
    All up it cost me a bit; would be something bewteen $2000 and $2500, but i know i have a good reliable, fast engine that'll last me for ages.
    I'll come over and show you the car next week Matt.

    Cheers Andrew

    Andrew, don't be too gentle when running in the motor, you need to accelerate flat out a few times from low to medium revs to bed in the rings.
    This should be done very shortly after you first get it running as per the instructions in the ring makers instruction sheet.
    I was too gentle with a couple of engines a few years back and they turned into sluggish oil burners!
    I wouldn't worried at all about keeping below 4000 etc, just follow Ray's advice and keep below 6500 for a few days.
    Graham

  6. #6
    1000+ Posts edgedweller's Avatar
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    Ah, Roo I'm only slightly froggie green with envy.
    I'd like nothing more than to have a punchy 2ltr to swap into the wagon, wasteful as that might be. Following that thread about the arabs buying up all old peugeots, Ive decided it's time I bought a few 504's to give me something to thrash around in in old age and your motor sounds about the perfect place to start. What have you done for carby and exhaust?

    Have fun fella.

    Cheers ed ge

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS
    Andrew, don't be too gentle when running in the motor, you need to accelerate flat out a few times from low to medium revs to bed in the rings.
    This should be done very shortly after you first get it running as per the instructions in the ring makers instruction sheet.
    I was too gentle with a couple of engines a few years back and they turned into sluggish oil burners!
    I wouldn't worried at all about keeping below 4000 etc, just follow Ray's advice and keep below 6500 for a few days.
    Graham
    Hi Graham,
    really? iI thought i had to be very gentle with the engine for the first 1000 kms. I'll take your advice and have a bit of fun with it, should i floor it up to 5500 revs a few time to bed the rings in? I've heard that pushing it uphill is good for this too as it puts pressure behind the rings. So far i've done 160 kms in it, so i'll take it out tomorrow and push it a bit.
    Low to medium revs; i take it you mean 1500 to 4500 roughly?
    I noticed a little puff of smoke out of the exhaust the other night when i was travelling behind my car. It was stopped and my cousin must have given it a few revs and a little smoke came out. It was night and cold and dark, but the car had warmed up by then.
    I've been keeping an eye on the oil too; i've topped it up cos it looked like it had dropped slightly, but the oil is new and hard to see on the dipstick, so maybe it didn't? The dipstick is hard up against the side of the sump too, perhaps the stick rubbed on the side of the sump on the way up and rubbed oil of the stick when i pulled it up?
    I'll retorque the head again tomorrow, and set the vavle clearances again. Massive valve clearance, 14 thou! I'm going to drop it to 12 thou tomorrow because i think the clearance is too large, but Wade suggests it.

    Haven't done anything with the exhaust, but i'm planning to put ona big bore exhaust manifold soon. I've changed the carby, put on a Weber 32/36 down-draught, fantastic carby - great sound when the second jet opens up!

    Cheers,
    Andrew

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roo504
    Hi Graham,
    really? iI thought i had to be very gentle with the engine for the first 1000 kms. I'll take your advice and have a bit of fun with it, should i floor it up to 5500 revs a few time to bed the rings in? I've heard that pushing it uphill is good for this too as it puts pressure behind the rings. So far i've done 160 kms in it, so i'll take it out tomorrow and push it a bit.
    Low to medium revs; i take it you mean 1500 to 4500 roughly?
    I noticed a little puff of smoke out of the exhaust the other night when i was travelling behind my car. It was stopped and my cousin must have given it a few revs and a little smoke came out. It was night and cold and dark, but the car had warmed up by then.
    I've been keeping an eye on the oil too; i've topped it up cos it looked like it had dropped slightly, but the oil is new and hard to see on the dipstick, so maybe it didn't? The dipstick is hard up against the side of the sump too, perhaps the stick rubbed on the side of the sump on the way up and rubbed oil of the stick when i pulled it up?
    I'll retorque the head again tomorrow, and set the vavle clearances again. Massive valve clearance, 14 thou! I'm going to drop it to 12 thou tomorrow because i think the clearance is too large, but Wade suggests it.

    Haven't done anything with the exhaust, but i'm planning to put ona big bore exhaust manifold soon. I've changed the carby, put on a Weber 32/36 down-draught, fantastic carby - great sound when the second jet opens up!

    Cheers,
    Andrew

    You can do more damage by being too gentle, if you haven't given the engine some good loading by now then do it ASAP. It is a pity that not all ring sets have the instructions regarding bedding in.
    My 403 engine, 15 years of motorsport out of a 1600 203 block (renowned for being a bit overstressed) was being tuned within 20km of being first started up!
    Yes, 14 thou seems a bit silly. extremely noisy.
    I use 8 thou for both inlet and exhaust, quieter and better performance.
    Wades were happy with this when I asked them about it.
    Graham

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS
    You can do more damage by being too gentle, if you haven't given the engine some good loading by now then do it ASAP. It is a pity that not all ring sets have the instructions regarding bedding in.
    My 403 engine, 15 years of motorsport out of a 1600 203 block (renowned for being a bit overstressed) was being tuned within 20km of being first started up!
    Yes, 14 thou seems a bit silly. extremely noisy.
    I use 8 thou for both inlet and exhaust, quieter and better performance.
    Wades were happy with this when I asked them about it.
    Graham
    Hi Graham,
    i loaded it up a few hills today; 2nd or 3rd gear and floored it up from low revs to 4-4500 RPM. Also been flooring it from take off. I don't want to have this engine burning oil because the rings haven't bedded in properly, so i'll push it a bit.
    I went up Mt Dandenong in it, 3000 RPM most of the way up the hill.
    I retorqud the head this morning, and set the valve clearances to 11 inlet, and 12 thou exhaust.
    Next time i'll drop them to 9 thou for both inlet and exhaust. Quieter tappets i guess you mean, the exhaust will sound more cammy, which i like!
    Loading, you mean low revs and forcing it to keep going, eg: 1500-2000 RPM foot flat sometimes.

    Cheers,
    Andrew

  10. #10
    1000+ Posts Shobbz's Avatar
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    Roo, congrats on what sounds like a very nice 504 engine.

    I don't totally understand such small tappet clearances though??

    shobbz
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    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    i can't wait till the V6 loosens up a bit

    man it's got some go now compared to before

    even the missus has a renewed interest in the old girl

    pity it's still auto though but we have to have compromises somewhere
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    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
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    Good to hear that day at the tip paid nice dividends...

  13. #13
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    Hello Forum,
    I have just acquired an old 1974 peugeot Station Wagon.
    Used to run mint but i need to find parts now.
    Can anyone help me out for carbie,disso and plug tools.
    I'm in Perth w.a..
    Thanx

  14. #14
    1000+ Posts Wildebeest's Avatar
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    Default 504 eng. replaced etc.

    Road Train.
    Join the Peugeot Car Club of WA inc. PO Box 195 Subiaco WA 6008.
    For Club details etc WWW.pccwa.org.au

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    Quote Originally Posted by roadtrain
    Hello Forum,
    I have just acquired an old 1974 peugeot Station Wagon.
    Used to run mint but i need to find parts now.
    Can anyone help me out for carbie,disso and plug tools.
    I'm in Perth w.a..
    Thanx
    I can help with a S/H distributor and the plug spanner.
    However, new distributors are available at European Auto Inports in Melbourne for a very good price ($150).
    Graham

  16. #16
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Bell
    Good to hear that day at the tip paid nice dividends...

    yeah

    still running a carby though

    just a pity the machinist dropped a liner and cracked it and took too long to machine the block

    only took a bit over a day to put the engine back together once i got the bottem end in the car

    not looking forward to pulling the A/C compressor and rocker covers back off to retension the heads and reset the valve clearances again

    times her by ear when she started and then put the timing light on to find i was only 2deg out

    not a bad effort i thought
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  17. #17
    1000+ Posts Wildebeest's Avatar
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    Default 504 engine replaced etc

    Pugrambo,
    Your angle tightening degree plate would have been working overtime during the V6 rebuild and with the head re-tensioning ay???

  18. #18
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildebeest
    Pugrambo,
    Your angle tightening degree plate would have been working overtime during the V6 rebuild and with the head re-tensioning ay???

    you mean my piece of cardboard with lines drawn on it at certain angles

    yes it did get used fairly well

    i still have to do the head re-tension
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  19. #19
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    Hi,
    i'm going to change the valve clearances today again. This time the exhaust will be 11 thou, and the inlet 9 thou.
    V6 sounds good though Pugrambo, i should have done that instead. But i'm having enough trouble trying to hide cut off pollution control manifold hoses already!

    The noise the car makes when you push it up to medium revs is great, a kind of roar/rumble; and it'll get better when i change the clearances today!

    Seeya guys,
    Andrew

  20. #20
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roo504
    Hi,
    i'm going to change the valve clearances today again. This time the exhaust will be 11 thou, and the inlet 9 thou.
    V6 sounds good though Pugrambo, i should have done that instead. But i'm having enough trouble trying to hide cut off pollution control manifold hoses already!

    The noise the car makes when you push it up to medium revs is great, a kind of roar/rumble; and it'll get better when i change the clearances today!

    Seeya guys,
    Andrew

    pollution control ?

    charcaol canister and the PCB

    not another thing is left

    passes rego without any dramas
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  21. #21
    Fellow Frogger! Peter J's Avatar
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    Hi all,

    Graham wrote: Andrew, don't be too gentle when running in the motor, you need to accelerate flat out a few times from low to medium revs to bed in the rings.
    This should be done very shortly after you first get it running as per the instructions in the ring makers instruction sheet.
    I was too gentle with a couple of engines a few years back and they turned into sluggish oil burners!
    I wouldn't worried at all about keeping below 4000 etc, just follow Ray's advice and keep below 6500 for a few days.

    Graham

    I recall reading on the net somewhere about driving down a hill with car in low gear (engine revs high) without any accelerator to build up back pressure on the rings to assist with the bedding in process. You may need to accelerate down the hill a little to build up speed to do this however seems to make sense?

    Peter J.
    PJ

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