306 GTi6 vs 206 GTi180 - Page 3
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  1. #51
    Zen
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    To my knowledge, the Peugeot engineers tried hard to shoehorn the 6 speed gearbox from the GTi6 but just couldn't fit the thing in there. I do wish they had but as lucin pointed out, it's not that bad.

    Rich

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    '04 206 GTi 180
    '95 306 S16

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by smokey
    i dont care anymore, I reckon the 180 owners should stick to their own threads as its a waste of time posting from an owners point of view. let those that dont own it bag it, who really cares what they think anyway

    or we can sit here and listen to them preach about it...

  3. #53
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    OK, that explains it. Thanks! Thought it was a tad strange that it kept the same 'box.

    My ST does 2800rpm at 100kph in 6th, so you're right, it's really not that bad. Although peak torque is a tad higher than expected, but not too unusual with VVTs. My ST has very similar outputs to the 6, but everything is about 500 rpm higher...

    Smokey, just because a car has more doesn't make it better. The 138 is a nicely balanced car, and the 180 has just reinforced it for Julian. Frankly your attitude on AF is a tad disturbing. It's about "sharing the knowledge", this is done through open discussion of the cars we're interested in. We're all interested in the 180, otherwise we wouldn't be talking about it!

    We're not all going to agree and sing the praises of every car that is French, otherwise things would get a bit boring, indeed. For you to jump up and down and say you love your car is all well and good, but it doesn't add much value to the site. What adds value is knowing things like lucin and Zen just shared about the development of the 180. Simply saying the car is great isn't what this forum is about.

  4. #54
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    on a side note... i am NOT the Julian being talked about here. Autoweb writer also shares this cool name.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by smokey
    i dont care anymore, I reckon the 180 owners should stick to their own threads as its a waste of time posting from an owners point of view. let those that dont own it bag it, who really cares what they think anyway
    smokey,
    No need to say that. We're an open minded community forum and we don't need or want people to "keep to their own threads" as you said.

    Pull your head in ok?
    Derek

  6. #56
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    ok, but that goes both ways, a bit of respect for each other wouldnt go astray. community skull

    i didnt mean that the 180 guys not post into other topics, just meant maybe we would be best not to reply to comparison threads about the 180, just seems to turn into gun fight. And what benefit does that have? You either like the car or not. Perhaps there should be a positivity policy for looking for positives? Whats the point in arguing a review when as 180 owner its simply not commensurate to what most 180 owners seem to be experiencing with their vehicles.
    Last edited by smokey; 15th July 2004 at 09:34 AM.

  7. #57
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    I've read this thread a number of times and fail to see a lack of respect shown.

    Smokey, can you elaborate on what you don't agree with in that article? Julian is a top writer and is one of the best in the country, IMO. He is fully independent and cuts straight to the chase, to his own detriment. For example, he has Ford offside for exposing the shoddy workmanship of the FTE models of the day, so they won't loan him cars to review anymore.

    What in the article do you disagree with? I have read and re-read that article and it seems fair. It says that if you're an enthusiast then this car will appeal to you, but as a day to day car the 138 is a more balanced, liveable car. It's a fair call, as I'm sure you and every other 180 owner here is a true enthusiast. Please elaborate, rather than just scoffing and saying you disagree.

  8. #58
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    Being a 206 pug lover, borderline being obsessed with my GTi 180. If I really have to have a go at the car, these will be my -ve feedback so far after driving 6000km.

    1. No 6th gear, I know, I know, car too small, won't fit. I know. But sometimes when I am driving on the freeway at high speed, the rev would go up to 4500rpm at fifth and sometimes I would want to shift to a higher gear and then realised it is already at the top gear.

    2. That stupid low fuel level alarm. Most of the time, I would be driving and turning hard at corners and that stupid alarm would go on and scared the shit out of me, thinking something has just broke or something. But I am sure SLC206 would give me a hint on how to switch it off. Pull the ABC lever under engine, turn the ignition and tap the brakes 3 times to switch if off.

    3. The seat belt always get stuck between the door and the racing seat. So I have to put my seat belt on before closing the door. Not nice during winter time.

    4. The part of the car below the car door, but this happens to my 206XT too. When the car gets dirty, which is quite easy nowadays because it is so dry, when you get out of the car, my pants (near my calves) always wipe that part of the car clean, which leaves my pants not as clean as before.

    5. When I start the car when it is low on fuel (when the yellow light is on), the engine is quite erratic at idle, sometimes it will even stall. I use Shell Preimum Unlead or BP preimum.

    Codgamer

  9. #59
    1000+ Posts U Turn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTI124
    The 13.7m turning circle on the '6 isn't THAT bad (ok, it is). Don't know why they didn't try and shoehorn it in again...
    Linc, I'm glad you added the '(ok it is)' bit I'm used to the turning circle now, but all that really means is that I've become good at judging which roads are wide enough for a quick U'ie. Though some of my workmates know about it too and love taking the piss; when I'm following them in their car somewhere, they'll purposely take a wrong turn into a side-street and do a quick u turn and hammer off knowing that it'll be a 3-pointer for me (though it's always fun catching up to them again!).
    Take the long way home....

    - 306 gti6

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    I have changed my post to reflect my confusion as to what I am trying to say, but please dont single me out. im not the only one baffled at the review.

  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by smokey
    Whats the point in arguing a review when as 180 owner its simply not true.

    ok not trying to single you out, but with comments like this it is hard.

    Recently buying a RCS I can agree with reviews saying the build quality is a bit average in some places. Its the reality, I donít need to defend the car, its attributes outweigh the negatives, and I am sure this is the same for the 180. Although, believe it or not, the 180 does have flaws too.

    However, if talking like the 180 is the best sub 40k car on the road, gives you the reassurance you need after purchasing it... then buy all means continue, but not to the point where people can predict exactly what your next post is going to be.

    It just seems that you in particular have a mindset that the 180 is invincible, and absolutely flawless. Therein lies the beauty of having people review cars, too make people aware of the characteristics of a new model albeit good or bad. I donít think motor reviewers especially well respected ones like Julian make things up.

    I am sure down in "Smokey Town" where the 180's wipe the pants of Gallardo's, the 180 is unstoppable . But in reality when on "Aussiefrogs" it just doesn't happen, people's views conflict, opinions differ and thatís the nature of it all.

    I am trying to write this liberally being a RCS driver and all... but I think in the future if someone has something to say about a 180, be prepared for all sorts of answers, not just answers which you believe.


    happy driving

  12. #62
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smokey
    I have changed my post to reflect my confusion as to what I am trying to say, but please dont single me out. im not the only one baffled at the review.
    What post have you changed?


    Jude, the ST is pretty bad too, nearly 12 metres. I actually get thrown out by the STs turning circle more than I ever did in the 6! doesn't help that I'm super-paranoid about scratching the 17s!

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    guys Im not here to be 180 invincible, I like all the cars, rcs, st170, gti138. I do love my 180, and so do many others, and there are others that agree that some of the review doesnt seem to add up. To me the main bit is the 0-100 times. Which are the same or worse than the gti138, which to me just seems un true. Im not criticising the authors judgement either, who knows what went wrong, it just doesnt add up?

    does that make sense?

    no offense meant, I assure you

    anyway, I apologise if I come across as 180 is invincible, its not my intention.

  14. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTI124
    Jude, the ST is pretty bad too, nearly 12 metres. I actually get thrown out by the STs turning circle more than I ever did in the 6! doesn't help that I'm super-paranoid about scratching the 17s!
    The first scratch always hurts the most. That's why I bought mine pre-scratched

    Quote Originally Posted by smokey
    guys Im not here to be 180 invincible, I like all the cars, rcs, st170, gti138. I do love my 180, and so do many others, and there are others that agree that some of the review doesnt seem to add up. To me the main bit is the 0-100 times. Which are the same or worse than the gti138, which to me just seems un true. Im not criticising the authors judgement either, who knows what went wrong, it just doesnt add up?

    does that make sense?

    no offense meant, I assure you

    anyway, I apologise if I come across as 180 is invincible, its not my intention.
    Maybe the car the reviewer drove was a lemon dude. I agree I never heard any overt resonance of the exhaust inside the car. Maybe peugeot decided they'd give Julian a 'quicker' version to get a better review but inadvertantly shot themselves in the foot? Manufacturers have been known to do that, though I'm not saying that's what happened, just another possibility in the long list of possibilities. A change in exhaust or whatever would also explain any loss in low end that Julian noticed....?

    Either way, I doubt Julian is losing any sleep over it.
    Take the long way home....

    - 306 gti6

  15. #65
    1000+ Posts gti138's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jastanis
    Linc, I'm glad you added the '(ok it is)' bit I'm used to the turning circle now, but all that really means is that I've become good at judging which roads are wide enough for a quick U'ie. Though some of my workmates know about it too and love taking the piss; when I'm following them in their car somewhere, they'll purposely take a wrong turn into a side-street and do a quick u turn and hammer off knowing that it'll be a 3-pointer for me (though it's always fun catching up to them again!).
    Jude,

    That's why god invented handbrakes

    Michael
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  16. #66
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    The 306 handbrake is shocking.

    Smokey, so the 0-100 time was out..it can happen, depending on the weather, track, fuel in the car. Lots of factors. What else?

    I really do want to hear your opinion on why this article is so "un-true".

  17. #67
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    ...I read this article...once....and it seems to make sense.....
    It also relates to another thread regarding honda engines and max. output....Yes the pug 180 is delivering more power just like the hondas and hence drivabillity issues re. everyday life...Personally I like plenty of torque on a daily basis and this is why the s16 (heavier than 205) feels (sometimes) a little bit inadequate compared to 205.....I think issue is reinforced by the fact that pug engines have always used the torque quality to their advantage when it came to gearing SO I suspect many journos would find these new Pugs (180) a little bit disapointing.....
    No, I have never driven one....but I have driven plenty of hondas (vtec)...and these engines were ceartinly not HARSH or ROUGH...which is unfortunate if that is indeed the case with the 180.....if this isnt a normal characteristic...well maybe they did test a car thats been reved hard once 2 many times...


    cheers


    dino

  18. #68
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    have ammended my post once more to reflect what I am trying to say. I find the performance to be a lot better than stated. So thats my , for what its worth .

  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by gti138
    Jude,

    That's why god invented handbrakes

    Michael
    Mike, it's as Lincoln said, the 306 handbrake is truly shocking. Or at least mine is. Iíve tried it in a couple of tight turns on a private dirt road in the Barossa and thereís no progressiveness at all. Pulling the lever up to about 90% of its full range, thereís no effect, then it suddenly comes on like a switch and I was quickly looking at the nice dust trail Iíd left. Iíve had the handbrake adjusted too, doesnít make much difference. Also remember that during that drive day, when we were all parked and my car was about a metre behind Leighís Ď180. Lincoln was leaning on the front quarter when he noticed my car rolling forward that's the fastest I've moved since the time I was chased by a bull some years back . Now I always put it in gear when parked!

    Smokey, stop changing your posts it's bloody confusing. Anyway it's all becoming a bit of a bore. Next topic: Who here has driven a Lotus elise, lots of details please
    Take the long way home....

    - 306 gti6

  20. #70
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    I think we should all go back and take back what we've said. I'm sure there's a thread back in 2003 that I posted that I'd prefer to change...

    In reference to the 138 being a better car than the 180, it's not unlike the S16 v XSI comparison with the 306. The press thought the XSi was a better car in balance, performance and price against the S16. They liked the S16, but could not justify the extra $$s for the S16. It wasn't until they refined the S16 into the GTi6 that the press came to the party. Even then the same quality issues came up, and it often lost comparison tests against cars like the Civic VTI-R.

    The UK press loved the 6 and called it the best hot hatch ever, whilst the Aussie press loved it they always found more things to criticise than the British press.

    I'm not bashing the 306 XSi here, I think the car is sensational and I'm so disappointed that Peugeot hasn't made a decent 307 XSI. It''s not worthy of those three letters, really.

  21. #71
    1000+ Posts Stone Free's Avatar
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    Oh my God yes, the UK press loved the GTi6. And in all honesty, they seem to test many more makes and models than the guys down here.

    Speaking of, I watched the BBCs Top Gear all last year (singlularly THE best motoring show on TV...if you can get hold of ANY episodes, do so.) and they totally loved the 180. Their reckoning was that many people over there put alot of after market mods on their cars, hence the popularity of the 205 in its time. Maybe that was the angle Pugeot was leaning towards "sure, the car is quite good stock, but look, you can add this body kit, this air filter etc...". Maybe I'm wrong and should close my niave little mouth.
    The AWARD WINNING 1998 Blaze Yellow 306 GTi6


    ......and a Series 3 205GTi on the side.



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  22. #72
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    im not taking anything back, just making sure im not misunderstood, and that I say things less factually when its opinion. Can we leave it at that? Im sure there are heaps of posts by all of us that arent perfect in everyones eyes. Im just trying to make an effort to be less factual with my opinions, I thought that would be appreciated. Have a read through this thread, Im sure there are heaps of posts which could be picked on.

    Time to move on.....

  23. #73
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    Sure, keep adding to the thread. Nothing wrong with that

    I for one haven't classieifed the 180 as crap and I don't believe the article says that either.

    I'd ask the same questions of you that I asked of Smokey. What EXACTLY in that review do you not agree with? I'd like to know from an owner just how bad some of the points are. Instead of just saying it is wrong and the journo has no idea. This serves no value, and certainly doesn't share the knowledge.

    I think most of us possess enough intellect to be able to constructively critique an article like that and is what we're looking for.

    As for your financial dig, that's just cheap. Share your thoughts, don't dig at others.

    And yes, good can come out of this.
    Last edited by GTI124; 15th July 2004 at 02:48 PM.

  24. #74
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    i'd like to hear what people who have come from a 138 to the 180 think of the 180 over the previous car

    i will also add i have not made any bad press about the 206 only that i find it too small for me which i think is a fair statement

    i have spent quite a few miles behind the wheel of a 138 so i have a bit of an idea what it is like to navigate a 206 on the road
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  25. #75
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    BTW, I reckon I can rubbish the RSC more than I can rubbish the 180 Sound like a challenge?

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