BE1 Vs BE3
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Thread: BE1 Vs BE3

  1. #1
    1000+ Posts Poo-Go's Avatar
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    BE1 Vs BE3

    Hello all,

    I am looking at buying a 405Mi16, and have seen references to BE1 and BE3 gearboxes. Can anyone please advise on what the differences (if any) are between these other than the shift pattern? What are the pros and cons, and which should I be looking for?

    Cheers,

    JG.

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  2. #2
    Fellow Frogger! Justin B's Avatar
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    I have a BE1 in my 205 GTI.. and it's a bloody close ratio gearbox for a road car.... the reverse being next to 1st gear doesn't really worry me...

    The only thing you ahve to worry about (I think that this is for all BE1's) is that the filler hole is higher then the level of oil that is recommended for the box. So, make sure that your mechanic knows that it only needs 2 litres...

    i.e the box takes 2 litres of 75w/90 when I filled mine up, it didn't overflow at all...not even close to the hole. The previous mechinic MUST of filled it to the filler hole (as per 99% of gearboxes in this world) because when I emptied the box, about 4 litres poured out....

    I'm sure others will weigh in with data for you to decide.

    Justin

    LookingforMi16:
    Hello all,

    I am looking at buying a 405Mi16, and have seen references to BE1 and BE3 gearboxes. Can anyone please advise on what the differences (if any) are between these other than the shift pattern? What are the pros and cons, and which should I be looking for?

    Cheers,

    JG.
    Pugsley The 1987 205 GTi Peugeot

  3. #3
    Fellow Frogger!
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    oh i HATE the reverse being next to first gear, especially when the 205 seat is pushed up so your hand hits the chair when putting it in reverse!! the number of times i thought i was in reverse but was in first!!! eek!

    nearly hit a car parking in my first week of ownership!!

    but i guess you get used to it

  4. #4
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    In Mi16's, there is no difference in ratios between BE1 and BE3, only the way you select reverse.

    Aussie 205 GTi's differ:

    BE1 - lower first, 3.9:1 diff
    BE3 - higher first, 3.6:1 diff

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

  5. #5
    Fellow Frogger! two-oh-philic's Avatar
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    I don't know that that is entirely right PeterT. As uncomfortable as I feel saying this (a feeling that won't go away until you shut me down with your wisdom), I have the '90 (no p/s) GTi with the BE3 gearbox. Doesn't that mean i have the earlier diff?
    205 GTi (S2 ) rolled

    '96 306XR "Sex" Black

  6. #6
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    PeterT:
    In Mi16's, there is no difference in ratios between BE1 and BE3, only the way you select reverse.

    Aussie 205 GTi's differ:

    BE1 - lower first, 3.9:1 diff
    BE3 - higher first, 3.6:1 diff
    Peter T,

    I just had a nasty thought; as there is presently a thread going re; organising LSDs to suit BE1 & BE3 transmissions, are we likely to strike a problem if some are for BX/Mi16 whilst others are for 205s

    Alan S cry whistle
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  7. #7
    Fellow Frogger! two-oh-philic's Avatar
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    Since we are kind of on the topic, i have a drive shaft seal leak. Says seal needs replacing. What would one of these cost? Would it be hard to replace. I can't be f*cked going to the mechanic again just to pay out another $500.
    205 GTi (S2 ) rolled

    '96 306XR "Sex" Black

  8. #8
    Fellow Frogger! MYT205's Avatar
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    or if you have a 1.6 GTi like me then you have the BE1 box with 4.06 diff ratio. head_ban

  9. #9
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    Pugsly:
    oh i HATE the reverse being next to first gear, especially when the 205 seat is pushed up so your hand hits the chair when putting it in reverse!! the number of times i thought i was in reverse but was in first!!! eek!

    nearly hit a car parking in my first week of ownership!!

    but i guess you get used to it
    perfect for motokhanas though
    right next to each other
    just have to remember lift to reverse
    the GTi-6 has the lever as well for reverse even though it is near 6th gear which i would prefer if it was up near 1st
    just think there are a lot of jap cars you have to push the lever down to get reverse
    i prefer the lift up rather than a push down system
    3 x '78 604 SL

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    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

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    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

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  10. #10
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    Ah, yes. I forgot the S2 205 GTi. I did say Aussie GTi's Darren.

    S1 BE1 - 3.25:1 1st, 3.94:1 diff
    S2 BE3 - 3.25:1 1st, 3.94:1 diff
    S3 BE3 - 2.92:1 1st, 3.69:1 diff

    Alan,
    I can't answer your question. All I know is that the Quaife fits either, but the ZF needs a bit of work to fit a BE3. I suggest asking Wuillemins, as they are currently a ZF.

    <small>[ 11 September 2003, 07:26 PM: Message edited by: PeterT ]</small>

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

  11. #11
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    two-oh-philic:
    Since we are kind of on the topic, i have a drive shaft seal leak. Says seal needs replacing. What would one of these cost? Would it be hard to replace. I can't be f*cked going to the mechanic again just to pay out another $500.
    Most of these seals aren't all that dear or hard to replace.
    Drive shaft out & are replaced from the outside. The seals have a plastic (white or red) protector ring that fits just inside the face of the seal so as to give some protection to the seal lip on reassembly.
    Word to the wise though; be sure to drain the gearbox BEFORE you start & fill with new oil upon completion. Most seem to wait until they have a bath in gear oil halfway through & then try to guess how much oil came out. mallet
    Cost is approx $12 for seal & about teh same for oil.

    Alan S cheers!
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  12. #12
    Fellow Frogger! two-oh-philic's Avatar
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    Thanks alan,

    Any idea of difficulty level for a guy who's only ever done an oil change... once.
    205 GTi (S2 ) rolled

    '96 306XR "Sex" Black

  13. #13
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    two-oh-philic:
    Thanks alan,

    Any idea of difficulty level for a guy who's only ever done an oil change... once.
    Under those circumstances, I don't think I'd try it alone if you know what I mean. cry
    It's a simple DIY for anyone used to DIYing. I had one fitted to one of my cars when I sold it & was too busy to do it myself. Guy threw it up on a hoist, did the job, changed the gear oil and charged me $45 labour so it's not a big job if you have a workshop & know what you're doing...looks more involved than it is to the untrained eye though, so watch they don't try to make it look like something major just to work the account up deal

    Alan S 2_cents
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  14. #14
    pur-john, not pew-john! peujohn's Avatar
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    PeterT:
    In Mi16's, there is no difference in ratios between BE1 and BE3, only the way you select reverse.
    Are you sure about that? I remember reading in Wheels an article on the Mi16x4... the writer commented that the car had an updated gearbox, with reverse opposite 5th instead of beside 1st, and it also had a slightly lower 1st gear ratio to compensate for the extra weight of the 4x4 version. This may have been only for the 4x4s, but maybe not.

    John
    John W

    1979 Peugeot 504 GTI 2.2 litre 5 speed - 72 kW at the wheels

    1974 Peugeot 504 TI
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    2009 Peugeot 407 HDI wagon - family car

    Previous: 2005 407 HDI manual sedan, 1980 504 GL, 1990 405 Mi16, 1977 504 GL Special, 1984 505 SRD Turbo



  15. #15
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    That's correct with the Mi16x4. They have the 3.25 1st, rather than the 2.92, but as we were talking about Aus. delivered Mi16's I didn't think it was worth mentioning. Owen W. has one, and the larger gap between 1st and 2nd is a real pain.

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

  16. #16
    Fellow Frogger! two-oh-philic's Avatar
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    Yeah that's what i have too. It really is a pain. Someone here mentioned that it was particularly bad in hill climbs, and not having done a "hill climb" but having climbed a hill i can only agree. Even if you aren't racing you need to rev 1st to 4k minumum to put the revs in the right spot in 2nd. ACtually i'm dissapointed to know it, coz i always thought i had the perfect combination 205 with the late gearbox and early diff. I wonder if you could get the better gear out of an old 405.
    205 GTi (S2 ) rolled

    '96 306XR "Sex" Black

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