GTi 180 Dropped cam belt
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Thread: GTi 180 Dropped cam belt

  1. #1
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    Default GTi 180 Dropped cam belt

    All

    Timing belt has come off, havenít stripped down to determine cause. Car had only done 15000km over the 3 years since replaced.

    But looking to see what may be out there in regards to potentially replacing valves and head. Or doing an engine swap if something is available..

    This will determine next steps to keep, sell as is or part out.

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    Dave

  2. #2
    1000+ Posts driven's Avatar
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    Who replaced belt may have a claim against them

  3. #3
    1000+ Posts dmccurtayne's Avatar
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    Default GTi 180 Dropped cam belt

    What water pump does it have ,did Eurocars do it shame they are gone now I have a cheap new genuine belt for sale if you didnít hear the death rattle


    Garage C5 X7 3008 XTE
    Gone but not forgotten 206 GTI 180 306 XR SED 405 MI16 x2 xzara VTS 406 SV 206 XT Berlingo 2011 (best car ever) 306 HDI 307 XSE HDI touring
    Fix it right the first time

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    My story relates to 406 with 2.1 lt diesel, but your engine may be similar in that it uses a type of harmonic balancer which is made with a dampening rubber insert between the inner part which fits to crankshaft and the outer where the accessories belt runs. The car was dead when trailered home, and inspection revealed that the insert had over time squeezed out in both directions and a piece had been eaten by the cambelt. After fitting new belt, water pump, tensioner, idler pulley, balancer/pulley and exhaust valve rockers it was a goer. The going bit was good for, say, 40kms. My stranded wife got it tilt-trayed home. It would run but not well at all. Took all the covers and etc off again to find that the super duper looking new Spanish balancer was a 100% fraud. What looked like a full rubber insert was nothing more than 2 o-rings glued into machined grooves with a flour and water mix. The supplier of the dud provided a new Sasic replacement unit that looked really good too, till I tested it for continuity with a multi meter. Rubber has always been an insulator to the best of my knowledge. When the continuity was reported to the well known Bris supplier of Peugeot parts he all of a sudden was ignorant about the construction of damped balancers and showed no interest in doing the right thing. He no longer benefits from me or any of my Peugeot owning contacts.
    Mike Tippett likes this.

  5. #5
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    They only damp torsionally so if the two metal parts were slightly touching it probably wouldn't matter of course depending on the reason. There is a chance the Sasic part was OK.


    2003 PEUGEOT 206 GTi

  6. #6
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    You can generally find a replacement engine from a wrecker for around $1000, or cheaper if you're a good hunter.
    Crashed 180's tend to go for less than that at auction.

    Replacing the engine is not a particularly difficult task for a mechanic with a hoist. A bit fiddlier for a home mechanic, but very achievable for a competent amateur.

    Given the value of good working 180 is currently in the $2000-5000 sort of range, I would have thought that labour costs will be the defining reason of why you would or wouldn't try to repair the car.
    Every time you pay $100 to tow it somewhere, and $400 to diagnose, you quickly get closer to uneconomic.
    1984 505 Executive Auto

    206 GTi 180 - '804 Cat Cams, Jenvey DBW 48mm ITB's, Emtron KV8 ECU, HP Electronik PDM, AIM MXS Dash, Custom Wiring Harness. AST Camber Tops & Coilovers, -2deg camber hubs by Frogstomp Racing, 24mm Torsion Bars, AP Racing brakes, PeugeotSport Baffled Sump, Oil cooler, Quaife LSD, E85.

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    Previously, 2x 504 Wagon, 505 Wagon, 505 STi, 405.

  7. #7
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    Stuey, the thickness of the rubber pretends to be about 4mm which leads to the conclusion that the machining on the 2 closest surfaces would have to be very rough in order to allow for a 'slightly touching.' The original Peugeot balancer did not have continuity. My attempts to engage Sasic in emails to establish the reason for the anomaly failed. Perhaps I should get them to agree to paying the postage and I'll cut in two. Could also clamp the inner or the outer in a big vice and test for any movement with a big shifter or Stillson. Another bit of interest would be to remove the rest of the rubber from the original to see how it was constructed. Time will tell.

  8. #8
    1000+ Posts luthier's Avatar
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    Personally I wouldn't blame the supplier of Sasic stuff as their products are usually very good. They've been the major rubber producing company we've been using in our Pugs forever going right back to the 203.
    I know there was some dodgy rubber produced at one stage particularly in suspension bushes and steering rack boots, such that Goodwins reckoned you'd be lucky to get 6 months out of them, maybe that was about 2004 or so? I think that must have been redressed because I've had no such problem with any parts I've fitted since then.
    But it's weird how sometimes one person seems to get a string of bad luck with some part and when you do apparently you're the only one it ever happened to. That's me, I can't quote the examples now, but these things are sent to try us.
    I'm a faithful customer of a certain Brisbane supplier though at times some details get forgotten, usually with a good explanation, but on balance I am extremely happy to be able to obtain most things within a week by mail and have a pleasant chat as well. Don't shoot the messenger.

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    Kelpie, yeah I've seen these pulleys like on my 405 I know what the rubber looks like from the front.

    What I was picturing just for example is that one or both part may have raised bits to increase surface area and thus bond strength of the rubber. Or to help prevent the rotational slip that some of them exhibit when they get older.

    At the front and back of the pulley you'd still see 4mm thickness of rubber.


    2003 PEUGEOT 206 GTi

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    Stuey, your point makes sense. Whilst not necessarily 100% proof I'll now find the original and melt some rubber. Will let you know. Am still not happy that Sasic did not readily offer proof of your contention about the mode of construction in a brief email. Till seeing a couple of comments it appears that I was wrong in thinking that there was more than 1 supplier of Peug parts in Brisbane. Cheers

    To me the better way of ensuring good contact twixt rubber and the steel would be to drill holes. Casting and then machining to leave raised dimples sounds rather complicated and expensive.
    Last edited by kelpiebat; 11th May 2019 at 08:20 AM. Reason: staircase thinking

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    No worries, my suggestion was just a very quick guess because Sasic are meant to be OK parts and I was thinking what might cause continuity. I also thought of the rubber having metal in it to make it tougher. Basically, complete guesses.

    I remember someone a while back saying they had a Sasic rubber part that was too soft; engine mount or something? Anyway it failed quite quickly. I think Sasic just re-package and resupply. I just bought some timing belt tensioners/idlers from Ken Bailey which were Sasic packaged (in sealed bags) but were Dayco and SKF, for example. So there could be some variation in quality.


    2003 PEUGEOT 206 GTi

  12. #12
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    Have found the original harmonic balancer from the D8 2.1 lt diesel, and with the rubber insert removed it is found that the inner piece has a machined ridge of about 2 mm and the outer has a matching machined valley. Without using the verniers to be exact the result of the machinings is that a gap of about 2mm exists between them for the rubber to live in. From Google it is learnt that Sasic is a French company since 1920s. The box with the new Sasic camshaft pulley with apparent rubber insert that does not insulate the 2 pieces says Made in Spain. The pulley which burnt me was made in Spain.

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