MI16 (ex) owners please report !
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  1. #1
    Tadpole
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    Default MI16 (ex) owners please report !

    Thinking of buying a 92 405 Mi16 yet i read on several occasions that the type 2 Mi16 engine (XU10J4) is not the same as the (XU9J4) type 1 ...
    People also claim the type 2 Mi16 is just not as much fun as the Type 1, too heavy, etc etc etc.

    I also read that the rod bearings on the type 1 engine are rather weak and are known too cause problems in some situations, they seem to have solved this in the new engine.

    I'm not sure what to do ...
    Are there ANY mates out here that know the real deal ?
    Who has driven both and could give me all the pro's and con's ...

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    Please be specific and don't mind to post as much info as you can possible can, there is NO such thing as an information overkill

    Thanks in advance,

    Downupper

  2. #2
    Fellow Frogger! buzzedmi16's Avatar
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    Well buddy depends on what you want....
    I've driven 2 series 1 MI16's, They got the 1.9 ltr 16v engine, same block used in the 205 GTi, the 206 WRC, the peugeot touring cars, the 205 t16, its a good strong engine that i havent come upon any problems with, if of course it is kept up to date with maintanance and what not.
    It's a very sporty car sticks to the road extremely well, i think the 1990 series 1 was the better one to get as it had the 15inch wheels on it, so it rode a little bit more comfortably.
    I havent had anything to do with the series 2 MI16, It was styled a little different, with the rear end and some of the front bumpers, I think it was made to be a bit prettier then the series 1. If you can find a series one kept in good nick, with all logs books and what not kept up to date, then you should definately go for it...
    As i said i havent had anything to do with the series 2, I just wouldnt get one with a decent series 1 being for sale at the same time...
    Buzzed 405...Got a problem?

  3. #3
    Tadpole
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    Well the thing is, there are 2 mi16's for sale at this very moment and they are based type 2's (92+93 model).
    I could wait for a type 1 as they come around every now and then but i wonder which version would be the best choice (overal) ....

    Was hoping for owners that have (had) both types and for them to share their thoughts.

    Thanks for replying,

    Downupper

  4. #4
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    I've had two, a S1 160hp, and a S1 148hp model. Great cars but the 2L model is a lot more refined. The 2L model suffers from coil and manifold diaphram problems though, like the S16. If I was buying a 2L model, I'd fit a std. length inlet manifold and aftermarket ECU with a new coil pack. But that's just me.

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

  5. #5
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    I think there is one guy here (Pug405Mi16) (?) from Tasmania who had a series one and offered it for sale as he bought a series two. He has since sold the series two & is keeping the series one in preference.
    That should really say it all.

    I drive a BX which is equivalent to a series one in an Mi16 and I have driven a series two Mi16 but only for a short distance and I must admit that by comparison, the series two Mi16 was a dissappointment. Just didn't have the get up & go that my 16V has.

    I think as a comparison it's almost akin to the R32 Skyline GT-Rs in comparison to the R-33. The 33 is a later model but somehow just misses the target on performance and appeal.

    You've lost me on this supposed bottom end problem with these engines as they are almost bomb proof; top end is a different story particularly if the cambelt snaps.


    Alan S
    Last edited by Alan S; 15th May 2004 at 07:32 PM.
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  6. #6
    Tadpole
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    Well, i read that the type 2 engine no longer suffers from ill rod bearings that sometimes gave problems ... No idea where they got that from.

    Equal length intake, Standalone (aftermarket) ECU, coil pack ... No thanks, that combination alone pays for almost a complete used Mi16 uphere ...


    Downupper

  7. #7
    1000+ Posts Luca's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterT
    I've had two, a S1 160hp, and a S1 148hp model. Great cars but the 2L model is a lot more refined. The 2L model suffers from coil and manifold diaphram problems though, like the S16. If I was buying a 2L model, I'd fit a std. length inlet manifold and aftermarket ECU with a new coil pack. But that's just me.
    Your a hoon!

  8. #8
    Tadpole
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    hey all, this is my first post so please be nice!

    I'm in exactly the same boat as downupper, i am in the market for a 405mi16, but am confused about what to get. I have never driven a mi16 before so i am not too sure what to expect.

    I like aspects of both cars...s1 seems to be a better drivers car (quicker, peakier, handles betters etc)....but from what i gather s2 is more refined and has loads more torque down low....probably a bit more forgiving to me as i have never driven a manual before!

    So do i go all out and try and track down a good s1 or should i be content with the easier to find s2. I'm coming from a VL Calais (Auto) so even if i do get a s2, it's gotta be a hell of alot better. What do you guys think?

    Thanks

    Adam
    Last edited by wesleyrpg; 29th May 2004 at 01:56 AM.

  9. #9
    Tadpole
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan S
    I think there is one guy here (Pug405Mi16) (?) from Tasmania who had a series one and offered it for sale as he bought a series two. He has since sold the series two & is keeping the series one in preference.
    That should really say it all.

    Alan S
    lol! It does say it all, Alan, but I think you have the wrong user name. I'm from Melbourne and I knew better than to buy a S2! I loved my S1, but alas, my sister has stolen it from me and won't give it back. I now must put up with my 406SV, although I must admit, I am not suffering too badly! But I still miss my baby!

    My advice to the guys trying to decide on the S1 vs S2 is to consider each individual car on its merits. You really won't go wrong either way, as long as the car is genuine and has been competently and regularly maintained. You're not buying new, and nor is it like a Commodore where there are plenty to chose from at any given time. You have to decide on the best Mi16 available, and work out which offers the best value within your budget range.

    Just my 2 cents worth.

    John.

  10. #10
    pur-john, not pew-john! peujohn's Avatar
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    I think it was Pug_405_Mi16 who owned both S1 and S2. Not Pug405Mi16. I guess one can see why Alan would make the mistake though!
    John W

    1979 Peugeot 504 GTI 2.2 litre 5 speed - 72 kW at the wheels

    1974 Peugeot 504 TI
    - now on the road

    2009 Peugeot 407 HDI wagon - family car

    Previous: 2005 407 HDI manual sedan, 1980 504 GL, 1990 405 Mi16, 1977 504 GL Special, 1984 505 SRD Turbo



  11. #11
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peujohn
    I think it was Pug_405_Mi16 who owned both S1 and S2. Not Pug405Mi16. I guess one can see why Alan would make the mistake though!
    I may have got the name wrong but I think I got the story right didn't I?


    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  12. #12
    1000+ Posts Warwick's Avatar
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    The S1 engine is much better as is the clutch. The S2 has a nicer dash.
    I prefer the S1 by a long way.

  13. #13
    1000+ Posts Pug_405_Mi16's Avatar
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    Yep it was me and the story is spot on,

    I decided to get a new car, being an S2 Mi16 once I got it I found I hardly ever drove it as I didnt really like it that much, it was a fine car *being a Pug* but not crisp like the early one. I hate to say it felt more commodore like then the early one.

    Sure it handled like a dream but I know that after taking mine for a run I get out with a smile on my face, yet when I did the same in the S2 I got out and thought *oh well thats all very nice*


    The S2's are fine, but just not as good as the S1's I dont think.


    CHeers

    Ben
    1989 Peugeot 405 Mi16
    1990 Peugeot 505 GTD Turbo Wagon
    2000 Peugeot 306 XSI
    1973 Peugeot 504 GL





  14. #14
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Hi all,
    One of my son's has an immaculate S1 Mi16. As per many of the threads, he, being an engineer and not phased by a bit of research, compared the merits of the S1 vs S2 before buying.

    The conclusion was that the S1 was a far better drivers car then the S2. He has not regretted the choice in 4 years of ownership. Only niggles to date have been the bushes on the gear linkages (REPLACED) and the thermo-switch/relay combination which controls the radiator fan speeds (REPLACED).

    A great road car, with amazing economy also, given its performance capability.

    Cheers,

    Kim.

  15. #15
    Fellow Frogger! Saru's Avatar
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    I've owned my s2 since January. It's great and if the s1 is as good as people who've driven both say, then it'd be bloody fantastic. I went with the s2 because it was in too good condition to pass up - and it was the only mi16 for sale at the time! They're hardly a dime a dozen.
    '94 405 Mi16

  16. #16
    Tadpole chuckb's Avatar
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    Icon10

    I've owned a S2 Mi16 (1994) for just a few weeks now (first french car after many years of Alfa friendship (1.75 105, 1.7 8v Series 1 Sud, etc)..

    I got an S2 because it had low Ks (just over 100,000), was in great condition and so on. I'm extremley happy with it. I'm told the 1.9 revs harder, etc. If you care about these things, interior and fitments in the S2 is much better, and the weight doesn't feel like a hindrence (it's under 1200, and feels about as quick as my 800 kilo series 1 Alfasud 1.7 8v (118bhp) was, for comparison).

    It seems to be if you want the extra revs and low weight, go for the S1, but the S2 seems to be a smarter buy for many, due to its initial high cost and so on the models you do find for low Ks every now and then tend to be pretty good.

    It's not like the S2 doesn't rev nicely anyhow! :-)

  17. #17
    Cal
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    I think there are more important things to look for on Mi16's than kms. When I pulled my engine down at 160000kms, the hone marks were still in the sleeves.

    Cheers,

    Cal.
    1995 Mazda MX5 - 2F Race Car
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  18. #18
    Tadpole scotsman's Avatar
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    Default s1 - s2 mi16's

    hi,
    i live in scotland and i have had a s1 for 7 years and have been running a s2 for the past year also.

    my favourite is the s1 - it's lighter, revs quicker, the back end sticks to the road better....., i feel the s2 is a smoother drive, it has a k&n mod which helps it rev better, the s1 needs leaded fuel and it's running out here so it's easier to get unleaded for the s2.
    s1 is good for thrashing, s2 is a good all rounder.
    .... so if i had a choice between the two models and leaded petrol was available, i would chose s1

    ps. earlier someone mentioned the 205 and mi16 blocks are the same. i'd say they were different because the mi16 block has oil spray bars at bottom of the bore to keep pistons cool and the 205 block doesn't

    cheers
    scotsman

  19. #19
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    you can't run your series one on unleaded fuel ?

    if not, why not ?

    i realise that i may not have a cat but all the Mi-16's sold here ran on unleaded

    in fact all cars made from 86 onwards had to run on unleaded here
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

  20. #20
    Tadpole scotsman's Avatar
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    hi,

    i think (!) it's because i have got hardened valve seats and unleaded doesn't have the correct octane. it needs lead ( or lead replacement ).
    in the future, i'm going to have to use super-unleaded and mix it with the appropriate amount of octane booster. ( eg castrol valvemaster )
    as i say, it runs fine on lrp but it's running out fast.

    i was stuck for leaded a while ago and used unleaded and the motor ran like a bag of nails, and have used lrp ever since.

    do you have lrp ( lead replacement petrol )? or have ecu's been re-mapped ?
    is there anything else you can think of that i could try ?
    cheers
    scotsman

  21. #21
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    we have LRP that i wouldn't touch with a barge pole

    then we have unleaded, premium unleaded then higher octane premium unleaded

    i ran my Mi-16 on premium and i run the 604 on the same and the 306 GTi-6 gets the better stuff again

    the good stuff wasn't around when i had the Mi-16 so it onlt got the normal premium

    i tried it once on normal unleaded and it ran like a dog

    the 604 runs nicely on premium and the 306 runs on it but i prefer to let the 306 drink the best i can get for it

    you should be able to run on the next one up the line from normal unleaded in the Mi-16 as it should have hardened seats

    most pugs have had these at least in this country since around 82/83 and the 604's have them as well dating back to 78 in this country
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

  22. #22
    Tadpole scotsman's Avatar
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    i've had to put in bp optimax because i can't get lrp - and it seems to be running ok. phew !.
    it is 6 pence a litre more expensive than ordinary lrp - probably thanks to our taxes.
    ..... but, needs must, i suppose.

  23. #23
    Fellow Frogger! KRISKARRERA's Avatar
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    I think you'd be better off with the 2 litre Mi16. Over here I've got the 1.9 version but it's 160bhp instead of 147 so it is noticeably faster than the 2 litre Mi16 but in Austrailia wouldn't the two be fairly evenly matched?
    405 MI16
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    Le lion va de la force la force!

  24. #24
    Fellow Frogger! sproose16v's Avatar
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    I had a mate hwo owned one and sold it, there was a fair share of problems, like from too much thrashing, but he still regrets selling it.... Buy it!
    1989 BX 16 Valve Mk1 - SOLD (And Missed)
    http://www.bx16v.cjb.net
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