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  1. #26
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    update - changed fuel pump (wasn't necessary), then fuel filter and then the fuel filter relay. must have been the relay.

    sprang to life but ran like a dog - did the ECU reset - 10mins battery unplugged, then replugged and 10secs with the ignition on, then started and run with lights and a/c on until both thermo fans cut in.

    took it for a drive and a big improvement, drove it around the block a few more times, lots of revs and it seemed to run fine

    drove it the 80kms back home and most of the time it was fine


    except, once on the highway it ran like a dog missing cylinders etc, sprang back to life, and then closer to home it ran as if missing 1-2 cylinders intermittently and the ignition light was on (as it was for a period when we did the initial ECU reset)

    crank sensor, bad fuel, what else could it be???

    some say the ECU reset has to be done a few times - why and how does one know when all is good?

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    we have it up and going, but not consistent and dangerous when it splutters

  2. #27
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    to update - we have decided to keep the car longer term so bit the bullet and replaced Idle stepper motor, MAP, Crank, Throttle, Temp and O2 sensors, plus the fuel relay and the fuel filter

    still ran like a dog, somtimes ok and mostly not


    took it to my trusty mechanic and AGAIN determined limited fuel flow and suspected the pump, the pump part of which I had replaced.

    he pulled the pump apart and the pressure seal which the pump-body/pipe outlet slides into had a split on the internal lip
    blamed me when I replaced the pump but have no recollection but I guess this was the problem all along, just that it was intermittent

    surprising as this is a stationary part,
    but I guess after 16 years of vibration from the pump and quality Pug seals ??..~~..//..##..&&

    and, can you buy the $2 seal................................NOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOO
    have to buy the whole shebang
    Last edited by alittlewino; 10th April 2017 at 02:48 PM.

  3. #28
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    I've just had similar issues with my 306 XSi - thanks alittlewino for paving the way ;-)

    The symptoms were that it was taking longer to start (presumably to get some fuel pressure up) and the time to start was proportional to the time it had been left. I put a fuel pressure gauge in between the fuel line and the fuel rail and was getting bugger all pressure. On the other 306 I would get 2.5 bar from ignition on, which was closer to the 3bar or so specified.

    When I went to pull the pump out of the XSI, someone had been there before. I found the pump retaining ring was cracked! I have some pics of the various bits, including the temp repair to the ring. Not driving the car this is on - just to stop rubbish getting in the tank and the petrol from evaporating.

    306 just stopped-img_0001.jpg306 just stopped-img_0003.jpg306 just stopped-img_0004.jpg306 just stopped-img_0002.jpg

    Having two 306s helps as I can module swap! The pressure is back to 2.5bar on the XSI with the swapped pump.

    I don't like my chances of getting the assembly apart with fuel and time aged plastic tabs to unclip so I might replace the whole lot. Interested to see if the fuel pressure increases to near 3 bar with a new pump.

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by blahblah View Post
    I don't like my chances of getting the assembly apart with fuel and time aged plastic tabs to unclip so I might replace the whole lot.
    I was also apprehensive but it unclips ok just looks more fragile.
    My issue was the small internal seal that the pump outlet pipe pokes into inside the canister - see the red pressure seal pikkie - and can't be replaced

    in the end I had to replace the whole unit which of course saves pulling it apart.

    google the GTI6 UK forum and there are some good dismantling instructions and pikkies

    if you do pull apart and need a new pump mechanism itself, I just happen to have a new one spare that was used for 1 hour

    306 just stopped-fuel-pump-seal.jpg

  5. #30
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    Thanks for the pic and info - you can see the split in the red seal. I'll pull the unit apart and see if it's the same issue...


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  6. #31
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    Here's what came out of the faulty unit - the pump is fine its the seal. Someone's bodged this together to fix it short term.

    306 just stopped-img_2227.jpg306 just stopped-img_2228.jpg

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by blahblah View Post
    ........the pump is fine its the seal......
    I searched far and wide for the seal including Europe without success

    suspect one would need to find the pump manufacturer to source

    I hope you find a supplier as my guess is these seals fail over time and seems a shame to have to replace the whole lot

    I've had good success with quality parts (both Pug and Merc) from Spareto in Estonia even though I bought the pump locally due to time frustration

  8. #33
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    I've just come back from a seal supplier - to have 10 made in viton would be a cool $45 each...

    Group buy anyone? :-)






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  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by blahblah View Post
    I've just come back from a seal supplier - to have 10 made in viton would be a cool $45 each...

    Group buy anyone? :-)






    Sent from my iPhone using aussiefrogs
    That is awesome - if I had the time I would have also tried a seal maker but well done to you for sorting.

    Did you also look at that odd black grommet what looks like a pipe locator?

    I'm sorted for now but if you needed one more to make up the numbers I would take one to fix up my old pump.
    I'd imagine it's a std seal from the OEM that would fit many pumps of that genre,

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by alittlewino View Post
    That is awesome - if I had the time I would have also tried a seal maker but well done to you for sorting.

    Did you also look at that odd black grommet what looks like a pipe locator?

    I'm sorted for now but if you needed one more to make up the numbers I would take one to fix up my old pump.
    I'd imagine it's a std seal from the OEM that would fit many pumps of that genre,

    I may have come up with a lower cost solution - just waiting for some seals to arrive. I didn't have the black grommet thing as it had been replaced with some cut off bits of fuel hose!

    Could you take some pics and measurements? The grommet stops the seal moving back under fuel pressure (from what I can tell).

    Using my cheapy ebay fuel pressure gauge has been handy - the best result I had was with some orings and a short length of heater hose.
    The pressure on ignition on went to 3bars, then dropped to 2.5bars (which I took to meant the pressure regulator on the fuel rail was OK. Constant 2.5 bars or so with the engine running. Will try to capture in a little video when I have the bits I need.

    This was due to the heater hose swelling with the petrol and sealing properly! Oh and the just off idle flat spot has gone with proper fuel pressure.

    Anyway, will continue to experiment and report back - this is applicable to any older car with an in tank pump I think.

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by blahblah View Post
    .............Oh and the just off idle flat spot has gone with proper fuel pressure...........
    The off-idle flat spot on depressing the accelerator is a very good tell-tale for low fuel pressure and should immediately alert one to this non-durable seal.

    Also, due to the nature of the seal we were able to drive the car the better part of 100kms before it played up again, so just because it goes doesn't mean, as I thought, that all is right with the fuel pump and this ruddy seal.

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by blahblah View Post
    Could you take some pics and measurements? The grommet stops the seal moving back under fuel pressure (from what I can tell).
    my grommet is also quite messy and difficult to photo - it had actually split and I super-glued it back together
    it's also flattened at one end I guess from the compression of the seal - it looks like a locator to me

    I'll see what I can do

    edit
    306 just stopped-img_2263-seal-side.jpg this side against the red seal

    306 just stopped-img_2264-inside-top-lid-side.jpg this side goes up into the tube and sits against the ribbed underside of the canister top

    306 just stopped-img_2266-gromet-length.jpg seal length, but you can see it appears squashed towards the bottom (LHS of the pikkie) or maybe manufactured like that
    Last edited by alittlewino; 25th April 2017 at 04:46 PM.

  13. #38
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    Thanks for the measurements - it confirms my thoughts. The seal does look a bit odd! Mine was replaced by fuel hose...
    So this holds the silicon seal in place and with the metal cup applies a little pressure to it?

    I'm expecting some viton seals I found on eBay this week so should be able to tinker with it over the weekend.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by blahblah View Post

    the metal cup applies a little pressure to it?
    funny thing, my metal cup actually had some of the plastic of the housing tube broken off inside it

    only noticed when I was having a little play

    and the red seal, although tough as, started to crack elsewhere as I was playing with it, but I couldn't tear it in my hands!

    weird and no wonder they sell the complete unit - various parts seem to disintegrate over time !!

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