drive line swap 505 into 504
  • Register
  • Help
Results 1 to 17 of 17
  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    launceston, australia
    Posts
    34

    Default drive line swap 505 into 504

    I have a 505 with all the mechanicals and a 504 that needs an engine and had brake repairs.[ both manual ] How hard would it be to swap the entire drive line from the 505 into the 504

    Cheers...............Wayne

    Advertisement

  2. #2
    1000+ Posts
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    HOBART
    Posts
    1,265

    Default

    Depends what you call easy. I assume you're talking XN1 engine and not DZJ or. ZEJ motors?

    You don't say whether it's an early, middle or late model 504. It's easy with XN1 and either BA10/5 or BA7/5 gearboxes
    1998 Peugeot 406 D8SV Manual
    1999 Peugeot 406 D8ST Auto
    2002 Peugeot 406 D9SV Manual
    1994 Peuegot 306 N3 Cabriolet Manual
    1994 Peugeot 306 XR N3 Hatch
    1995 Peugeot 505 GTI executive
    1976 Peugeot 504 Sedan - Now sold

    Over 60 Pugs in my time
    Gerry Mullock

  3. #3
    1000+ Posts Beano's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    3,149

    Default

    ^ Wot he said.

    The 505 gearbox is 5 speed and you will need to hit the transmission tunnel with a large hammer to create a little more room. Nothing too dramatic tho.

  4. #4
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Athens, Greece
    Posts
    299

    Default

    What model are the cars? The easiest would be to swap everything (including complete front and rear ends). If the 505 is an injection model (ZDJ variant) you will also need to swap fuel tanks and lines.

  5. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    launceston, australia
    Posts
    34

    Default

    10/74 for the 504 and overhead cam efi [ douvrin ?] for the 505 . What years constitute early or late for 504? Where and by how mutch do you massage the transmission tunnel? This and changing fuel etc I would consider doable but I would get someone else to do the wiring. Thanks for the replies folks, and Thanos, I am impressed with your marathon car.

  6. #6
    1000+ Posts Beano's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    3,149

    Default

    I haven't done it, but a Pug mechanic friend told me to just keep a sledge hammer handy for the gearbox fitting. I know it sounds extreme, but basically a heavy one has a lot of momentum. No huge swinging involved.
    Someone else here will be able to tell you specifics.

    Thanos is correct in that the 505 rear end is slightly wider. The rear hubs are a little wider and the drive shafts are a little bit longer. This gives you a wider track and more stable rear end (also looks better). Peujohn did this to his 504.
    Also, 505 drive shafts are more readily available secondhand if another one is ever needed.

  7. #7
    Demannu-facturing! Demannu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Menzies Creek
    Posts
    2,541

    Default

    How handy are you with electrics? Most of the conversion is pretty much bolt-in, but you will have to do some fancy wiring if you want to retain the fuel injection. Option B would be to make an adapter plate to fit a Fuego intake manifold and carby to the OHC motor.

    '74 504 should have the right crossmember to bolt the 505 style engine mounts to. If not, use the 505 crossmember. If you want to use the 505 power steering system, you will also need to use the 504 tie rods on the 504 rack.

    Early 504 (which yours is) would also need a fuel return line fitted to the fuel tank and high-pressure pump fitted for the injection system.
    Scotty

    Melbourne - Dandenong Ranges

    1956 Peugeot 403 - 'Francois' - resto project

    1969 Peugeot 504 - 'Pascal' - daily driver project

    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility - 'Brutus' - resto project

    1978 Peugeot 604 - as yet unnamed - V6 on straight LPG

    1987 Peugeot 505 - as yet unnamed - project car

    1999 Peugeot 406 Coupé - 'Chloe' - 5 speed manual

    2011 Peugeot 3008 XTE HDi - 'Zoe' - hatchback on steroids

    2014 Peugeot RCZ - 'Remy'

    1999 Range Rover 4.6 HSE - 'Grover' - tow car

  8. #8
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    350

    Default

    Have a look in the for sale. There appears to be a great 505 for sale in Tassie. A lot less work?"

  9. #9
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Athens, Greece
    Posts
    299

    Default

    I would swap EVERYTHING! Complete front and rear ends with cross members and mounts, radiator mount, fuel tank and fuel lines, gearbox with shifter, drive shaft, steering column including stalks... you get it. You get all the 505 benefits, but in a far better looking and handling car. Transmission tunnel interference is not a problem, I have fitted a BA10/5 in an early 504 coupe without a problem (I used the jack to widen the tunnel around 10 mm in two spots. You will have to roll the lips of the rear guards (easy) and you will end up with 3 degrees negative camber in the front (try it, you will like it).

  10. #10
    Contented Peugeot Driver addo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Don't remind me!
    Posts
    16,609

    Default

    Surely the wiring is not that hard?

  11. #11
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Blue Mountains, NSW
    Posts
    433

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ThanosK View Post
    ... You get all the 505 benefits, but in a far better looking and handling car.
    Far better looking is subjective -- I think both look pretty good in different ways -- but I'd like to know why a 504 body with 505 driveline would handle far better than the 100% 505. It can hardly be aerodynamics. Is the 504's body much more rigid? Much lighter?

    Have fun,

    Rob.

  12. #12
    1000+ Posts robmac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Melbourne / Caulfield
    Posts
    19,211

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by addo View Post
    Surely the wiring is not that hard?
    Any wiring that old is hard: both in insulation and to resurrect.

  13. #13
    1000+ Posts
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    HOBART
    Posts
    1,265

    Default

    Fitting a Douvrin engine into a 504 is a job for someone with a reasonable amount of skill. Well, it's more the work that needs to be done to finish off the job and get the car mobile which will take the skill.

    Unless you've had a good amount of electrical and mechanical experience, I wouldn't recommend it.
    1998 Peugeot 406 D8SV Manual
    1999 Peugeot 406 D8ST Auto
    2002 Peugeot 406 D9SV Manual
    1994 Peuegot 306 N3 Cabriolet Manual
    1994 Peugeot 306 XR N3 Hatch
    1995 Peugeot 505 GTI executive
    1976 Peugeot 504 Sedan - Now sold

    Over 60 Pugs in my time
    Gerry Mullock

  14. #14
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Athens, Greece
    Posts
    299

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by robs View Post
    ... I'd like to know why a 504 body with 505 driveline would handle far better than the 100% 505.
    I don't know, Rob. But I had two 505's (an STI and a V6) and they did not handle as well as the 504's.And the numbers don't lie: compare the number of 504 rally cars to that of the 505's (it's almost 8 to 1), I am sure there is a reason for that. They both qualify for historic status, so it can't be age related.

  15. #15
    Demannu-facturing! Demannu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Menzies Creek
    Posts
    2,541

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ThanosK View Post
    I don't know, Rob. But I had two 505's (an STI and a V6) and they did not handle as well as the 504's.And the numbers don't lie: compare the number of 504 rally cars to that of the 505's (it's almost 8 to 1), I am sure there is a reason for that. They both qualify for historic status, so it can't be age related.
    I agree, but also can't give a definitive reason for it. I suspect it is probably something to do with the weight of a 504 body being concentrated more centrally over a 505 wheel track, or the additional rollover protection in a 505 making the 505 body ever so slightly more top-heavy.

    That said, a completely stripped-out 504 body is about 20kgs heavier than a completely stripped-out 505 body. Not sure where the extra weight comes from (could be the weighbridge at the scrap metal merchants I use, I guess).
    Scotty

    Melbourne - Dandenong Ranges

    1956 Peugeot 403 - 'Francois' - resto project

    1969 Peugeot 504 - 'Pascal' - daily driver project

    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility - 'Brutus' - resto project

    1978 Peugeot 604 - as yet unnamed - V6 on straight LPG

    1987 Peugeot 505 - as yet unnamed - project car

    1999 Peugeot 406 Coupé - 'Chloe' - 5 speed manual

    2011 Peugeot 3008 XTE HDi - 'Zoe' - hatchback on steroids

    2014 Peugeot RCZ - 'Remy'

    1999 Range Rover 4.6 HSE - 'Grover' - tow car

  16. #16
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Blue Mountains, NSW
    Posts
    433

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ThanosK View Post
    I don't know, Rob. But I had two 505's (an STI and a V6) and they did not handle as well as the 504's.And the numbers don't lie: compare the number of 504 rally cars to that of the 505's (it's almost 8 to 1), I am sure there is a reason for that. They both qualify for historic status, so it can't be age related.
    Thanks for the reply Thanos. "It just does" is fine with me.

    It was largely because of the numbers that I asked. I suppose there might be a few other reasons for opting for a 504 body -- iconic shape, parts availability -- but that they handle better too makes the other things icing on the cake.

    Have fun,

    Rob.

  17. #17
    Fellow Frogger! TassieExec's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Devonport Tas.
    Posts
    354

    Default

    Hi All

    Another interesting and insightful thread, however as far as comparing handling goes, I think theirs several factors involved such as types of roads and which models. having owned a 504 and numerous 505's, my experience has been that the 504 was good on sealed roads and excellent on gravel ones, 505 GR's and SR's are very similar to the 504, however 505 STi's are better on sealed roads than gravel, my 505 STi executive is brilliant on sealed roads and while good on gravel, not as good as the 504's and 505's first mentioned.
    Regards
    Neil

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •