Any type of 2 Stroke Oil for Diesel?
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Thread: Any type of 2 Stroke Oil for Diesel?

  1. #1
    Tadpole
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    Default Any type of 2 Stroke Oil for Diesel?

    Hi,

    For the Peugeot HDi 407 & 307 I've bought some Castrol Activ 2T Motorcycle at SuperCheap the other day and also found Gulf Western 2 Stroke Engine Oil cheaper Gulf Western 2 Stroke Engine Oil - 5 Litre - Supercheap Auto Australia

    Didn't know there was different types of 2 stroke oil, will any do? Any to stay away from? Gonna check out BigW this weekend and have a look for a cheaper/better/larger option for the 2 Stroke Oil.

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    Thanks,

  2. #2
    1000+ Posts Kim Luck's Avatar
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    Can one enquire as to why you think 2 stroke oil is suitable for you diesel?
    Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got 'til it's gone............

  3. #3
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    Hi mate,

    Yeah I recently cleaned out the EGR valve, and wanted to keep it in cleaner shape, theres alot of info plastered all over the web about the benefits of adding 2STO to your diesel fuel.

    Here are a few posts:
    Adding 2 stroke oil to diesel tank - read this - The Brick-yard - Page 1
    Adding two stroke oil to diesel. - Servicing - Automotive
    http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/alfa-...-improved.html

    etc..

    Cheers,
    Last edited by Hopelessone; 23rd March 2015 at 02:49 PM.

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    Fellow Frogger! young 4 old pug's Avatar
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    I wouldn't
    Current stash
    too many.

    Passed over stash
    lots.

  5. #5
    Tadpole
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    Found it!
    Low ash, use mineral, Don't use full synthetic but any mineral or half synthetic 2-T oil will do.
    2T-oils should comply with JASCO "FC" or ISO L-E "GC" or "GD"
    The JASCO rating is only important for 2-stroke engines and if your diesel engine has a DPF, as the ash content of the 2-T oil should not exceed 0,2 Vol-%. But if you do not have a DPF things are much easier, and your choice of 2-T oils may be guided by the best price you have to pay for the product.

    from: Freel2.com - View topic - 2-stroke oil and diesel

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    See http://msdspds.castrol.com/bpglis/FusionPDS.nsf/Files/C09BA64774EB9DDB80257D1100826772/$File/Castrol_Activ_2T_4100595_2013_10.pdf

    I wouldn't. The poster's phrasing in the forum link has more than a little suggestion of conspiracy theorist.
    Last edited by seasink; 23rd March 2015 at 07:08 PM. Reason: Fixed the link

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    Hey there, that link is for 4 Stroke Oil..seasink by poster do you mean "yamaha-fan" guy?

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    1000+ Posts 504-504-504's Avatar
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    There was a tread about using 2-stroke oil in diesels some time back.
    I think it wound up with one unfortunate member mistaking a can of roundup for 2T.

    Paul.
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    Here is a good SA thread on the topic - starts with a good explanation of the different types of 2-stroke oil. Mixing 2-stroke oil into Diesel - 4x4 Community Forum

    Also, it's easy to find old AF threads where this has been discussed before. Here's one: Who's using 2-stroke oil in their diesels?

    I have a Landcruiser diesel, built before low sulphur diesel was invented, which has a manual pump and of course no DPF. I add 0.5% 2 stroke oil to my fuel to lubricate pump etc. It seems to make the engine run a bit quieter (which could be evidence that it has increased the cetane rating), but I don't really notice an improvement in fuel economy. Clearly my Landcruiser is in a very different category to modern computer-managed diesel engines built in the era of LSD, but I mention it just to make the point that some of the arguments in favour are really talking about engines like mine.

    I use outboard motor 2-stroke oil, as outboard motors being water cooled have lower combustion temperatures, therefore the oil should burn properly at the temperature a water-cooled diesel engine runs at.

    Cheers

    Alec

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    Any type of 2 Stroke Oil for Diesel?-images.jpg

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    Or you could use Flashlube diesel conditioner. Ive been using it in the 406 stdt for at least 5 years 470k
    PUG 406 STDT

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    WLB
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    Quote Originally Posted by myshell View Post
    Or you could use Flashlube diesel conditioner. I've been using it in the 406 stdt for at least 5 years 470k
    Ditto. Although mine's only at 415k.
    Although this is an engine designed for the old fuel.
    Last edited by WLB; 24th March 2015 at 07:24 PM.

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    Hi,
    I ran into these "adding two-stroke to diesel" theories years ago when running compression ignition series IIa and III Landrovers. These old series motors were pretty crude devices and the fuel back then had a high sulphur and wax content. There was a superior fuel available known as Alpine Diesel, but it was expensive.
    I would be wary of adding two stroke oil to modern fuels in modern C.I. engines before consulting B.P. and Caltex.
    An expert mechanic once advised me to add an eggcup of Castrol TT to each tank of fuel in my BSA A65L motorcycle to help "lubricate the valve assembly". Before this mixture performed it's miracles, it totally gummed up the carburettors.
    Personally, I feel your 407 and 307 are pretty sophisticated machines and as all reputable fuel manufacturers offer diesel fuel stabilisers/conditioners, I would be hesitant to use 60's and 70's tricks and tips in them.
    This is only my opinion.

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    WLB
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    I completely agree.

    I can also add some info about Alpine mix. I can't say what it might be now, if it still exists; but I can tell you what it was.
    I started skiing when I was 11 so we regularly drove up to the snow each winter, for decades since the early '60s. For many years we had a diesel generator powering a club lodge on Mt. Baw Baw.
    Victorian produced diesel fuel was quite waxy and this could cause the fuel to become a bit gelatinous at low temperatures. When the engine cools down, the fuel system clogs up. I've seen diesel Land-Rovers taken into the high country in winter requiring a fire to be carefully lit under the sump to warm the engine, before it would start the next morning. Anyone aware of this problem would either use a Caltex additive (can't remember its name) or leave their tank a bit low when leaving Melbourne and fill up with Alpine mix in say Mansfield (for Mt. Buller) or Mt. Beauty (for Falls Ck.), etc. Alpine mix was the only diesel supplied at the bowser in these sub-alpine towns in winter. I don't recall it being any different in price.
    With the old Lister generator on Baw Baw, we would get the fuel merchant from Warragul to fill our 450L tank each year before winter set in. They did the rounds of the village, filling everyone's generator tanks on a pre-season milk run. Warragul, not being a sub-alpine town, didn't sell Alpine mix at the bowser, so the fuel merchant mixed his own. It was just diesel with a dash of kero, to keep the wax dissolved. I can't recall the ratio, but it was a largish dash.

    I have no idea if currently available diesel in Vic has a wax problem, but as it's probably imported these days, and the sulphur removal has required a more refined finished product (as have modern engines), I suspect it isn't a problem anymore.

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    mmm. Two stroke in diesel discussion.
    I use shellite which is napthaline. It is the main ingredient in fuel cleaners for both diesel and petrol. Shellite costs around $8 a litre. A comparison on my little bmw e46 is 650km on a full tank without, 780+ with (about 250ml).
    I use it on my diesels as well. Jury is out on this at present.
    Go to this link- a PDF (safe) which is industry article that scientifically examines different additives in diesel fuel. It specifically addresses itself to cetane rating but is pertinent to the present article.
    https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&r...,d.bGQ&cad=rjt

    The second link I offer here addresses itself specifically to a comparison of various additives to diesel fuel and tests these in a systematic manner- once again it is a safe PDF link:

    https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&r...,d.bGQ&cad=rjt

    HTH

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    For lubricity, 2% bio diesel appears to out perform everything and NSW diesel by law SHOULD comply with that spec. I think WLB summed it years ago when he said "adding Flashlube for insurance" made good sense.
    Especially if you owned the over priced and precarious lucas epic injector pump
    Last edited by myshell; 27th March 2015 at 06:07 PM.
    PUG 406 STDT

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    WLB
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    Although, that was more to do with living with the curse of the Epic Lucas 406 pump.

    Slightly off-topic Myshell, how's the rest of your 406 going? Mine (now my son's) is getting very tired. Clutch feels worn. Rear-end linkages need doing, again! Mystery clonk from rear-end. Central locking still on the fritz. Goes through engine oil more than it should.
    I can't remember - what pump did you put in? Did you go with the 405 Bosch, or did you find another Epic?

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    In short it sounds like we are suffering common ailments.
    I got a "reco" (ha) epic pump from "diesel bob" and it was a heap of crap - leaked the day i put it on and lasted 150k.
    I then purchased a brand new epic (on a good exchange rate) from France, built 2010 and the engine has been purring ever since. Apart from belts and pulleys the engine remains untouched and doesn't leak or use oil. Gearbox and clutch feel strong. Touch wood.

    Have replaced engine mounts, radiator, Front wheel bearings, anti roll bar links on front, rear-end linkages. Most annoyingly, I had to replace the front and rear windscreens, and ended up with cheap inferior glass that fogs and can't be cleaned properly. The central locking is playing up, one door doesn't lock intermittently. Oh and the clear coat paint is peeling off.

    Autumn has descended on the "Gypsy Rose", she hasn't gone to seed yet.
    PUG 406 STDT

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    Perhaps the reality of additives into diesel fuel is that the compression ignition engine, devised by Dr. Diesel, was able to run only many fuels. Coal dust, flour dust, oils and crude petroleum.
    The modern, common rail, turbocharged C.I. engine needs modern fuels, correct servicing and, perhaps, an inexpensive fuel conditioner.

  20. #20
    WLB
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    Quote Originally Posted by myshell View Post
    In short it sounds like we are suffering common ailments.
    I got a "reco" (ha) epic pump from "diesel bob" and it was a heap of crap - leaked the day i put it on and lasted 150k.
    I then purchased a brand new epic (on a good exchange rate) from France, built 2010 and the engine has been purring ever since. Apart from belts and pulleys the engine remains untouched and doesn't leak or use oil. Gearbox and clutch feel strong. Touch wood.

    Have replaced engine mounts, radiator, Front wheel bearings, anti roll bar links on front, rear-end linkages. Most annoyingly, I had to replace the front and rear windscreens, and ended up with cheap inferior glass that fogs and can't be cleaned properly. The central locking is playing up, one door doesn't lock intermittently. Oh and the clear coat paint is peeling off.

    Autumn has descended on the "Gypsy Rose", she hasn't gone to seed yet.
    Ah, yes ... Diesel Bob. Interesting to hear of your experience. Lucky you found a new one. I was lucky to find a low mileage pump from a written off car in the UK, on eBay, and have a friend over there arrange collection and shipping. I even had Mike (Catshamlet) chasing one for me at one stage. I've still got a good 405 Bosch pump sitting in the shed as insurance, but fortunately the pump has held up and now the rest of the car is expiring around it. The passage of time, and experience, now tells us that the Epic pump wasn't quite the problem it appeared to be back then. It was simply the changes in Australian diesel fuel.

    If you get to the stage where the central locking is a big problem and you can't fix it, then deactivating it will take you back to good old fashioned manual locking. If you get stuck somewhere and it won't lock, the quick fix is to pull out the central locking fuse from the fuse box under the dash on the driver's side. It will then lock manually like cars used to. Lock 3 passenger doors by pushing the buttons, and lock driver's door with the key. Or lock LH doors by pushing the buttons, lock the driver's door by reaching over from the back door and pushing its button, then locking the RH back door by pushing the button and shutting the door. Unfortunately, the same fuse powers the radio's memory.

    The long-term fix to change to manual locking is to access the relay module behind the glovebox (and various removable panels) and unplug it. Or if you can't do that, prise it off its mounting clips. This may break the back out of the relay case if the clips don't release, but after you've become totally fed up with the locking system, you get to the point where you don't really care.

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    Quote Originally Posted by WLB View Post
    If you get to the stage where the central locking is a big problem and you can't fix it, then deactivating it will take you back to good old fashioned manual locking. If you get stuck somewhere and it won't lock, the quick fix is to pull out the central locking fuse from the fuse box under the dash on the driver's side. It will then lock manually like cars used to. Lock 3 passenger doors by pushing the buttons, and lock driver's door with the key. Or lock LH doors by pushing the buttons, lock the driver's door by reaching over from the back door and pushing its button, then locking the RH back door by pushing the button and shutting the door. Unfortunately, the same fuse powers the radio's memory.

    The long-term fix to change to manual locking is to access the relay module behind the glovebox (and various removable panels) and unplug it. Or if you can't do that, prise it off its mounting clips. This may break the back out of the relay case if the clips don't release, but after you've become totally fed up with the locking system, you get to the point where you don't really care.
    And, unfortunately, 406 door locks don't seem to be robust enough to tolerate long term manual locking via the key.

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    WLB
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Chisholm View Post
    And, unfortunately, 406 door locks don't seem to be robust enough to tolerate long term manual locking via the key.
    And that's yet another problem. When the driver's door lock gives up, you have to shift to using the passenger door lock, or do all your locking without the key and use it only for unlocking - thereby reducing usage by half. The strange thing is that the mechanical function of the key in the lock appears random or intermittent. It will spin uselessly for days and then work perfectly for awhile. The ideal would be to find a way to isolate all electric locking function from every door except the driver's.
    An even better solution would have been for me to spend half the money I spent buying the 406 on one of my 505 SRD Turbos, including a respray, and not replacing them.

  23. #23
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    Try lubricating the door locks, a quick splash of WD40 on the key brought both of mine back to function.
    406 HDi

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    Quote Originally Posted by hypermiler View Post
    Try lubricating the door locks, a quick splash of WD40 on the key brought both of mine back to function.
    I think you might have been lucky. WD40 and any lubricant other than graphite powder shouldn't be used in lock cylinders as it causes the tumblers to stick.
    68 404 likes this.

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    [QUOTE=WLB;1340719]And that's yet another problem. When the driver's door lock gives up, you have to shift to using the passenger door lock, or do all your locking without the key and use it only for unlocking - thereby reducing usage by half. The strange thing is that the mechanical function of the key in the lock appears random or intermittent. It will spin uselessly for days and then work perfectly for awhile. The ideal would be to find a way to isolate all electric locking function from every door except the driver's.QUOTE]

    This is really getting off topic! This is exactly what happened with my 406 and lubricating with Inox worked only for a while. I was lucky as a new microswitch, battery and key button fixed the remote.

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