V6 extractors
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Thread: V6 extractors

  1. #1
    Tadpole
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    Default V6 extractors

    Hi guys, just wondering if anyone knows if there are extractors you can buy for the es9j4s?

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  2. #2
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Quote Originally Posted by It's French View Post
    Hi guys, just wondering if anyone knows if there are extractors you can buy for the es9j4s?
    Please explain, more information please ???
    Alain

  3. #3
    Demannu-facturing! Demannu's Avatar
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    The problem you will have is retaining the catalytic converters (x4) and oxygen sensors (x4).

    Removing the first cats causes an error to display on the dash and restricts the engine to a degraded mode of operation. The oxygen sensors after the first cats are expecting an 'improvement' in air quality to the air passing the oxygen sensors before the first cats. Very clever engines.

    V6 extractors-wp_20150210_002.jpg
    Last edited by Demannu; 11th February 2015 at 03:52 PM. Reason: added pictures!
    Scotty

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  4. #4
    Tadpole
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    Can you replace the cats after the engine ones with no problems?

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    Demannu-facturing! Demannu's Avatar
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    Yes, the second cats can be upgraded/removed without issue, but probably without benefit also.
    Scotty

    Melbourne - Dandenong Ranges

    1956 Peugeot 403 - 'Francois' - resto project

    1969 Peugeot 504 - 'Pascal' - daily driver project

    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility - 'Brutus' - resto project

    1978 Peugeot 604 - as yet unnamed - V6 on straight LPG

    1987 Peugeot 505 - as yet unnamed - project car

    1999 Peugeot 406 Coupé - 'Chloe' - 5 speed manual

    2011 Peugeot 3008 XTE HDi - 'Zoe' - hatchback on steroids

    2014 Peugeot RCZ - 'Remy'

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    Demannu-facturing! Demannu's Avatar
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    I should also mention, there is talk of a guy in the UK who has a way to reflash your ECU so that it no longer uses the second O2 sensor readings, eliminating the issue of degraded running and warnings. However, as far as I can tell, he needs the whole car in front of him.
    Scotty

    Melbourne - Dandenong Ranges

    1956 Peugeot 403 - 'Francois' - resto project

    1969 Peugeot 504 - 'Pascal' - daily driver project

    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility - 'Brutus' - resto project

    1978 Peugeot 604 - as yet unnamed - V6 on straight LPG

    1987 Peugeot 505 - as yet unnamed - project car

    1999 Peugeot 406 Coupé - 'Chloe' - 5 speed manual

    2011 Peugeot 3008 XTE HDi - 'Zoe' - hatchback on steroids

    2014 Peugeot RCZ - 'Remy'

    1999 Range Rover 4.6 HSE - 'Grover' - tow car

  7. #7
    con
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    Quote Originally Posted by Demannu View Post
    The problem you will have is retaining the catalytic converters (x4) and oxygen sensors (x4).

    Removing the first cats causes an error to display on the dash and restricts the engine to a degraded mode of operation. The oxygen sensors after the first cats are expecting an 'improvement' in air quality to the air passing the oxygen sensors before the first cats. Very clever engines.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    This is purely theoretical.

    Oxygen sensors send an A/C voltage to the ECU. The A/C voltage varies depending on amount of (believe it or not) oxygen in the exhaust gas. The first sensor would have a lower amplitude than the one after the catalytic converter.

    To "fool" the ECU it may be possible to simulate this condition (I would even try a DC voltage to start with work).

    Just a thought.

  8. #8
    Tadpole
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    Reason I ask is because my mate is doing a custom stainless steel exhaust system. I don't want it loud, but I would like a bit more performance. I've noticed the es94js is more torquey between 2-4000 revs than the es9j4, but feels as if it has less power over 4000 revs compared to the es9j4. I might be imagining it, but I was thinking a twin 2.5 inch after the engine (from the main flange) with 2 high flow cats and one/two mufflers. Any thoughts?

  9. #9
    Contented Peugeot Driver addo's Avatar
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    Nitrous?

    You could readily use O2 dummies and put straight pipe inside your cats.

  10. #10
    Demannu-facturing! Demannu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by It's French View Post
    Reason I ask is because my mate is doing a custom stainless steel exhaust system. I don't want it loud, but I would like a bit more performance. I've noticed the es94js is more torquey between 2-4000 revs than the es9j4, but feels as if it has less power over 4000 revs compared to the es9j4. I might be imagining it, but I was thinking a twin 2.5 inch after the engine (from the main flange) with 2 high flow cats and one/two mufflers. Any thoughts?
    The VVT on the J4S is only active from idle speed (though not while the throttle is closed) to 4520rpm. After that, the camshaft returns to the normal position, and no longer gets any benefit from having VVT. It does however have an improved port design, better injector spray pattern and higher compression than the early engine, but all this is pretty much sapped by the complex exhaust system.

    I think the manifolds and the first cats are the biggest restriction, the second cats look pretty good.

    I have fitted a D8 exhaust system and 'sports' catalytic converter to my D9 engine, between that and the aftermarket ECU, the power delivery across the RPM range is vicious!
    Scotty

    Melbourne - Dandenong Ranges

    1956 Peugeot 403 - 'Francois' - resto project

    1969 Peugeot 504 - 'Pascal' - daily driver project

    1970 Peugeot 404 Utility - 'Brutus' - resto project

    1978 Peugeot 604 - as yet unnamed - V6 on straight LPG

    1987 Peugeot 505 - as yet unnamed - project car

    1999 Peugeot 406 Coupé - 'Chloe' - 5 speed manual

    2011 Peugeot 3008 XTE HDi - 'Zoe' - hatchback on steroids

    2014 Peugeot RCZ - 'Remy'

    1999 Range Rover 4.6 HSE - 'Grover' - tow car

  11. #11
    Tadpole
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    So the headers on the es9j4 are the same as the s without those cats? Do you have to get a remap when doing this? Or can you cut the cats out of the s and remap it?

    Basically, I want the most power I can get out of the engine with an exhaust and remap. So how do you get around the cats at the engine in the s?

  12. #12
    Tadpole
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    * remap or aftermarket Ecu

  13. #13
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    Default Oxygen sensors

    Quote Originally Posted by It's French View Post
    * remap or aftermarket Ecu
    Re O2 sensors, aren't they just a very sensitive temperature sensor? Only that my old GTi 505 wagon runs much more economically, though not more powerfully after reinstating the Cat with one that wasn't extremely free-flow, ie see thru ! So I thought the O2 sensor which is in front of it could only be seeing a higher temp sooner and thus telling the ecu to run leaner.
    JH
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    '84 505 Sti ba7/5, '86 505 Sli ba7/4 fam (project), 405GRI auto. Too many....

  14. #14
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    There was an episode of Top Gear where James May fitted extractors, exhaust and different intake to one of these engines (in a Renault Avantime) and managed to improved the horsepower at the wheels from less than 160 to more than 190. Basically, after the mods the power at the wheels was the same as the power at the flywheel for the standard engine.

    For entertainment's sake they said they got the engine back up to new horsepower, because they couldn't be bothered explaining the difference between flywheel horsepower and wheel horsepower. They did a similar thing on another episode where they put a number of older hot hatches on a chassis dyno and said they'd lost a heap of power since new, but if you checked the figures, they were exactly what new versions used to get when put on a chassis dyno. 100kW cars usually only get about 70-75kW on a chassis dyno. That's not to say they loose 30% through the drivetrain (more like 15-20%), it's just that the offical power ratings are probably more often based on the initial hand built prototypes, rather than engines off the fully "up to speed" production line.
    Last edited by davemcbean; 10th September 2016 at 11:39 AM.
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