Peugeot 205 gti suspension options
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Thread: Peugeot 205 gti suspension options

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    Fellow Frogger! deltone's Avatar
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    Default Peugeot 205 gti suspension options

    Hey all, need to get some new suspension on the GTi. I currently have koni yellows front and back and eibach springs on the front. I will put these on the CTi.

    Keeping in mind the engine is a 405 T16 so lots of weight and lots of power.

    what options are recommended these days?

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    205 GTi T16

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    Fellow Frogger! patpug's Avatar
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    My 2 cents...

    If its a road car, keep the eibachs and the konis on it, 21mm TBs, cut down 24mm rear ARB from gti6, rear trailing arms off gti6, solid rear beam mounts, group n front strut tops, black power flex lower arm bushes. Will be great for the odd track day also.

    Oh yeah, very important to keep unsprung weight down so don't go crazy with huge front brakes, even with the turbo, maybe best to get 4pot calipers on smallish (266mm) discs.

    Pat
    205 gti-6

    205 track car build in progress http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/res...-race-car.html

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    1000+ Posts cam85's Avatar
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    As above. If your not happy with the konis try something softer like the B6 bilsteins.

    Unless it just for the track you cant use the performance of anything expensive on the road anyway!

    Cam
    94 205 Gti Classic #9
    91 205 Si
    87 205 GTi Race Car
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    I have some 185 lb springs (Kings) with competition Bilsteins if you are interested.
    These would be good on bitumen, I have gone back to 160 lb springs plus MCA for gravel.


    Quote Originally Posted by deltone View Post
    Hey all, need to get some new suspension on the GTi. I currently have koni yellows front and back and eibach springs on the front. I will put these on the CTi.

    Keeping in mind the engine is a 405 T16 so lots of weight and lots of power.

    what options are recommended these days?

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    Fellow Frogger! deltone's Avatar
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    Thanks Patpug, thats a nice list! I have all these available except for the front antiroll bar! As for the brakes i have a GTi6 setup... 287mm i think. They work well

    the solid rear beam mounts would be too hard for road application wouldnt they?



    @Graham, what kind of bilstein are they and are they coil overs or normal struts? Oh and what ride height?
    Last edited by deltone; 19th September 2014 at 09:24 AM.
    205 GTi T16

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    Normal struts, they are Group N, I can give you the part number if you like. Proper yellow single tube inverted struts not the black after market replacement ones.
    I also have a set of Bilstein coil overs with 220 lb springs, these need new inserts.
    Graham


    Quote Originally Posted by deltone View Post
    Thanks Patpug, thats a nice list! I have all these available except for the front antiroll bar! As for the brakes i have a GTi6 setup... 287mm i think. They work well

    the solid rear beam mounts would be too hard for road application wouldnt they?



    @Graham, what kind of bilstein are they and are they coil overs or normal struts? Oh and what ride height?

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    Fellow Frogger! patpug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deltone View Post
    Thanks Patpug, thats a nice list! I have all these available except for the front antiroll bar! As for the brakes i have a GTi6 setup... 287mm i think. They work well

    the solid rear beam mounts would be too hard for road application wouldnt they?
    That list is what i've got on my car and it's great for a fast road setup. Yeah, bit bumpy but if I wanted comfort I wouldn't drive a 205 :-) Not a bad compromise though. Cam and I have tried a few different combinations between us and this seems to work well. I drive mine on a bumpy country road a lot and it's pretty good once you get the speed up a bit - I also have started to lower the tyre pressure around town (low speed bumps aren't good) when I'm going slower to keep my teeth in my head ha ha...

    The solid beam mounts don't actually contribute to 'crashiness' all that much, Group N strut top mounts and the powerflex lower arm bushes actually make more difference to ride comfort - but are absolutely worth it in terms of how direct the steering is now. The solid mounts makes a big difference to the back end feel and precision in the bends. The other big items are the 24mm rear arb and the gti6 trailing arms - the extra track and rear camber from the arms transform the car at speed. You still get that awesome 205 lift off oversteer, but not as much, and the car feels much more planted, less nervous (that is both car and driver feeling less nervous!).

    It seems that so many people put stiffer lowered springs on the front and reset the rear TBs to lower the car and expect it to handle better - you've got to up the rear spring and shock rate to match the change at the front otherwise you're just making the car handle worse. If you're really serious you need to take your springs and shocks to a good suspension place and get the shocks re-valved to the spring rate, and then corner weight the car.

    On front springs, I think the eibachs are the best for a road car because they are variable rate.

    Pat
    205 gti-6

    205 track car build in progress http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/res...-race-car.html

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    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    All of the above, except I like standard springs reset 25mm lower. Post a pic of your current front ride height.

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

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    Ride height is lower than standard as I had 4 mm thick strengthening plates under the tops of the strut towers and it sat no higher than standard.
    With the extra weight of the T16 engine it should be ideal.
    Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS View Post
    Normal struts, they are Group N, I can give you the part number if you like. Proper yellow single tube inverted struts not the black after market replacement ones.
    I also have a set of Bilstein coil overs with 220 lb springs, these need new inserts.
    Graham

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    Fellow Frogger! deltone's Avatar
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    thanks Cam, your suspensions sound good. The coil overs sound good but 220Lb?? is that very stiff?

    I have Eibach 7001 springs how do you reken these compare?

    i have attached pics of my current ride height.

    Patpug, thanks heaps for the feedback on your setup. certainly good knowledge there! i dont know if i want such a stiff ride thou.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Peugeot 205 gti suspension options-image.jpg   Peugeot 205 gti suspension options-image.jpg  
    205 GTi T16

    205 CTi

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    Fellow Frogger! patpug's Avatar
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    Wow - car looks great! Bit low in the front maybe, are your front wishbones parallel with the ground or pointing up a bit? They should be flat.

    Maybe if you're not into teeth rattling try PeterT's standard front spring reset lower and 20mm rear TBs...
    205 gti-6

    205 track car build in progress http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/res...-race-car.html

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    Fellow Frogger! deltone's Avatar
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    Well i think that as the car is mostly driven on the road it may be too hard! What i have now is a good compromise.

    I do wonder thou wether my rear setup (standard) is too soft compared to the front? Maybe i will replicate the front setup with some coil overs to get the right height and allow for the possibility of installing a strut top camber/caster adjuster. I guess i would choose an adjustable shock absorber and choose a suitable fast road spring rate. If i was attending a track day, i would them change the spring over to a stiff one? Would this be hard to do?


    as for the back, i could stick to the original TB and set the height according to the front (i think this should be slightly higher than the front) and upgrade the ARB to a stiffer one. Then on a track day i would need to swap TB for stiffer ones to match the front!

    as for bushes, since i would be running fast road suspension, having hard bushes wont be so bad but when i swap to the stiff stuff it would be ideal to have the bushes!

    What do yours think of these options? Feasible?
    205 GTi T16

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    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    I'd leave the front springs as is and do the rear as Pat suggested. It's a common mistake to start fiddling with the front first. Don't even consider swapping the front arb.

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

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    Fellow Frogger! deltone's Avatar
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    Cool!

    i have installed a set of original gti springs and struts tonight. I wonder how this will drive now. I have never driven my gti with stock suspension!!
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    205 GTi T16

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    Fellow Frogger! deltone's Avatar
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    Drove the car yesterday with standard frint shocks and springs. The ride height seems only marginally higher than the lowered eibachs. This is prob due to the heavier engine. The front end seems to bounce around a bit. Could be due to old shocks i guess.

    just seems that when you approach a bump the shocks compress more thsn the konis and when you get ti the peak of the bump the car lifts more than with the konis. Overall the car seems more settled with the konis and eibachs.

    With the konis the car just seems more settled and seems to interact with the road more.

    I guess this is the difference with the higher bound rebound rates. I am not educated on this matter so i will need some help here!! How do these values work and what should a setup be like?
    205 GTi T16

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    Fellow Frogger! deltone's Avatar
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    Stumbled across this thread on 205 drivers

    How Not To Modify Your 205's Suspension... - Brakes, Suspension & Steering - 205GTIDrivers.com

    quite an interesting read!


    i guess i need to rethink suspension properly and go for a standard set-up althou slightly stiffer. But the way i see it, ride height here is the killer unless you readjust everything accordingly.... And this is not done easily on a 205. Especially the rear beam.

    Im thinking of adjustable coil overs that give me the flexibilit to adjust boud and rebound rates and heights! Now i gotta price these things up!!

    has anyone fitted adjustable strut tops?
    205 GTi T16

    205 CTi

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    Yes, had them made by MCA.
    What is wrong with leaving the ride height standard, I don't see any benefit with lowering it.

    Quote Originally Posted by deltone View Post
    Stumbled across this thread on 205 drivers

    How Not To Modify Your 205's Suspension... - Brakes, Suspension & Steering - 205GTIDrivers.com

    quite an interesting read!


    i guess i need to rethink suspension properly and go for a standard set-up althou slightly stiffer. But the way i see it, ride height here is the killer unless you readjust everything accordingly.... And this is not done easily on a 205. Especially the rear beam.

    Im thinking of adjustable coil overs that give me the flexibilit to adjust boud and rebound rates and heights! Now i gotta price these things up!!

    has anyone fitted adjustable strut tops?

  18. #18
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    Why not try the Koni's with the standard springs? Unless you're going to race it, I'd stay clear of the coil overs. I use to get around Wakefield Park in 1:15 with a standard front springs, revalved Koni's and 21mm torsion bars - with an 8V engine.

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

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    1000+ Posts cam85's Avatar
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    Ive got 200lbs springs in the front of mine. 21mm bars at the rear are about 148lbs.

    Ive got adjustable strut tops and have had my struts both front and rear valved for the spring rates and weight of the car.

    My car is used both on road and track. Knowing what I know now and how the car behaves on the road I would not bother again. The ability of the car is far and above what is legal on the road and with a roll cage would be a serious road rally car.

    Im glad I did pursue it as Ive learnt a lot. Ive also waster lots of $ in the process.

    IMHO. Keep your konis and eibachs. Make sure you lower the rear to match the front height. Buy an22-23-24mm rear Arb. The rear Arb makes the biggest difference once youve turned in and are on the power.

    If you are to go coilovers, be warned it will be expensive. Cheap coilovers are just that. Cheap and crap! My ride at the moment is stiff and feels much more at home and compliment once youve driving it hard. The suspension begins to 'work'. Its no longer 'fun' at low speeds (roundabouts etc) as it is designed for high speed.

    If you have standard rear bars either upgrade to 20-21mm or get rid of the eibachs. Run standard springs reset as peter has said.

    Buy a rear Arb first and lower the rear to match the front. Youll love it! If not, then start spending $ on coilovers.



    Cam
    94 205 Gti Classic #9
    91 205 Si
    87 205 GTi Race Car
    http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/res...-race-car.html

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    Fellow Frogger! deltone's Avatar
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    Good feedback there guys.

    in one instance i was thinking of going back to standard ride height... But i guess since i already have konis and lowered eibacks i might as well leave them and work on the rear and see the outcome.

    i have GTi6 torsion bars, can these be cut and resplined, and will these provide more stiffness in the rear? I do not know the rating of the gti6 bars. Or am i best off buying a set of 21 mm bars?

    Cam, which size ARB are you suggesting? You wrote 22 23 25mm?
    205 GTi T16

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    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    torsion bars are "upset" ie the ends are usually bigger than the diameter. Sorry, you'll need to buy torsion bars. You can make a 306 ARB fit by shortening and resplining however. You need the bigger 306 ARB arms, as fitted to GTi6, XSi, S16 and maybe even HDi.

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

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    Fellow Frogger! deltone's Avatar
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    Peter, i do have GTi6 arms. Is it the 205 rear beam torsion bar housing that is a different size to the GTi6 TB?
    205 GTi T16

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    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    Same size splines, 306 torsion bars (and ARB) are longer.
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    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

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    Fellow Frogger! deltone's Avatar
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    I thought the 306 torsion bars could be shortened and resplined as well??
    205 GTi T16

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    Fellow Frogger! deltone's Avatar
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    Now, what suspension bushes are recommended for the 205? This is for front struts top bushes, Wishbones and antiroll bar and for the rear i know about the group n blocks or solid, but what about the other small bushes on the beam?
    205 GTi T16

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