Mi16 warning light
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  1. #1
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    Default Mi16 warning light

    Greetings,

    My Mi16 lights up the service warning light if I hit 4000 RPM.
    If I then back off to idle it goes out.

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    Only kicks in at 4000? Any ideas where I should start? O2 sensor?

    Thanks
    1989 505 Gti II Wagon 323K and still strong.
    1990 405 Mi16
    1982 BMW 528i

  2. #2
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    I'd suggest disconnect your battery & leave off for at least a half hour to give it a chance to reset itself.
    If it still does this afterwards, I'd suggest finding someone to read the fault codes in the computer otherwise it's just hit & miss & can costa fortune but still have the problem.

    When disconnecting, remember; - side first

    When reconnecting: + side first, that tends to reduce the chances of power spikes & sending things back where they came from.


    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

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    Thanks muchly for that Alan, getting someone to access the codes was my next step but will try the disconnect first!

    Is there any way a commoner can get examine the codes?

    Cheers
    1989 505 Gti II Wagon 323K and still strong.
    1990 405 Mi16
    1982 BMW 528i

  4. #4
    1000+ Posts Pug_405_Mi16's Avatar
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    Monty,

    Get used to it, series 1's do that sort of stuff....it's all part of the package...I know on mine if I corner hard left the stop light comes on...as soon as you are out of the corner it goes out again.....

    My auntie has the same car....her lights come on all the time, she said she just keeps driving if they dont turn off after a minute or 2 then there could be a problem


    Ben
    1989 Peugeot 405 Mi16
    1990 Peugeot 505 GTD Turbo Wagon
    2000 Peugeot 306 XSI
    1973 Peugeot 504 GL





  5. #5
    Fellow Frogger! Mitch Mi16's Avatar
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    Knock sensor could be disconneted... mine does that....
    THE MAD PUGGA

    1989 405 Mi16 (PGT-405)

  6. #6
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    Default 405 codes

    Quote Originally Posted by monty
    Is there any way a commoner can get examine the codes?
    Cheers
    Don't disconnect it yet!

    Yes, there is a way to do DIY code reading. All you need is a home-made jumper harness, comprised of two lengths of wire, preferably a switch (could just touch the bared wires to each other if you're desperate or don't have a spare switch anywhere), a male terminal on one end (narrow width) and an eyelet connector at the other end........and the procedure.

    You'll need two people to do this. One to operate the jumper harness and one to sit in the car and read the sequence of blinking lights. Essentially, the jumper harness is connected to a good ground (use the eyelet to bolt it to a grounded engine component or the chassis) and the male terminal has to be inserted into one of the test socket's two female connectors. This test socket is located in the relay box.

    I have the Peugeot manual for the 405 (CDN/USA version) with Motronic, so the procedure and codes are the same as with the Mi16. I coudl email a scan of the procedure and code table to you if you'd like.

    The code table pinpoints the allegedly faulty component. I say alleged because the wiring system in any Peugeot built after the 1970s is -ahem- less than perfect and many codes are thrown because of bad connections or dampness in the wiring. But at least knowing the component area that is giving rise to the codes can narrow your search somewhat and allow you to test the connections first.

    My guess? RPM sensor, but you'll have to do a diagnostic to know....

    Let me know.

    Mike Tippett, Canada
    [email protected]

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by monty
    Greetings,

    My Mi16 lights up the service warning light if I hit 4000 RPM.
    If I then back off to idle it goes out.

    Only kicks in at 4000? Any ideas where I should start? O2 sensor?

    Thanks
    Hi, Monty

    Without Diag... Disconnecting the battery is the best option as perfectly advised in this thread.. in addistion When.. you have reconnected switch the Key on to full red's for at least 30 seconds.. this allows the ECU to reset correctly from it's protection strat's.. Mi16 XU9 s1 big problem unmetered air trigger's the light. Hard to track down and can be intermittent!!! (purge related)
    If still after all this, a pain in your side.. easy way to know for sure,, Take to a good dealer for diag test, or Dyno time to check Mixture's when fault occurs...$60-80....

    99 % of the time diag say's "Mixture regulation fault"

    Good luck...

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    Quote Originally Posted by J4RS
    Hi, Monty

    Without Diag... Disconnecting the battery is the best option as perfectly advised in this thread.. in addistion When.. you have reconnected switch the Key on to full red's for at least 30 seconds.. this allows the ECU to reset correctly from it's protection strat's.. Mi16 XU9 s1 big problem unmetered air trigger's the light. Hard to track down and can be intermittent!!! (purge related)
    If still after all this, a pain in your side.. easy way to know for sure,, Take to a good dealer for diag test, or Dyno time to check Mixture's when fault occurs...$60-80....

    99 % of the time diag say's "Mixture regulation fault"

    Good luck...
    What the ***!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Please Canada dude tell me more!!!!!!

    Share the Knowledge.....!!!!


  9. #9
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    Default really?

    Quote Originally Posted by J4RS
    Without Diag... Disconnecting the battery is the best option as perfectly advised in this thread.. in addistion When.. you have reconnected switch the Key on to full red's for at least 30 seconds.. this allows the ECU to reset correctly from it's protection strat's.. Mi16 XU9 s1 big problem unmetered air trigger's the light. Hard to track down and can be intermittent!!! (purge related)
    If still after all this, a pain in your side.. easy way to know for sure,, Take to a good dealer for diag test, or Dyno time to check Mixture's when fault occurs...$60-80....
    Disconnecting the battery will do nothing to reveal the source area of the fault, so it's only advised if you have no interest in where the problem is originating.

    Pay a dealer for a diagnostic? Why? You can do it with 10 cents worth of wire, a second person and five minutes of your time.

    Besides, if the battery has been disconnected, there will be no codes for the dealer to read, sounds like a waste of good money to me either way.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by M. Tippett
    Disconnecting the battery will do nothing to reveal the source area of the fault, so it's only advised if you have no interest in where the problem is originating.

    Pay a dealer for a diagnostic? Why? You can do it with 10 cents worth of wire, a second person and five minutes of your time.

    Besides, if the battery has been disconnected, there will be no codes for the dealer to read, sounds like a waste of good money to me either way.
    Sorry, did'nt realise the dealer network in canada was so hard up for money..

    Takes 2 minutes in front of customer so they can see for themselves...

    charge them for two minutes!!!!..... 13 grand Diag operated by Pug tech ....10 cent wire, 1 hour looking for it in the garage, 10 minutes ringing your mate to ask if you've understood your advise.. clever as it may be.. if there is a problem it would re-logg in miunte's of driving..

    My Dyno advise is a last resort... but conclusive...




  11. #11
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    The idea behind disconnecting is to eliminate the option of a gltch in the system that keeps recurring; chances are if it is there due to a temporary malfunction it's in fact not a fault the reader is going to pick up anyway. This way as I said, you start with a clean sheet.
    To not do this is akin to trying to get water out of the petrol without draining the tank; you'll get there eventually, but it's the long way round.
    We recently had a job on a 405 that had an air leak on the intake side hoses attached to the mixture control. Once a meter was connected to the exhaust, it soon became obvious it was mixture related. That takes about 2 seconds to do if you want to eliminate the mixture or leaks from the equation and any decent engine tuner should have the gear to do that test. They don't have to be froggy mechanics.

    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  12. #12
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    Default umm

    Quote Originally Posted by J4RS
    Sorry, did'nt realise the dealer network in canada was so hard up for money..

    Takes 2 minutes in front of customer so they can see for themselves...

    charge them for two minutes!!!!..... 13 grand Diag operated by Pug tech ....10 cent wire, 1 hour looking for it in the garage, 10 minutes ringing your mate to ask if you've understood your advise.. clever as it may be.. if there is a problem it would re-logg in miunte's of driving..

    My Dyno advise is a last resort... but conclusive...
    A few points:

    1. I'm just trying to be helpful, and correct me if I'm wrong, but the motto of Aussiefrogs is "Sharing the Knowledge". You may not be interested in understanding how to do a MOTRONIC diagnosis, but - just maybe - someone else will be.

    2. Even if disconnecting would clear an operating fault internal to the ECU, is it not prudent to firstly do a DIY diagnosis to see if there might be a numbered (coded) fault, before clearing it? If the diagnostic test reveals no fault, then by all means, disconnect. As I wrote, this test is laughably simple, and I have the procedures and code table from the Peugeot factory manual and I'm willing to share.

    3. There are no Peugeot dealers in Canada, in fact Peugeots have not been sold in North America (Mexico excepted) for going on 13 years. We do have a very few service centres, a handful in this country (which hardly qualifies as a network) where you most assuredly would be charged at least $10-25 for a diagnostic test, unless you know the owner. People who still drive a Peugeot on a daily basis in this country are either stupid or desperate, or maybe both

    4. The hand-held TAD99 tester and similar ones that electronically display the error code is fairly standard and costs maybe a couple of hundred bucks, not $13K. Two chunks of wire are still cheaper, though

    5. Anyone can do the diagnostic test with a jumper wire, it's so simple and foolproof. Really......anyone.....

    6. If it takes you an hour to find 30 cm of wire in your garage, maybe it's time to purge.......

    Again, if anyone wants a scan of the diagnostic procedure for the 405 and the error code table, email me.

    Regards,
    Mike Tippett

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    Quote Originally Posted by M. Tippett
    A few points:

    1. I'm just trying to be helpful, and correct me if I'm wrong, but the motto of Aussiefrogs is "Sharing the Knowledge". You may not be interested in understanding how to do a MOTRONIC diagnosis, but - just maybe - someone else will be.

    2. Even if disconnecting would clear an operating fault internal to the ECU, is it not prudent to firstly do a DIY diagnosis to see if there might be a numbered (coded) fault, before clearing it? If the diagnostic test reveals no fault, then by all means, disconnect. As I wrote, this test is laughably simple, and I have the procedures and code table from the Peugeot factory manual and I'm willing to share.

    3. There are no Peugeot dealers in Canada, in fact Peugeots have not been sold in North America (Mexico excepted) for going on 13 years. We do have a very few service centres, a handful in this country (which hardly qualifies as a network) where you most assuredly would be charged at least $10-25 for a diagnostic test, unless you know the owner. People who still drive a Peugeot on a daily basis in this country are either stupid or desperate, or maybe both

    4. The hand-held TAD99 tester and similar ones that electronically display the error code is fairly standard and costs maybe a couple of hundred bucks, not $13K. Two chunks of wire are still cheaper, though

    5. Anyone can do the diagnostic test with a jumper wire, it's so simple and foolproof. Really......anyone.....

    6. If it takes you an hour to find 30 cm of wire in your garage, maybe it's time to purge.......

    Again, if anyone wants a scan of the diagnostic procedure for the 405 and the error code table, email me.

    Regards,
    Mike Tippett
    Mike is right. The error codes are very easy to extract, with a some wire and a switch. Disconnecting the battery will erase all stored faults.

    '92 205 Mi16
    '90 Mi16x4

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by M. Tippett
    A few points:

    1. I'm just trying to be helpful, and correct me if I'm wrong, but the motto of Aussiefrogs is "Sharing the Knowledge". You may not be interested in understanding how to do a MOTRONIC diagnosis, but - just maybe - someone else will be.

    2. Even if disconnecting would clear an operating fault internal to the ECU, is it not prudent to firstly do a DIY diagnosis to see if there might be a numbered (coded) fault, before clearing it? If the diagnostic test reveals no fault, then by all means, disconnect. As I wrote, this test is laughably simple, and I have the procedures and code table from the Peugeot factory manual and I'm willing to share.

    3. There are no Peugeot dealers in Canada, in fact Peugeots have not been sold in North America (Mexico excepted) for going on 13 years. We do have a very few service centres, a handful in this country (which hardly qualifies as a network) where you most assuredly would be charged at least $10-25 for a diagnostic test, unless you know the owner. People who still drive a Peugeot on a daily basis in this country are either stupid or desperate, or maybe both

    4. The hand-held TAD99 tester and similar ones that electronically display the error code is fairly standard and costs maybe a couple of hundred bucks, not $13K. Two chunks of wire are still cheaper, though

    5. Anyone can do the diagnostic test with a jumper wire, it's so simple and foolproof. Really......anyone.....

    6. If it takes you an hour to find 30 cm of wire in your garage, maybe it's time to purge.......

    Again, if anyone wants a scan of the diagnostic procedure for the 405 and the error code table, email me.

    Regards,
    Mike Tippett
    Sorry Mr. Tappet,
    So if your operating in a country with out a dealer network with a product that has not been there for 13 Years you must be like those poor guy's in Cuba... Making panels from oil drums and bake bean tin's... 10 cent wire for god sake !!!! Listen.... Option 1. Take to dealer get them to check it out and quote you... Freeeee ! The guy live's in OZ... not Calgary.. so why bother????
    Option 2. Vietnamese telephone exchange field manual...

    Sorry man, but stop it....

    Great advise, very clever. But I see 5 to 8 Mi-16's a month amoung the 30+ pug's a day.. how many do you???




  15. #15
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    M.Tippett,

    Why not just attach the info to a message for all to see?
    It can be done on this board the same way as it's done on an e-mail. (Refer bottom of 'submit reply' where it says "Attach Files.")


    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  16. #16
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    Icon14 Thanks for the excellent analysis, and wit

    Quote Originally Posted by J4RS
    Sorry Mr. Tappet,
    Come on, do you really think this is funny?

    Quote Originally Posted by J4RS
    So if your (sic) operating in a country with out (sic) a dealer network with a product that has not been there for 13 Years you must be like those poor guy's (sic) in Cuba...
    Brilliant conclusion, Sherlock


    Quote Originally Posted by J4RS
    Making panels from oil drums and bake (sic) bean tin's (sic)... 10 cent wire for god (sic) sake !!!!
    Such an imagination...I am impressed

    Quote Originally Posted by J4RS
    Listen.... Option 1. Take to dealer get them to check it out and quote you... Freeeee ! The guy live's (sic) in OZ... not Calgary.. so why bother????
    Because some people actually don't mind getting to know how their car works and how to diagnose it. It's easy, it's nearly free, why even bother driving to a dealer for an initial diagnostic test? Have you never heard of DIY, or are you just a rude mechanic with a vested interest?

    Quote Originally Posted by J4RS
    Option 2. Vietnamese telephone exchange field manual...
    You really should have been a comedian

    Quote Originally Posted by J4RS
    Sorry man, but stop it....
    .

    For you? Forget it!

    Quote Originally Posted by J4RS
    Great advise (sic), very clever. But I see 5 to 8 Mi-16's a month amoung (sic)the 30+ pug's (sic)a day.. how many do you???
    Exactly what does this incoherent polemic have to do with the thread here anyway? Hello?

    If the guy with the problem or someone else wants me to post the MOTRINIC diagnostic information on this thread, I will. Otherwise anyone can email me for it.

    I'd recommend the latter, because the thread has become useless and the moderation here seems a little on the lax side at the moment.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by M. Tippett
    Come on, do you really think this is funny?



    Brilliant conclusion, Sherlock




    Such an imagination...I am impressed



    Because some people actually don't mind getting to know how their car works and how to diagnose it. It's easy, it's nearly free, why even bother driving to a dealer for an initial diagnostic test? Have you never heard of DIY, or are you just a rude mechanic with a vested interest?



    You really should have been a comedian

    .

    For you? Forget it!



    Exactly what does this incoherent polemic have to do with the thread here anyway? Hello?

    If the guy with the problem or someone else wants me to post the MOTRINIC diagnostic information on this thread, I will. Otherwise anyone can email me for it.

    I'd recommend the latter, because the thread has become useless and the moderation here seems a little on the lax side at the moment.


    I'll go and find some wire and build a harp with it....

    My Bad. I've got stop drinking...

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    j4rs
    i think what mike is trying to get across is very interesting
    i for one don't have a dealer around here that i would take my car to so, something like this would or could be a very handy thing to know
    i for one would like to see a backing off in your approach towards people who are genuine here and like to share what they have learnt instead of coming in here all guns blazing thinking their excrement doesn't have an odour
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    Quote Originally Posted by pugrambo
    j4rs
    i think what mike is trying to get across is very interesting
    i for one don't have a dealer around here that i would take my car to so, something like this would or could be a very handy thing to know
    i for one would like to see a backing off in your approach towards people who are genuine here and like to share what they have learnt instead of coming in here all guns blazing thinking their excrement doesn't have an odour
    For that I am Sorry to all..


    UNderstand this though... I get TEN phone calls a day from people stuck with problems, they don't even know where the dipstick is half the time.. But I know everybody I not a tech or engineer.. they may be much more than that....such as a doctor.. This in mind, I offer advise... most people in life want the simple way out of a problem.. and I'm sure they don't want crash course in auto electronic's.. This is how I would go about it (as non smelly as I am ) Confirm there is a real sensor fault or off parameter, by way of reset and road test, more than one fault could be present in the ECU and one could be false by way of the other..or in some case's non at all. EG, engine speed sensor fault triggers engine light, light stay's on, car come's in with complaint.. check everything on car can't fault any sensor operation.. Speak to client, only to find out the car has ran out of fuel recently...Bosch system's can log this fault when such a thing occurs.. How many people would have installed a new speed sensor??? reset and test would have prevented this... Tools such as diag can read and confirm parameters which is where most faults are found or dismissed.. Just reading code straight off the car in MY experience on this model a bit fishy.....(mechanical can cause codes too, crap fuel = knockdetection = engine warning light = retard strat = knock code, change knock sensor...? nope!!!)

    So if you happen to be willing and have a garage less messy than mine, by all mean's have a go! but don't always make life hard...

    Note.. sharing Knowledge is not all about "how to repair methods" it CAN be where and who too...
    ....and yes I am NOT selling...!!!!!!!

    Ps Please don't take life too seriously....



    Once again sorry to all for my conduct...

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    Quote Originally Posted by J4RS
    For that I am Sorry to all..


    UNderstand this though... I get TEN phone calls a day from people stuck with problems, they don't even know where the dipstick is half the time.. But I know everybody I not a tech or engineer.. they may be much more than that....such as a doctor.. This in mind, I offer advise... most people in life want the simple way out of a problem.. and I'm sure they don't want crash course in auto electronic's.. This is how I would go about it (as non smelly as I am ) Confirm there is a real sensor fault or off parameter, by way of reset and road test, more than one fault could be present in the ECU and one could be false by way of the other..or in some case's non at all. EG, engine speed sensor fault triggers engine light, light stay's on, car come's in with complaint.. check everything on car can't fault any sensor operation.. Speak to client, only to find out the car has ran out of fuel recently...Bosch system's can log this fault when such a thing occurs.. How many people would have installed a new speed sensor??? reset and test would have prevented this... Tools such as diag can read and confirm parameters which is where most faults are found or dismissed.. Just reading code straight off the car in MY experience on this model a bit fishy.....(mechanical can cause codes too, crap fuel = knockdetection = engine warning light = retard strat = knock code, change knock sensor...? nope!!!)

    So if you happen to be willing and have a garage less messy than mine, by all mean's have a go! but don't always make life hard...

    Note.. sharing Knowledge is not all about "how to repair methods" it CAN be where and who too...
    ....and yes I am NOT selling...!!!!!!!

    Ps Please don't take life too seriously....



    Once again sorry to all for my conduct...

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