Wanted - Exhaust Manifold for 505 GR
  • Register
  • Help
Page 1 of 2 12 Last
Results 1 to 25 of 31
  1. #1
    con
    con is offline
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    sydney, nsw, australia
    Posts
    506

    Wanted - Exhaust Manifold for 505 GR

    I'm still looking for a "big bore" exhaust manifold & engine pipe from a Peugeot 505 GR.
    I believe these were fitted to GRs about 1980/1 (2L carby) models.

    Advertisement


    thanks

    con.... 0428 406 505

  2. #2
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Camden NSW & Selwyn NZ
    Posts
    2,334
    Con,

    The first year or so of 505's that were assembled in Australia (i.e. by Renault Australia) were simply badge 505. The "GR" may not have been added to the name until Leyland took over the assembly (81-82?). I've heard that the 505 SR was imported when Leyland had trouble with assembly.

    So any of the 505's badged as a plain "505" should have the big bore manifold. I'm not sure about the "GR" though.

    Dave
    NZ Fleet
    1976 504 Ti
    1984 205 GT twin carb
    1991 205 SI 1.6GTI motor
    1994 106 Xsi
    1996 Mondeo V6
    Aus Fleet
    1955 203C
    1997 Civic Cxi (great allrounder- revy, flexible, nimble, comfortable , economical, simple and durable )

  3. #3
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Burpengary and Murrumburrah, Qld and NSW
    Posts
    9,223
    Perhaps the recessed grille is a giveaway too?

  4. #4
    nJm
    nJm is offline
    Guru nJm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    2,930
    I'm in the market for a 505 GR, and would be interested to find out the differences between the 1980 505, and 1981-83 505 GR.

    what exterior differences or mechanical? Is one better than the other?

    ta.
    Nick
    1983 Peugeot 505 GR


    "All of its cars from the 1.1 litre 205 through the ugly duckling 309 to the 2.2 litre 505 GTi had a rightness and a righteousness about them that turned every humdrum drive into a journey. Someone, I once wrote, in the bowels of Peugeot understands handling and how a chassis should feel." - Jeremy Clarkson

  5. #5
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Burpengary and Murrumburrah, Qld and NSW
    Posts
    9,223
    The one without rust is the best... call me on 0411 280 267 and you might own it!

  6. #6
    nJm
    nJm is offline
    Guru nJm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    2,930
    do you sell 505s in Vic?

    that would be cool.
    Nick
    1983 Peugeot 505 GR


    "All of its cars from the 1.1 litre 205 through the ugly duckling 309 to the 2.2 litre 505 GTi had a rightness and a righteousness about them that turned every humdrum drive into a journey. Someone, I once wrote, in the bowels of Peugeot understands handling and how a chassis should feel." - Jeremy Clarkson

  7. #7
    VIP Sponsor
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Posts
    9,211
    NJM,
    As Dave said the early 505s were badged 505 only, were made by Renault Australia,were fitted with the big bore manifold and did not have the Pulse Air valves fitted to the exhaust. They seemed to go a fair bit better than the GR which was made by JRA. The JRA cars had better finish, I believe the Australian cars were recognised as the best made Peugeots in the world at that time! The same grill carried through until 1983. The 1983 GR model (quite rare)had the late grill, a BA7/5 transmission and late model non rebuildable ball joints on the struts. They also had different wheels with long chrome wheel nuts and a small hub cap in the centre.

    Regards, Graham Wallis

  8. #8
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Camden NSW & Selwyn NZ
    Posts
    2,334
    Graham,

    Is that the small black hub cap with the lion in the centre?

    I've set those early 404 valves aside for you. There's one inlet valve missing and one or two of the others may have lost a bit too much of the chroming on the stem. The exhaust valves seem pretty good though, with plenty of margin left.
    If I go to the easter pagent I'll bring them along.

    Regards,
    Dave
    NZ Fleet
    1976 504 Ti
    1984 205 GT twin carb
    1991 205 SI 1.6GTI motor
    1994 106 Xsi
    1996 Mondeo V6
    Aus Fleet
    1955 203C
    1997 Civic Cxi (great allrounder- revy, flexible, nimble, comfortable , economical, simple and durable )

  9. #9
    nJm
    nJm is offline
    Guru nJm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    2,930
    [quote]Originally posted by GRAHAM WALLIS:
    <strong>NJM,
    As Dave said the early 505s were badged 505 only, were made by Renault Australia,were fitted with the big bore manifold and did not have the Pulse Air valves fitted to the exhaust. They seemed to go a fair bit better than the GR which was made by JRA. The JRA cars had better finish, </strong><hr></blockquote>

    So, what would be a better buy? When you say the Renault made ones went better I assume you mean performance? Out of the two which has the stronger mechanicals? Are the JRA cars more reliable (better made?)


    thanks for the info.

    I've found a 1983 505 GR 5spd manual that been owned by the one owner since new (and kept in a garage) for $1800 so i'll go and have a look this weekend...
    Nick
    1983 Peugeot 505 GR


    "All of its cars from the 1.1 litre 205 through the ugly duckling 309 to the 2.2 litre 505 GTi had a rightness and a righteousness about them that turned every humdrum drive into a journey. Someone, I once wrote, in the bowels of Peugeot understands handling and how a chassis should feel." - Jeremy Clarkson

  10. #10
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Camden NSW & Selwyn NZ
    Posts
    2,334
    njm,

    The reliability of all the cars would be similar, except that the ones with the pulse air valves have leaner carburetor jets which would make them more prone to pinging and piston failure (a problem which some people have experienced on that model).

    Many of the Renault made 505s are now rusted out completely. For some reason they seem to rust ALOT worse than 504s made in the same factory in the same year (bizarre!!!).

    Up until about 1982 or so 505s used the BA10 5 speed gearbox, which is stronger but has dodgy synchromesh (although Mobil 1 and Nulon makes a big difference). These gearboxes have lower ratios which make a big improvement to the acceleration in the first 3 gears (compared with the BA7 gearbox).

    From about 1983 they used a BA7 5 speed gearbox which isn't as strong, but has better synchromesh. They are a good gearbox if the oil is changed and checked regularly, but as I alluded to before they don't give the same acceleration off the mark as the BA10.

    A one owner 505 that has been always kept in a garage is usually a good car (I stress usually).
    $1800 sounds like a good price for such a car.

    Dave
    NZ Fleet
    1976 504 Ti
    1984 205 GT twin carb
    1991 205 SI 1.6GTI motor
    1994 106 Xsi
    1996 Mondeo V6
    Aus Fleet
    1955 203C
    1997 Civic Cxi (great allrounder- revy, flexible, nimble, comfortable , economical, simple and durable )

  11. #11
    nJm
    nJm is offline
    Guru nJm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    2,930
    thanks for your help David - you have been very usefull.

    So really, I should try to get an 81 or 82 GR over a 83GR (which has the BA7 5 gearbox).

    if this car has been looked after well, and does have the newer gearbox should I expect any problems anytime soon?

    thanks
    Nick
    1983 Peugeot 505 GR


    "All of its cars from the 1.1 litre 205 through the ugly duckling 309 to the 2.2 litre 505 GTi had a rightness and a righteousness about them that turned every humdrum drive into a journey. Someone, I once wrote, in the bowels of Peugeot understands handling and how a chassis should feel." - Jeremy Clarkson

  12. #12
    VIP Sponsor
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Posts
    9,211
    Dave,
    Yes, they are the hubcaps. Don't worry about the valves, it was the inlets I was after.
    I haven't noticed a lot of rust in any 505s, perfectly sound cars are going to Pick a Part due to the high cost of labour for repairs.
    Mind you, there were 3 VN Commodores there today.
    I would go for the 83 model, the BA7 seems to be a lot more reliable than the BA10 and much nicer to use.
    Regards, Graham Wallis

  13. #13
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Camden NSW & Selwyn NZ
    Posts
    2,334
    njm,

    If the gearbox is quiet then it's most likely to be in good condition. If you change the oil every time you change the engine oil, the gearbox should remain in good condition. Also don't try to force the the gearshift into gear on the odd occasion that it doesn't want to go in. Let the clutch out and push it back in and try again. Don't ram it through the gears either, just be gentle. Forcing the gearshift can cause pieces of the selector rings on the synchoniser to break off and fall between the gears resulting in catastrophic destruction of the gearbox.

    If well looked after the gearbox should give you no troubles.

    If the gearbox does start to make noises, get it checked out quickly, and don't drive in 5th gear in the meantime. If you get to the problem quickly they are cheap to fix. Unlike the BA7 4 speed boxes, the 5 speed doesn't last very long if you keep on driving it once it starts to get noisy.

    Many people prefer the BA7 5 speed over the BA10 5 speed, mainly because the synchromesh works better, but if you put synthetic oil and nulon in the BA10 the synchromesh is fine.

    Another thing worth pointing out is all the gearshifts fitted to series 1 505s have a very floppy feel with very long throws. This is very easy to modify to make the gearshift much tighter with short throws. Basically get a late model 504 4 speed gearshifter, then have an extra ball thingy welded onto the gear lever thingy on the side of the gearbox at about 2/3rds the length of the standard one. This will make the gearshift much much nicer.

    Dave
    NZ Fleet
    1976 504 Ti
    1984 205 GT twin carb
    1991 205 SI 1.6GTI motor
    1994 106 Xsi
    1996 Mondeo V6
    Aus Fleet
    1955 203C
    1997 Civic Cxi (great allrounder- revy, flexible, nimble, comfortable , economical, simple and durable )

  14. #14
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Camden NSW & Selwyn NZ
    Posts
    2,334
    [quote]Originally posted by GRAHAM WALLIS:
    <strong>Dave,
    Yes, they are the hubcaps. Don't worry about the valves, it was the inlets I was after.
    I haven't noticed a lot of rust in any 505s, perfectly sound cars are going to Pick a Part due to the high cost of labour for repairs.
    Mind you, there were 3 VN Commodores there today.
    I would go for the 83 model, the BA7 seems to be a lot more reliable than the BA10 and much nicer to use.
    Regards, Graham Wallis</strong><hr></blockquote>

    Graham,

    There's alot of rusty early 505s in Sydney. Much more so than late 504s.

    Regarding the BA10 5 speed, the only problem that I've heard about is broken spring clips on the synchronisers, which is something which all 504 and 505 geaboxes suffer from when abused. I think the reason the BA10 ones go more often is purely due to the fact that the synchromesh doesn't work as well and thus people tend to force them alot harder, and also due to the fact that the standard gearshifter has way too much leverage so it is very easy to put too much force on the synchroniser. If the modifications I outlined in my last post are made, I don't think this problem would occur much at all.

    I'll bring along to the pagent a couple of the 404 inlet valves which seem OK.

    Regards,
    Dave
    NZ Fleet
    1976 504 Ti
    1984 205 GT twin carb
    1991 205 SI 1.6GTI motor
    1994 106 Xsi
    1996 Mondeo V6
    Aus Fleet
    1955 203C
    1997 Civic Cxi (great allrounder- revy, flexible, nimble, comfortable , economical, simple and durable )

  15. #15
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Camden NSW & Selwyn NZ
    Posts
    2,334
    njm,

    Basically my opinion is that either gearbox is OK if it has been looked after and you continue looking after it. They both have their good and bad points and you will encounter various people who will say that one is better than other, but when it comes down to it, if you find a good car for the right price, get it, no matter which of the two gearboxes it has.

    Regards,
    Dave
    NZ Fleet
    1976 504 Ti
    1984 205 GT twin carb
    1991 205 SI 1.6GTI motor
    1994 106 Xsi
    1996 Mondeo V6
    Aus Fleet
    1955 203C
    1997 Civic Cxi (great allrounder- revy, flexible, nimble, comfortable , economical, simple and durable )

  16. #16
    nJm
    nJm is offline
    Guru nJm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    2,930
    could you please explain that modification for the BA 7 gearbox? I don't fully understand what you mean.
    Nick
    1983 Peugeot 505 GR


    "All of its cars from the 1.1 litre 205 through the ugly duckling 309 to the 2.2 litre 505 GTi had a rightness and a righteousness about them that turned every humdrum drive into a journey. Someone, I once wrote, in the bowels of Peugeot understands handling and how a chassis should feel." - Jeremy Clarkson

  17. #17
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Camden NSW & Selwyn NZ
    Posts
    2,334
    njm,

    Actually the modification applies to both the BA7 5 speed and the BA10 5 speed.

    Basically the gear lever has a rod that connects from underneath it forward to another lever on the side of the gearbox. When you move the lever back and forward the lever on the side of the gearbox moves back and forward. The rod is attached to the 2 levers with ball and socket joints. The sockets are on the rod and the balls are on the levers. If you weld another ball on the gearbox lever about 1/2 to 2/3rds of the way along it, then attach the rod to that ball, this will shorten the throws, making the gearshift more "normal" in feel. Usually 505 gearshifts have a really long horrible feel and when you select first gear the gearstick moves so far forward that your knuckles almost hit the radio. It's ridiculous and it also places too much force on the synchronisers. If you perform the modification, the gearshift will be slightly heavier in feel but it will feel more positive and you won't have to reach so far.

    In order to find another ball to weld on the gearbox, find the raer part of an old 504 4 speed box (an early one, pre-1975?). Cut the ball off it including a small part of the lever it's attached to. Then weld that part of the lever to the lever on the side of the 5 speed.

    It's probably not too clear in words, but I plan to have the modification in picture form on my website (hopefully within a few weeks). I've already prepared some of the pictures, I just have to do the text and arrows, etc.

    Dave
    NZ Fleet
    1976 504 Ti
    1984 205 GT twin carb
    1991 205 SI 1.6GTI motor
    1994 106 Xsi
    1996 Mondeo V6
    Aus Fleet
    1955 203C
    1997 Civic Cxi (great allrounder- revy, flexible, nimble, comfortable , economical, simple and durable )

  18. #18
    nJm
    nJm is offline
    Guru nJm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    2,930
    thanks dave, i'll see what I can do (when I get the car)

    Nick
    1983 Peugeot 505 GR


    "All of its cars from the 1.1 litre 205 through the ugly duckling 309 to the 2.2 litre 505 GTi had a rightness and a righteousness about them that turned every humdrum drive into a journey. Someone, I once wrote, in the bowels of Peugeot understands handling and how a chassis should feel." - Jeremy Clarkson

  19. #19
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Burpengary and Murrumburrah, Qld and NSW
    Posts
    9,223
    I am flabbergasted at the idea of changing the gearbox oil as frequently as the engine oil...

    If you use 75-90 gear oil, which is the same viscosity as 15W-40 engine oil, you will certainly not need to change it very frequently at all.

    I had a discussion with a Pug owner who happens to do a lot with industrial lubricants the other day... he assures me of this, and also of the fact that 75-90 gear oils were not available when the BA7/5s were being sold here.

    The gear oil will definitely lubricate the box better under all conditions than will engine oil.

    [ 16 February 2002: Message edited by: Ray Bell ]</p>

  20. #20
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Parkes - N.S.W - Australia - Earth
    Posts
    12,256
    with all the 10/5's i have run over the years and 7/4's i have run GTX engine oil in them and changed the oil every 30-40k
    i found that running anything heaveir would make gear changes very heavy and hard when the box was cold
    the only trouble i ever had with any of them was a synchro spring break in a 10/5 wich luckily didn't do as much damage as i thought it would have done when i pulled the box down
    you need a low viscousity index oil for low temp running and as they are a pretty light running ox they don't really need anything too high for normal running
    i have even heard of some jap boxes running auto trans fluid in them as dictated by the manufacturers
    also with the original topic of the thread i'd run extractors on the car instead of the large bore manifold as it will probably be easier to find a set of them
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x '98 306 GTi6

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0


    WTD long range fuel tank for 605

  21. #21
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Camden NSW & Selwyn NZ
    Posts
    2,334
    Ray,

    I don't change my gear oil very often, but I do top it up every 30,oookm or so. I suggested changing the BA7 5 speed oil often, purely because you mentioned once that the failures were due to not changing the oil enough. I've also notice that failures occur due to gearboxes running out of oil, so if you check them often this is less likely to occur.

    I've been using a 50/50 mixture of 80w90 gear oil and Mobil 1 in my BA10 5 speed and it seems to work well.

    Dave
    NZ Fleet
    1976 504 Ti
    1984 205 GT twin carb
    1991 205 SI 1.6GTI motor
    1994 106 Xsi
    1996 Mondeo V6
    Aus Fleet
    1955 203C
    1997 Civic Cxi (great allrounder- revy, flexible, nimble, comfortable , economical, simple and durable )

  22. #22
    con
    con is offline
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    sydney, nsw, australia
    Posts
    506
    sorry to break up the gearbox party.....

    thanks everyone for the enlightening discourse on the gearboxes; and particularly to Pugrambo for the tip about the extractors. however, sadly it's too late! i've bought a big bore manifold but without the engine pipe: so i'm still looking for a compatible engine pipe.

    (really, i don't mind if you continue about gearboxes; i do find it very interesting).

    con....

  23. #23
    VIP Sponsor
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Posts
    9,211
    Con,
    The engine pipe is available as a spare part from a dealer. Try European Auto Imports if you don't have any luck, 03 9899 6683

    Graham

  24. #24
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Burpengary and Murrumburrah, Qld and NSW
    Posts
    9,223
    How did you come to get it without the pipe?

    What I mean is, where is the car it came from, surely the pipe is there for you?

    pugrambo, the whole point was that engine oil is not lubricating gears the way engine oil does... and note the viscosity similarity.

    Additionally, anyone specifying auto trans fluid would be a bit silly. I know it's specified for the Borg Warner 5-speed in Sigmas, and they are renowned for noises and failures!

  25. #25
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Camden NSW & Selwyn NZ
    Posts
    2,334
    [quote]Originally posted by Ray Bell:
    <strong>
    Additionally, anyone specifying auto trans fluid would be a bit silly. I know it's specified for the Borg Warner 5-speed in Sigmas, and they are renowned for noises and failures!</strong><hr></blockquote>

    Ray,

    ATF is also recommended for the Borg Warner T5 as fitted to Mustangs, Falcons, Sierras, etc. Many people have used it in the BA10 5 speed with success.

    Dave
    NZ Fleet
    1976 504 Ti
    1984 205 GT twin carb
    1991 205 SI 1.6GTI motor
    1994 106 Xsi
    1996 Mondeo V6
    Aus Fleet
    1955 203C
    1997 Civic Cxi (great allrounder- revy, flexible, nimble, comfortable , economical, simple and durable )

Page 1 of 2 12 Last

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •