Rally Australia: Go Andy!
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  1. #1
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    Default Rally Australia: Go Andy!

    AFer Andy Crane (rally) is representing well, consistently clocking top ten times in Coffs Coast classic rally with his 504 V6, the only french historic in the mix.

    http://www.rallyresults.com.au/arc/2...5&paramVal2=14

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    It appears that the historic cars are running fewer stages than the WRC/PWRC and 60-70 ss km per day, but the conditions seem difficult with traction and visibility being the major challenges. I watched some of the WRC cars and there is certainly mayhem if you push hard. Loeb and Ogier are out of contention, they crashed in day 1 and returned on super rally, so top ten is the best they hope for. Hirvonen, Latvala and Solberg are leading but they still had their moments (spins and offs) they were lucky that trees were not in their trajectories. The top three historics are impressive, they are tracking top 20 in the WRC/PWRC stage times, not an easy feat for 40 year old RWD cars. Hoy's Datsun is a real surprise, if it is a 1600 as per the FIA homologation for the 510. I am puzzled by the average speeds, they calculate to around 90 km/h, extremely high for gravel, even without the wet/slippery conditions. Have the stages been shortened because of the rain?
    Last edited by Thanos; 10th September 2011 at 05:19 PM.

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    Hi Thanos, Andy's still doing well as at tonight. He had a minor problem with the steering rack binding yesterday but was to fit a replacement this morning.

    The weather was much better today. I got soaked marshalling at a refuel yesterday!

    We were doing a road closure today and got a few good pics of Andy and Dave (and many of the other cars). The V6 sounds sweet! Hope it continues to go well. We're scheduled to catch up for dinner tomorrow night.

    Both Cits were back running today but out of contention of course so it is likley to be a Ford victory Latvila is ahead).

    Cheers

    Jim

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    Quote Originally Posted by pug303 View Post
    ..The weather was much better today. I got soaked marshalling at a refuel yesterday!
    Hi Jim

    I was watching the event on Motors TV yesterday and I was hoping there was some shellter for the marshalls. I remembered you were going to be helping with the event, I hope that the spectacle compensated you for the soaking you got! Are the average speeds that high (90+ km/h) or did the stages get shortened?

    Cheers

    Thanos

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanos View Post
    Hi Jim

    I was watching the event on Motors TV yesterday and I was hoping there was some shellter for the marshalls. I remembered you were going to be helping with the event, I hope that the spectacle compensated you for the soaking you got! Are the average speeds that high (90+ km/h) or did the stages get shortened?

    Cheers

    Thanos
    I haven't heard of them shortening them, although the one Loeb rolled on was downgraded.

    Regarding the average speeds the 'classic' style competitors are averaging around 80km/h in our rallies down here. By the look of it the roads around Coffs are similar in surface and complexity to ours - not to mention the weather. 90 km/h would certainly be doable, but it would be quite a ride.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mlb View Post
    ...90 km/h would certainly be doable....
    I want to hear that from somebody who does not routinely end up with four wheels pointing at the sky...I think you are just trying to intimidate me!

    All kidding aside, here are some average speeds I calculated:

    ULONG: Latvala 113 km/h, 1st historic 94 km/h, 10th historic 83 km/h
    Shipmans: Loeb 114 km/h, 1st historic 94 km/h, 10th historic 82 km/h
    Welshes: Latvala 105 km/h, 1st historic 91 km/h, 10th historic 85 km/h

    These are amazing average speeds for stages with low traction, especially considering that in these conditions the pace notes are not gospell so you add uncertainty to the equation on top of rain and mud...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanos View Post
    I want to hear that from somebody who does not routinely end up with four wheels pointing at the sky...I think you are just trying to intimidate me!
    Oh come on. We haven't gone wrong way up for over 12 months. We have however broken a gearbox, lost a wheel, and punched a hole in the block - but haven't rolled. Mind you I've got a rally this coming weekend, then also the weekend after, so things might change.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thanos View Post
    All kidding aside, here are some average speeds I calculated:

    ULONG: Latvala 113 km/h, 1st historic 94 km/h, 10th historic 83 km/h
    Shipmans: Loeb 114 km/h, 1st historic 94 km/h, 10th historic 82 km/h
    Welshes: Latvala 105 km/h, 1st historic 91 km/h, 10th historic 85 km/h

    These are amazing average speeds for stages with low traction, especially considering that in these conditions the pace notes are not gospell so you add uncertainty to the equation on top of rain and mud...
    They look pretty good. I pulled out some results from a rally here from last year - the last one we rolled in - which was run under similar conditions and the fastest cars of the classic style were just over 80km/h - the event winner (Subaru STi) was pushing 100km/h. Also our rallies here are blind, so the use of pace notes would further reduce stage times.

    Doesn't take away from the fact that they are truly hammering. I wish I had taken up to the offer to compete.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanos View Post
    AFer Andy Crane (rally) is representing well, consistently clocking top ten times in Coffs Coast classic rally with his 504 V6, the only french historic in the mix.

    http://www.rallyresults.com.au/arc/2...5&paramVal2=14

    It appears that the historic cars are running fewer stages than the WRC/PWRC and 60-70 ss km per day, but the conditions seem difficult with traction and visibility being the major challenges. I watched some of the WRC cars and there is certainly mayhem if you push hard. Loeb and Ogier are out of contention, they crashed in day 1 and returned on super rally, so top ten is the best they hope for. Hirvonen, Latvala and Solberg are leading but they still had their moments (spins and offs) they were lucky that trees were not in their trajectories. The top three historics are impressive, they are tracking top 20 in the WRC/PWRC stage times, not an easy feat for 40 year old RWD cars. Hoy's Datsun is a real surprise, if it is a 1600 as per the FIA homologation for the 510. I am puzzled by the average speeds, they calculate to around 90 km/h, extremely high for gravel, even without the wet/slippery conditions. Have the stages been shortened because of the rain?
    Hoy's Datsun will be anything up to 2.4 liters.
    Classic rules are very free in Australia but not as free as NZ, we at least have to have engines from the same manufacturer!
    Stages are very fast 90 km/h average is correct.
    Graham

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    Quote Originally Posted by mlb View Post
    our rallies here are blind, so the use of pace notes would further reduce stage times...

    Really? No cautions, nothing? You guys are very brave. Is recce allowed or do you go prima vista?



    Quote Originally Posted by mlb View Post
    I wish I had taken up to the offer to compete.
    Oh, you fool!!! I would have jumped on the plane, next time they should ask me, me me,... somebody ask me!

    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS View Post
    Hoy's Datsun will be anything up to 2.4 liters.
    That explains it! There are two very good 1.6 liter 510 SSS in Athens driven by two of the best drivers in Greece and they cannot match the Escorts. One of them is very happy with the rally gearbox you found for him, it transformed the car.

    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS View Post
    Stages are very fast 90 km/h average is correct...
    I guess they are! I watched some more today, the on-board from H. Solberg's showed a lot of time spent on sixth gear. Different viewing today with the better weather, all they showed yesterday was fog spins and offs. Long straights over crests too, I guess you got to cowboy up and stay flat on the floor for those! I am very surprised by the low rate of attrition in the historics, over here as much as a third of the crews abandons due to exits.
    Last edited by Thanos; 11th September 2011 at 06:38 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanos View Post
    Really? No cautions, nothing? You guys are very brave. Is recce allowed or do you go prima vista?





    Oh, you fool!!! I would have jumped on the plane, next time they should ask me, me me,... somebody ask me!



    That explains it! There are two very good 1.6 liter 510 SSS in Athens driven by two of the best drivers in Greece and they cannot match the Escorts. One of them is very happy with the rally gearbox you found for him, it transformed the car.



    I guess they are! I watched some more today, the on-board from H. Solberg's showed a lot of time spent on sixth gear. Different viewing today with the better weather, all they showed yesterday was fog spins and offs. Long straights over crests too, I guess you got to cowboy up and stay flat on the floor for those! I am very surprised by the low rate of attrition in the historics, over here as much as a third of the crews abandons due to exits.
    The events do have cautions both in the road book and signs on the road.
    Apart from The Australian Championship events we only have 1 pace noted event in Victoria.
    The South Australia Championship is pace noted.
    Datsuns have alway been more popular than Escorts in Australia, the Fords rely heavily on homologated parts while Datsuns could be run using production components, in many cases from later model Datsuns, everything is interchangeable.
    The overall Datsun parts quality is much better than Ford too, so it is a lot more economical to compete in Datsuns.
    Low rate of attrition in this case would be due to the smooth roads used in the Coffs Harbour event and very short competitive distance, only one run over the stages.
    Graham

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    Sitting at a road closure on the Bucca stage.

    The WRC cars are amazing. The difference between the top 8 or 10 and even the best ARC cars is a mile. We're on a long straight where they would all be well in top and doing well over 200kph. My mate is having trouble getting pics without a blur.

    Andy went by a while ago and was impressive. Quite a few classics were backing off quite early but he held his nerve and relied on the pace notes. The V6 sounded great at full song, smooth and a relief from the popping and banging of so may of the turbo cars. Mind you the BDA Escorts don't sound bad either!

    Cheers

    Jim

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    Jim,
    I am not there, I wasn't asked like last time (must be something I said). Probably a good thing Luc's wedding 2 weeks ago and then 4 new tyres on the 407, not to mention the belt and tensioner and a couple of valves in the injection system, put paid to the fun budget this month. Are you coming the 4 hours North for visit after or are you going to swan about with Lew and Helen with the piddly little 30 minute drive South?
    FLASH

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanos View Post
    Really? No cautions, nothing? You guys are very brave. Is recce allowed or do you go prima vista?
    We run off the road book and tulips which has Cares, Cautions etc as well as significant corners and features (logs, holes, etc) The rest is just drive it as you see it. No recce is allowed and can potentially lead to disqualification. There is a big move here to run some pace noted events, but there is also quite a bit of opposition to it from the old guard. Although I do like saying 1.5km to the next call and sit back and enjoy the view.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thanos View Post
    Oh, you fool!!! I would have jumped on the plane, next time they should ask me, me me,... somebody ask me!
    Yeah I know. Unfortunately work got in the way and I couldn't dodge it. As it has with a couple of other ARC rounds this year, and Targa High Country. Might look at Rally Victoria though.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pug303 View Post
    Sitting at a road closure on the Bucca stage.

    The WRC cars are amazing. The difference between the top 8 or 10 and even the best ARC cars is a mile. We're on a long straight where they would all be well in top and doing well over 200kph. My mate is having trouble getting pics without a blur.

    Andy went by a while ago and was impressive. Quite a few classics were backing off quite early but he held his nerve and relied on the pace notes. The V6 sounded great at full song, smooth and a relief from the popping and banging of so may of the turbo cars. Mind you the BDA Escorts don't sound bad either!

    Cheers

    Jim
    Hi Flash, I snuck off to play with Lew on my own so Kym is expecting me to go south again. Lew and I have talked about dropping in up there sometime. Last time I was here I ran into you sister at the Watefront Cafe.

    Have enjoyed the return to rally "spectating" by being an official.

    Andy is still going fine, or was when we left our position.

    Catch you.

    Cheers

    Jim

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    Just a quick update Andy and Dave finished the classics
    in 6th. Good job to them!

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    A great result, we now need some photos!!! Video would be great too, so we can hear the new V6.

    Nearly half the cars, including the front running 911, did not cross the finish line, reminding us again that to finish first you must first finish. Such an awsome sport, rallying, always trying to find the balance between aggression and prudence. Hirvonen's wrap-up comment sums it up: "..you never knew what grip you were going to get at each corner, luckily we didn't get killed and...". Solberg agreed, saying "yeah, it was great fun!". I guess that's true, not getting killed is great fun... Nobody beats the Scandinavians in slippery conditions, especially if the speeds are high. Watch the heli view of Hirvonen to get a taste of the speeds and control (I made my son watch it four times, the last two with me commentating. He was happy to get away after the fourth time):

    http://www.wrc.com/video/highlights/...ss13/?vid=2303

    Amazing driving, less experienced drivers tend to use the entire road even when not needed, this adds to the distance traveled. Hirvonen is right on the edge of control on the shortest line possible.
    Last edited by Thanos; 11th September 2011 at 11:02 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanos View Post
    A great result, we now need some photos!!! Video would be great too, so we can hear the new V6.

    Nearly half the cars, including the front running 911, did not cross the finish line, reminding us again that to finish first you must first finish. Such an awsome sport, rallying, always trying to find the balance between aggression and prudence. Hirvonen's wrap-up comment sums it up: "..you never knew what grip you were going to get at each corner, luckily we didn't get killed and...". Solberg agreed, saying "yeah, it was great fun!". I guess that's true, not getting killed is great fun... Nobody beats the Scandinavians in slippery conditions, especially if the speeds are high. Watch the heli view of Hirvonen to get a taste of the speeds and control (I made my son watch it four times, the last two with me commentating. He was happy to get away after the fourth time):

    http://www.wrc.com/video/highlights/...ss13/?vid=2303

    Amazing driving, less experienced drivers tend to use the entire road even when not needed, this adds to the distance traveled. Hirvonen is right on the edge of control on the shortest line possible.
    I loved that interview with Hirvonen at the end of one of the final stages where all he could say was just how bloody fast and scary the stage was
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanos View Post
    A great result, we now need some photos!!! Video would be great too, so we can hear the new V6.

    Nearly half the cars, including the front running 911, did not cross the finish line, reminding us again that to finish first you must first finish. Such an awsome sport, rallying, always trying to find the balance between aggression and prudence. Hirvonen's wrap-up comment sums it up: "..you never knew what grip you were going to get at each corner, luckily we didn't get killed and...". Solberg agreed, saying "yeah, it was great fun!". I guess that's true, not getting killed is great fun... Nobody beats the Scandinavians in slippery conditions, especially if the speeds are high. Watch the heli view of Hirvonen to get a taste of the speeds and control (I made my son watch it four times, the last two with me commentating. He was happy to get away after the fourth time):

    http://www.wrc.com/video/highlights/...ss13/?vid=2303

    Amazing driving, less experienced drivers tend to use the entire road even when not needed, this adds to the distance traveled. Hirvonen is right on the edge of control on the shortest line possible.
    There will be a highlights program for the ARC event in a week or two, this should include classic footage, I can send you a DVD Thanos.
    Graham

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    Quote Originally Posted by mlb View Post
    I loved that interview with Hirvonen at the end of one of the final stages where all he could say was just how bloody fast and scary the stage was
    I liked the inteview with Hirvonen when John Smailes couldn't stop talking and Hirvonen's codriver was desperately trying to get them away!
    Graham

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    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS View Post
    I liked the inteview with Hirvonen when John Smailes couldn't stop talking and Hirvonen's codriver was desperately trying to get them away!
    Graham
    I had a good laugh at that. Moreso because I know how he feels as I've been there myself.
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    Icon4 my shots of the rally

    hi all,

    here are my photos of the 504 in the rally from yesterday.
    the shots where taken on the second run of the bucca stage 1.16kms into the stage it was up a large hill then over a blind crest to a right hander most drivers slowed down alot (about 300m after the 0 car crashed) it really showed what the guys were made of if they carried some speed.

    i got three shots of the 504 they are good but could have been better

    if you guys want more photos let me know and ill post them i got one of every car running that stage

    regards
    Ryan
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Rally Australia: Go Andy!-11092011212copy-large-.jpg   Rally Australia: Go Andy!-11092011213-large-.jpg   Rally Australia: Go Andy!-11092011214-1-large-.jpg  

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    I also made it to Coffs Harbour for the rally. The 504 was sounding great No video, but here's a few pics I took on Saturday on Graces Stage and Sunday on Plumb Pudding?.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Rally Australia: Go Andy!-img_7457-1-.jpg   Rally Australia: Go Andy!-img_7459-1-.jpg   Rally Australia: Go Andy!-img_7460-1-.jpg   Rally Australia: Go Andy!-img_7461-1-.jpg   Rally Australia: Go Andy!-img_7462-1-.jpg   Rally Australia: Go Andy!-img_8525-1-.jpg  

    Rally Australia: Go Andy!-img_8528-1-.jpg  
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