TA 4 speed

Gerry

Here is a TA cabriolet 1934 in South Africa with an orinigal 4 speed gearbox, not ID but TA gearbox, according to the owner they used it for racing, that true?

Was there alot of orinigal 4 speed boxes?

Cheers
Corne
 
There were a number of experimental factory four speeds made just before the war. One was involved in an accident while on test and the driver of the car was killed. To my knowledge none were ever sold to the public. ERSA made conversions primarily for the 1.5 litre formula one racing of the middle to late 1950s. They were also fitted to racing cars of lesser classes.
Of course they were also offered as an aftermarket option for your 11 TA. They were in several forms some with synchros on 3rd and 4th.
I had a drive of an 11BL 1951 fitted with such a box. The car belonged to a Sam Crisci. The change was a little awkward between first and second and if you wished to select reverse the you had to hold your thumb on a small lockout lever let into the gear lever about halfway to the dashboard. The lever then passed through 1st and into reverse.
There were other manufacturers that did four speed conversions for TA One being Duriez.
http://www.cats-citroen.net/home.html Enter this site and navigate to 'Traction Avant' .... "modify" ...." 4spd gearboxes" for more information.
Cheers Gerry:cheers:
 
Gerry

This one's gears were like this
24
R13

Just imagine "R" far left "1" beside, up "2" ,"3" beside "1" and "4" beside "2"

If I can remember correctly. The levers going to the greabox were the normal configuration but reverse went to the front of the gearbox with a lever, and a relay box directly behind the front crossmember fitted across the gearbox. to relay back to the gearlever. Sometimes reverse just slipped in other times you had to be a bit rough with it. 1 to second had no syncro 2-3 syncro and 3-4 syncro if I remember correctly.

Just another question, citroen wanted a "preselect gearbox" on the TA meaning an automatic gearbox?

Cheers
Corne
 
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Ah. The Sensaud de Lavaud contraption. An Abomination that was hurriedly replaced. Could be made to work on level ground but "Threw in the Towel" on anything resembling an incline. There are pictures of it. Thes are of types that were fitted toDe Lavauds own car. The addition of a final drive to the front wheels made the device appear somewhat different
 

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I read about it the gearbox also overheated quite easily. So it's safe to say it's an auto box of some sort?

Thanks for the info!!

Cheers
Corne
 
Here are some other gearboxes with four speeds offered as optional after market TA equipment.
One is the Duriez Lepicard gearbox and views of the selector and linkages with the reverse cable, and the other is the Reda Gearbox.
Cheers Gerry:cheers:
 

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Thanks for posting this link Harry, Very interesting and the detail is fantastic. Interesting to note that the pinion shaft is splined all the way to the roller race and that you have used the limited slip diff as in the Mk2 Bobtail box. The strengthening plate is very neat, better engineered than the one I fitted to a club members gearbox.
I am impressed by the standard of work that you do on all of the other transmissions that you have listed on your site. It must keep you very busy!
Do you do your own manufacturing of parts needed to restore these transmissions or do you buy them in as required?
Cheers Gerry:cheers:
 
I agree Gerry!!

It's amazing to see him testing a newly overhauled 5 speed hydraulic gearbox!! It runs sweet!! 3000 euros sounds alot but the work that goes into the gearbox and the quality of work is exceptional!!

He quoted me 500 euros on my 4 speed hydraulic box to do 2nd gear syncro, I'm tempted!!
 
Corne, I know how much work there is in TA boxes from experience in rebuilding quite a few for people. I think that Harrys price of 500 euro is very reasonable.
Cheers Gerry
 
That quote is for my Ds's hydraulic box, he also change all the bearings in the particular box too but it's custom bearings because you no longer get the orinigals, when I told my dad he has to custom fit the bearings he said it's cheap!

Just to save enough money.

I know from a bit of experience traction gearboxes are bastards, someone I know (now 60) told me his dad rebuilt a traction gearbox and it ended up with 3 reverse gears and 1 forward gears hehe, I heared it can happen easily. I think a full gearbox overhaul on the TA might be the same as the DS... he quoted me on a full rebuild (crown wheel and pinion too) 1900 euros. expensive but cheap once you see the work involved.

I'd love to get a gearbox from him!!

Cheers
Corne
 
Hi Gerry,

thank you very much for your compliments.

I manufacture some new parts myself, but other parts like, inputshafts, synchronizerrings and gears, are made by special manufactureres.

You can see at my website the pictures from my workshop. Small but nevertheless...............

http://ds-vitesse.com/en/owners/werkplaats.html


and Corne, let us not be mistaken. :)I quoted you the price for repair your worn 2nd gear for 500 Euro.
That price does not include new front flanged bearings.
You told me beside the worn synchro for 2nd gear, the gearbox runs fine with no noise.

Taking the gearbox apart, cleaning and inspection does take around 4 hours. So the quoted 500 euro is only for that work and new sychro for 2nd gear.

1900 Euro is quoted for the fully rebuild 4BVH gearbox.
For all rebuilds, one year warranty.


The 5 speed hydraulic gearbox is fully rebuild and comes with hydraulic valve, complete electrical wiring, special tubes and new shifting handle with push button.
There is a lot work gone into making that gearbox.

with kind regarDS,

Harry Martens
www.ds-vitesse.com
 

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That's a great website... I've never seen a CX gearbox dismantled to such an extent either. If someone gave me that dismantled gearbox in pieces, I doubt I'd ever get it back together and working :)

Harry, how do your rebuild the early CX 4spd gearboxes when they wear down the synchro running surfaces on the gears rapidly. To the point where new synchro rings do not work ?

seeya,
Shane L.
 
CorneSoutAfrica said:
That quote is for my Ds's hydraulic box, he also change all the bearings in the particular box too but it's custom bearings because you no longer get the orinigals, when I told my dad he has to custom fit the bearings he said it's cheap!

Just to save enough money.

I know from a bit of experience traction gearboxes are bastards, someone I know (now 60) told me his dad rebuilt a traction gearbox and it ended up with 3 reverse gears and 1 forward gears hehe, I heared it can happen easily. I think a full gearbox overhaul on the TA might be the same as the DS... he quoted me on a full rebuild (crown wheel and pinion too) 1900 euros. expensive but cheap once you see the work involved.

I'd love to get a gearbox from him!!

Cheers
Corne
Click to expand...
He must have fitted the diff on the wrong side. They do that for the cooper boxes by ERSA.
Cheers Gerry:cheers:
PS I had a friend who did that with an ID box.He mated it to a 2 litre Pinto OHC engine from a Cortina and this engine runs the revers way when installed in a traction. It was strange the the water pump at the back!

Shane I rebuilt my CX C-Matc box. They are not difficult. The parking pawl was broken and needed to be welded up and reshaped as per original. A TA box is much more of a challenge.
 
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Hello Shane,

synchronizerrings for the early CX and Cmatic till around 1980 are different. You can only see that by a marking on top of the ring.
I will show you a picture later today.
These older rings are very, very rare. I have a few new.
Never had a CMatic in the shop though.

Currently working on a CX 5 speed, wich will be mated onto an electrical motor. Just finished the adapter plate and now calculating for the postition and dept of the flywheel. Flywheel and clutch will used again. Proberly he doesnt need 1st and 2nd gear anymore and reverse either. Just change rotation of the motor.
I will add some picture later today here and on my Facebook.

cheers,

Harry Martens
www.ds-vitesse.com
 

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and Corne, let us not be mistaken. :)I quoted you the price for repair your worn 2nd gear for 500 Euro.

Still a great price:)

Will still like sto buy a gearbox from you some time in the near future. I do realise a gearbox really do make a difference

Cheers
 
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