Vic Club permit, Police crackdown ?
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  1. #1
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    Default Vic Club permit, Police crackdown ?

    I saw this today on the Historic Rally Association website, something to keep in mind

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    The Victorian police are on the warpath! They have been instructed to pull over all cars wearing Vic “Club Permit Scheme” plates (red plates), where practical and safe, to check log books. If your log book is not filled out you will be booked. (dated 6 June)

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    Default Only to be expected. taking things into consideration.

    Quote Originally Posted by petermelb View Post
    I saw this today on the Historic Rally Association website, something to keep in mind

    The Victorian police are on the warpath! They have been instructed to pull over all cars wearing Vic “Club Permit Scheme” plates (red plates), where practical and safe, to check log books. If your log book is not filled out you will be booked. (dated 6 June)
    Totally agree, comply fully or expect. be nice to see police actively and visibly enforcing all road laws and regulation. Was in Glen Iris today and observed a large black 4wd vehicle drive blithely through two sets of red light in short succession and plenty of traffic around too

    Anyway on the permits, this is the legislation the Federation pushed for and I am reasonably sure they would have asked for law enforcement attention, as that concern was mentioned that people might try to extend the 90 days by forgetting to fill in a log book. ....

    If you express enough concern it brings on obvious responses.

    Ken.

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    Good on 'em. It's a great system and it give me the irrates when it gets misused.

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    Default It happened to me...

    I have no problem with having my log book checked, provided the cops know what they're talking about.
    Got stopped the other day for just such a check and was told my Victorian log book wasn't filled out correctly. Constable old Mate reckoned that the `remarks' section should have included where I was off to. I explained that since I could roam as I liked as per the rules, I didn't actually know where I was off to for the rest of that day and I might decide to drive to the hills for lunch or go straight home. Free country, and all that.
    This confused the poor fellow and he finally admitted he didn't know what `remarks' meant. The point is, I still don't know myself. Anybody got the answer?
    Meantime, I did accidentally drive off one morning without the log book filled in (only got a few hundred metres, realised and pulled straight over to fill it in) but now I use a system to make sure I don't forget. When I park the car each time, the log book and pen) gets sat on the dashboard right in front of the speedo where I can't possibly miss it. Gives the engine a few seconds to warm up while I fill out the book, too.
    It's worth mentioning that if your log book isn't filled out and you have a prang, technically you're not registered at the time and all sorts of insurance and legal hassles could rain down on youse.
    And yeah, if you know of anbybody abusing the system, cuff them in the lug for all of us...this is too good a system to be ruined by a few brain-deads who want to rort it.

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    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    It'll be interesting to see if they ever manage to catch anyone (other than honest mistakes where the book has actually been forgotten).

    I still see it as being highly unlikely anyone would abuse the system..... and if htey did, they would abuse any system regardless of it's conditions.

    I always write "fun" or "driving" ... or similar in the the remarks section

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    Icon10 Your story makes me smile!! brings back memories.

    Got to smile at your reply davo, when the Federation originally raised the idea of tightening up the initial permit extension etc, and expressed worries that some car owners might rort the then quite liberal provisions in the legislation. I spoke to a number of our then specialised traffic police. The universal response was that they were all in favour of seeing "old cars" being restored and used on our roads and a surprising number of them were involved in motor sport and car restoration.

    It wasn't a problem as far as they were concerned - least of our worries was the reply and none really knew the fine points of the legislation, just that it was not a problem. Not surprised at you interceptor not knowing the ins and outs of what the new permit system entails.

    But if enough people keep raising the idea that someone is getting away with something, a parliamentary law draughtsman will soon come up with some neat regulation to define everything - just in case.

    Suggest all comply with the permit requirements as you know it, enjoy driving and get the most out of your enjoyment of your car AND the permit system.

    Regards

    Ken

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    Quote Originally Posted by davodawg View Post
    I have no problem with having my log book checked, provided the cops know what they're talking about.
    Got stopped the other day for just such a check and was told my Victorian log book wasn't filled out correctly. Constable old Mate reckoned that the `remarks' section should have included where I was off to. I explained that since I could roam as I liked as per the rules, I didn't actually know where I was off to for the rest of that day and I might decide to drive to the hills for lunch or go straight home. Free country, and all that.
    This confused the poor fellow and he finally admitted he didn't know what `remarks' meant. The point is, I still don't know myself. Anybody got the answer?
    My logbook doesn't have a "remarks" section - it has a "particulars of use" column. I would have thought that it was obvious what sort of information needed to be placed there.
    roger

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    Default The flow-on effect

    Cheers Ken, and I take your point that many of the cops neither know nor care about the ins and outs of the permit scheme. And fair enough, too, there's plenty of more important stuff they're (under)paid to deal with.
    It wasn't being pulled up for a log book check that annoyed me, just that I got a frowny face from somebody who couldn't tell me what I'd actually done wrong. (Unlike Mrs Davodawg who ALWAYS knows where and how I've erred.) I can't help but feel the intention was to make me feel like I'd been a bad boy even though I was behaving completely within the law. I know cops have bad days (and as the son of a copper, I can sympathise) so I've put it own to that.
    That, and the fact that my brother tells me I argue with policemen far too often. But he's obviously keen to conform since he drives a Holden.
    Meanwhile, I almost have to pinch myself when I consider how lucky we are to have the permit scheme. I can tell you straight up, that if we did have it, I wouldn't be running the cars I am.
    The authorities need to consider the big picture before changing anything, too; when blokes like me can justify running multiple cars, there's a tangible flow-on effect for the parts, repair, service, insurance and restoration industries.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lhs2.1 View Post
    My logbook doesn't have a "remarks" section - it has a "particulars of use" column. I would have thought that it was obvious what sort of information needed to be placed there.
    roger
    Cool. I'm all ears.

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    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davodawg View Post
    Cool. I'm all ears.
    I just write "driving"..... There's not enough space to write " I've filled in a day, so I'm driving it everywhere.... Drop the kids to school and back home... tow the trailer to the tip and back, pickup a load of gravel from the local sand/soil place and back... head out for an arvo drive to checkout the courthouse hotel and area for a club run and back... pick the kids up from school and back, whip upto Aldi and grab some of those good beers there selling at the moment.

    Now if you thought "particulars of use" involved stating where you were driving.

    Magpie -> napoleans and back
    magpie to gillies street ballarat and back
    magpie to bunningyong sand and soil and back
    magpie to smythesdale and back
    magpie to napoleans and back
    magpie to sebastopol and back

    OR

    Particulars of use == "DRIVING" or ... "FUN".

    Last time we went out in the CX, the short fiery one that often sits in the passenger seat had a look through the log book. First she ranted at me about how bad my writing was, then the yelled at me 'cos the last 3 entries said "05" for month, when it's June you d!ckhead.......................... WOOPS! Just as well I didn't get pulled over (it's ok though, the cops would have spotted the logbook went, 01.05, 21.05, 28.05 .... back to 03/05, 10/05 etc... for the next few entries ).

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    [QUOTE=DoubleChevron;1072663]I just write "driving"..... There's not enough space to write " I've filled in a day, so I'm driving it everywhere.... Drop the kids to school and back home... tow the trailer to the tip and back, pickup a load of gravel from the local sand/soil place and back... head out for an arvo drive to checkout the courthouse hotel and area for a club run and back... pick the kids up from school and back, whip upto Aldi and grab some of those good beers there selling at the moment.


    Thanks Shane. Good advice. It is kind of a grey area, though, isn't it. I mean, if you need to write `driving' when you're out, er, driving, then something's wrong with our police force. I much prefer your suggestion of `fun'. Might be wise not to be too clever, though; `Researching getaway route for bank robbery' mightn't go too well.

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    My observaton at the RACV event at Yarra Glen is that the Victorian permit scheme is well received and used by the owners of eligible cars, judging from the number of cars displayed with permit plates.

    My one concern was the obvious aging of the owners of the cars on display, they all seemed about or above my age, thats why I like the rolling date aspect of the eligible cars, the automatic provision will bring younger people into the car movement as they find quirky or "loveable" cars to restore while parts can be obtained cheaply at wrecking yards etc.

    I have always paid full registration for my cars (and one hasn't moved out of the yard for many years), but this year I dropped the registration and it will be put on a permit plate when my kids decide they want to drive it.

    Of course a permit isn't "registered" so a car can't be stored/parked out in the street, (if your council parking "enforcers" have a dislike of cars) I haven't recently re-read the fine print of the legislation to see if that issue was resolved as it seems to be in somewhat in conflict. Still you can store it on a registered trailer as Shane says, for those that don't have off street storage.

    So enjoy yourself, get out and sing that open road song, "I'm as free as the breeze - open road etc - do as you please- open road - open road" for 90 days Perhaps "freedom to roam the highways and byways" should be made up into a stamp for the remarks area, but driving is good too!!

    Nothings free of course, that's modern taxed life!!

    Ken

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    Default Club permit rules.

    My log book is full of " Test run " in the Remarks/ Particulars of use. Covers a multitude of everyday uses ( and not as cheeky as having FUN - which it really is ) .Many many thanks to those responsible for our magnificient log book permits.

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    Yesterday (Sunday) I was fitting new pads to her Laguna and she had to go shopping so I told her to take the 505 into Woodend and back. When she got back I asked if she remembered to fill in the book and she said "what book".

    While on the freeway a highway patrol came up behind her quickly and sat next to her and then sped off. Her lucky day.
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    It's a great system and I had them on my old 404 for a time (before putting it on full rego).

    I know of an EH Holden ute that was driven every day to park at a commuter car park that was on club plates. People like that ruin it for everybody.

    As for Shane using his club plate to tow stuff to the tip and drive to Aldi etc, remember these actions when the legislation is repealed.

    The Club plate scheme is supposed to be for attending rallies, assorted meet ups, and sundry trips to keep things from seizing up. Stretching the meaning of the leglislation (and feeling clever about doing it) will result in the scheme being abolished.

    People always stuff up things that are good. Sad actually...

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    Quote Originally Posted by 68 404 View Post
    It's a great system and I had them on my old 404 for a time (before putting it on full rego).

    I know of an EH Holden ute that was driven every day to park at a commuter car park that was on club plates. People like that ruin it for everybody.

    As for Shane using his club plate to tow stuff to the tip and drive to Aldi etc, remember these actions when the legislation is repealed.

    The Club plate scheme is supposed to be for attending rallies, assorted meet ups, and sundry trips to keep things from seizing up. Stretching the meaning of the leglislation (and feeling clever about doing it) lwill result in the scheme being abolished.

    Dave
    Maybe you should read the policy....

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    Quote Originally Posted by mistareno View Post
    Maybe you should read the policy....
    Interesting, thanks for tip.
    ......
    "Under the new conditions of use, permit holders are no longer restricted to club sanctioned activities when using their vehicles. Club Permit vehicles can be used at any time for any purpose other than for the carriage of goods or passengers for hire or reward."......

    http://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/Home/...lubPermits.htm


    I think I like the concept. Now to get something similar in Queensland

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    Quote Originally Posted by mistareno View Post
    Maybe you should read the policy....
    He's thinking the old Club Rego system, which was utterly useless IMO for the exact reasons he outlines

    Dave, Victoria now has a 90day log book permit system. You can use your car for 90days a year for any reason you desire. Wanna go for a picnic with the family ... chuck the gear in the car, fill in the log book and off you go.

    I had my old ID19 on club rego for a few years before it changed. It was a pointless waste of time. I ended up parking the car with grass growing through it under a tree in disgust. The car left the yard about 4times in as many years. 2 of them were to take it to the exhaust place, and upto pirtek to try and match some hydraulic lines. Well I'll be buggered if my old man didn't ring me the following day and say "I've had someone just ring me complaining you have driven a club rego'd car up the same road at the same time for two days. There going to dob you in if you don't stop driving it"...... FFS: the f#cking car hadn't been out of my bloody yard in over a year.

    As far as I was concerned they could shove the old permit system and the d!ckheads that felt *THEY* should be policing everyones use of it where the sun don't shine.

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    Veni Vidi Posti 68 404's Avatar
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    Apologies to Shane!

    A fairly radical change has occurred down south it seems. Victoria always seemed to have a fairly liberal club plate scheme, where vehicles far from standard seemed to be able to get club plates. But I digress...

    I guess people will 'forget' to fill out the log book page to prolong the 90 day benefit and eventually the roads will be filled with old shitters with club plates. As I said, people ruin all the good things.

    But again, sorry Shane, tow away! Oh, and Aldi have an electric pasta maker on special this week for $99. Could be useful

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    I do truly hope that this scheme is brought in Australia wide. It would mean I would actually use and enjoy my old machines a lot more, and be able to drive them to work once a week.

    What is the cost of this registration? The current Historic Rego in QLD is about $180 a year, with no discount for motorbikes. Full 4 cyl rego is about $650. This includes 3rd party insurance.

    The French run a scheme where you pay for 4 vehicles, and the rest are free if you are a private person. I don't know if this is only for Historic vehicles or vehicles in general.

    Currently we have 6 cars and two bikes registered, but I would have more bikes on the road if this were the case.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 68 404 View Post
    Apologies to Shane!

    A fairly radical change has occurred down south it seems. Victoria always seemed to have a fairly liberal club plate scheme, where vehicles far from standard seemed to be able to get club plates. But I digress...

    I guess people will 'forget' to fill out the log book page to prolong the 90 day benefit and eventually the roads will be filled with old shitters with club plates. As I said, people ruin all the good things.

    But again, sorry Shane, tow away! Oh, and Aldi have an electric pasta maker on special this week for $99. Could be useful

    Dave
    You have just described the ID19 I intend to get a club permit for in the near future I can already feeling the accusing eyes falling upon me

    As for abusing the system I doubt most will even manage to fill a 45day logbook. You seriously don't drive a "2nd" car anywhere near as often as you would expect.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleChevron View Post
    As for abusing the system I doubt most will even manage to fill a 45day logbook. You seriously don't drive a "2nd" car anywhere near as often as you would expect.
    Exactly, 90 days a year is almost 2 days a week. We've got one on SA historic rego and I can almost drive it 2 days a week to work when the wife needs the main car with child seats but it's a bit of a struggle.
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    It sounds like Vicroads is trying to clamp down on the club permit system in Victoria....

    http://www.aomc.asn.au/Letter%20to%2...e22Oct2013.pdf

    Here's some interesting reading. I've been talking to someone that's involved in a car club with over 500car on club permits. There quite concerned about the mention of "photos" and only one person being allowed to sign the permit renewels, not to mention that may require roadworthies and annual inspections. A massive, almost improbable task for a volunteer club with hundreds of vehicles.... If that happens a lot of larger clubs will likely just refuse allow access to the permit scheme.

    As always, interesting times ahead. It appears there tying to clamp down on "internet" based clubs that only exist to access the club permit scheme. It's a shame Vicroads is trying to change the current scheme, it's bloody brilliant, I can't say I've ever seen a club car on the road that appears to be "unsafe" or un-roadworthy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleChevron View Post
    It sounds like Vicroads is trying to clamp down on the club permit system in Victoria....

    http://www.aomc.asn.au/Letter%20to%2...e22Oct2013.pdf

    Here's some interesting reading. I've been talking to someone that's involved in a car club with over 500car on club permits. There quite concerned about the mention of "photos" and only one person being allowed to sign the permit renewels, not to mention that may require roadworthies and annual inspections. A massive, almost improbable task for a volunteer club with hundreds of vehicles.... If that happens a lot of larger clubs will likely just refuse allow access to the permit scheme.

    As always, interesting times ahead. It appears there tying to clamp down on "internet" based clubs that only exist to access the club permit scheme. It's a shame Vicroads is trying to change the current scheme, it's bloody brilliant, I can't say I've ever seen a club car on the road that appears to be "unsafe" or un-roadworthy.

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    I was under the impression that the intent of the modification to the club permit system was to weed out the highly modified cars that shouldn't be on club plates.
    These cars should be on something like Street rod plates, where an engineering certification is required.
    Plus i have heard of people getting caught out swapping club plates to another vehicle.
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    Reading all the points in the letter - all seemed very reasonable and a good set of items to include in an ongoing review of the system. Long live a robust and fair club plate system!

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    Bryce
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