gee wasn't Skaife shitty...
  • Help
Results 1 to 25 of 25
  1. #1
    1000+ Posts
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Location Location
    Posts
    1,578

    Icon10 gee wasn't Skaife shitty...

    but did you see the other bloke almost run him over when he was waving his fist at him? Man these Holden and Ford wankfests are great theatre.

    Advertisement

  2. #2
    Tadpole
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    1

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by graham66
    but did you see the other bloke almost run him over when he was waving his fist at him? Man these Holden and Ford wankfests are great theatre.
    Aw come on mate, it wasn't Skaife's fault. Did you happen to see Russell Ingall smack into him FOUR TIMES, by any chance?

    That was a PLANNED move, even thoug Ambrose had the c'ship wrapped up the cheating bastards still had to put Skaife into a wall. I'm NOT impressed.

    (Yes I am a Skaife fan.)

  3. #3
    Good Sport danielsydney's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    NSW
    Posts
    4,918

    Default

    I thought it was funny......

  4. #4
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Queensland, Australia
    Posts
    8,923

    Default

    I'll make a little bet; Skaife will be in more strife than Ingall.
    The actual incident will get the "racing incident" tag on it because it's a bit rich for Skaife to squeal too loud when constant reruns show Ingall has two wheels on the grass and Skaife was showing no signs of moving over to give him track space. He's also given Ingall the perfect excuse for "losing control" when you see his car bounce through a pothole just before Skaife loses it/gets turned sideways. Remember Tony Longhurst & Paul Morris at Oran Park in the BMWs a few years back? Morris lent on Longhurst, and they both ended up in a heap. Longhurst threw a dummy spit & who got the $50K fine? Not Morris!!

    Alan S

  5. #5
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Ballarat,Vic,Aust.
    Posts
    16,760

    Default

    This must be that crummydore vs foulcan crap. How exciting, a chev engine chassis, vs a chev engine chassis with a slightly (very slightly) differently shaped fiberglass shell on top.

    If it gets anymore exciting I may well go into a catatonic state Bring on the phsycos like the UK 2litre races (about a dozen manufactures all competing ). Even the HQ or Commadore cup is much more interesting racing than the tedious v8 chev 'vs' v8chev crap they try & sell us. If any other manufacturer enter and starts winning ... they outlaw them .... We can't have the precious v8's being whipped by 4 & 6cylinders can we (how many cylinders was the BMW's they used to run?).

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    'Cit' homepage:
    Citroen Workshop
    Proper cars--
    '85 Series II CX2500 GTi Turbo I
    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/citro%EBn-forum/90325-best-project-car-you-have-ever-seen.html
    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


    Modern Junk:
    '07 Poogoe 407 HDi 6spd manual

  6. #6
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Parkes - N.S.W - Australia - Earth
    Posts
    12,283

    Default

    it looked like ingall did make a fairly definate right turn though when all four wheels were on the black stuff
    so i'd say ingall will be in a bit of strife
    skaifey will be in a lot of strife as well for bieng on the track during a race without his helmet on (major offence)
    ingall will also be in strife for purposely swerving at skaife at the side of the track
    trying not to take sides here as it's all up to the stewards (paul taylor )
    also mark is my brother in laws cousin
    so i'll look at from both sides and say that both are in the wrong
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

  7. #7
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Gordon, NSW
    Posts
    4,527

    Default

    erm, Ford are using Ford built engines. Holdens run the Chev stuff.

    As for what happened. I agree with Alan there, Skaife is going to get in some serious shit there. Staying on the track is just stupid. Sure Ingall came off the racing line, but there's not much wrong with that, he's still on the race track and Skaife needs to get out of there as quickly as possible. He's a professional, he should know better.

    As for the preceeding incident, Ingall had his car off the road for a significant period of time. It looks like a racing incident, but the telemetry would tell an interesting story as to just how much lock was being turned into Skaife. I think he probably was turning into Skaife and when Skaife moved/spun, Ingall's car regained grip and it looked a lot worse than intended. In the end, it was a racing incident, what carried on afterwards on the edge of the track TWICE and then in the pit lane is inexcusable.

    And Skaife wonders why people don't like him that much. I think Russell knows why people don't like him! hehe.

    As for this V8 versus 4 cylinder comments, well look at which series has been sustainable and is enjoying great success. You have to give prase where it's due, Australia does have one of the strongest touring car championships in the world. BTCC and the Australia 2L series just didn't cut it in the end. I enjoy watching them, myself.

  8. #8
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Adelaide
    Posts
    642

    Default

    Skaife got a $10k fine and Russell a $15k fine.. On another note there a plans a foot in the UK to build a V8 Supercar series over there but using recongnisible bodies such as 406, Mondeo, Astra etc.. The cars will be RWD with a V8 with a shell on top. I prefer the 2litre tourers but most Aussie love a V8 mate and the series could not be sustained, shame really because it is the best racing and to really rub the premier catergory's nose in it the 2L were only a fraction slower than a V8 600BHP vs a 2L 300BHP FWD, he he that's the best bit.
    05' Megane 225 Cup

  9. #9
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Queensland, Australia
    Posts
    8,923

    Default

    I'll make another bet..
    The V8s are the dominating force due to the involvement of AVESCO, a group of promoters, not racing car involved (promoted Rock Concerts & Artists from memory) and obviously they sold the idea of their promotion of the series to Ford & Holden who could see the advertising and hence sales benefits. It's reached the stage now where Tony Cochrane is telling the drivers how to interperit the 'rulsth' asth he would thay, so the whole thing has become almost a performance rather than a contest. It's got nothing to do with sport; it's all about making money & selling cars. When Skaife/Ingall get chastised, who'll do it? Not CAMS but AVESCO. Who offers the "franchises? AVESCO and who demands the standards at the tracks? Not the ARDC or similar...no again it's AVESCO, they have total control.
    Enter the (greater) greed factor and we start taking the whole show overseas, firstly to NZ, now to China, they tell me that KL has a great new track in Malaysia and there's only so many races they can attend a year (and KL is enroute) & the time & cost factor in carting them overseas means Australia will soon be a few rounds of this "competition" which begs the question, what will take it's place? Konica? Doubt it. That's like going & watching a pub band after you've been seeing international artists; it comes across as second rate and as soon as anyone shows any potential or gets a fan base, over to the main comp they go, so drawcards are short lived.
    My bet is that some enterprising entrepeneur will take up the cudgel a' la Nations Cup style & start signing contracts with one of the TV channels to go head to head with them rather than as supporting acts to the V8s which will again give us things like Alain Menu in his Renault, Harvey in the Pugs and McLelland in the Vauxhalls, after all these guys are still racing overseas but it seems that we rarely if ever get exposure to them & as Shane said; they were crazies who were much better entertainment value than the current repetitive gaggle. The biggest mistake the 2 litre car series organisers made was to try to run an opposing event at Bathurst; that was the rock they perished on.
    All it will take is someone who can promote as well as AVESCO but hopefully not turn them into another circus in the process.

    Alan S

  10. #10
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Gordon, NSW
    Posts
    4,527

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by pugsy
    Skaife got a $10k fine and Russell a $15k fine.. On another note there a plans a foot in the UK to build a V8 Supercar series over there but using recongnisible bodies such as 406, Mondeo, Astra etc.. The cars will be RWD with a V8 with a shell on top. I prefer the 2litre tourers but most Aussie love a V8 mate and the series could not be sustained, shame really because it is the best racing and to really rub the premier catergory's nose in it the 2L were only a fraction slower than a V8 600BHP vs a 2L 300BHP FWD, he he that's the best bit.
    Interesting fines, will have to read up a bit more on that.

    Yeah, the V8s are certainly an interesting beast to drive, I would think that the wheel size restrictions and no sequential boxes, and other idiosynchracies have an impact on their overall speed around a track though. The 2Ls didn't have such restrictions, did they?

    You just have to love the sound of a V8, don't you?! They really do sound sensational.

    I drove up alongside a new XR8 ute the other day and couldn't believe the rumble coming from it. Yeah, I know it's politically incorrect, and they're fuel ineficient and they don't handle the best, but that engine does sound great! hehe

  11. #11
    1000+ Posts Damien Gardner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Wendouree Vic. Aust
    Posts
    2,436

    Default

    Quote
    "As for this V8 versus 4 cylinder comments, well look at which series has been sustainable and is enjoying great success. You have to give prase where it's due, Australia does have one of the strongest touring car championships in the world. BTCC and the Australia 2L series just didn't cut it in the end. I enjoy watching them, myself."
    End Quote

    Touring Car, What utter crap, next you'll be calling F1, Indy cars and Nascars, Touring cars. I think not!
    The Super V8's are purpose built RACE cars, with the same double wishbone suspensions, same brakes + many others so thaty they remain close in competition.
    Is there anyone likele to pay $250k plus, for a crummydore or foulcan, yes a few soon to be DEAD 18-25y/olds, with likely insurance premiums 20/30 grand p/a NO they're not a touring cars It's a circus show, AVESCO's FLYING V8'S, it's a Business, teams have to buy into it & are told what they can & can't do.
    The company controls everything at the events, like How much prize money will be paid by the track promoter etc. And haveing heard them laying down the LAW at CAMS State council meetings "IMHO" they also control CAMS.
    I also witnessed one episode where it was stated they couldn't care less about Grass roots motorsport " because all the best drivers come from Go karts"

    So every CAMS member pays higher fee's to help subsidise the circus's insurance premiums.
    It bloody well stinks as does, their sh1t, although they think otherwise.

    From what i saw on the news, yesterday's ACT was played quite well, and the players should be on stage, Preferable the next one out of town.

    Good thing to keep in mind these drivers are professionals and Know what they're doing.

    My 2 bob, ooops sorry 20cents for those born after '66
    Health and good fortune always,
    Damien.

    We rode on the winds of the rising storm,
    We ran to the sounds of thunder.
    We danced among the lightning bolts,
    and tore the R10's assfromunder.

    Robert Jordan & memyself&I

    1/48th Scale Alpine A310,
    N-scale 1/160th Renault & Citroen, Advert. Signs & Billboards

  12. #12
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Gordon, NSW
    Posts
    4,527

    Default

    I was just using the generic term "touring car"...I know they're purpose built race cars and have nothing in them related to the road car, except for the shape and hard points on the subframe.

    How are other successful "touring car" type series run overseas? In Germany?

  13. #13
    XTC
    XTC is offline
    VIC: a fine driving state XTC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Location Location Location
    Posts
    8,566

    Default

    Ford v's Holden ... Yawn ... bring back the variety of the old days - not all motorsport fans are meatheads

    - XTC206 -
    You're not fooling everyone, or did you forget? .......




    '02 Peugeot 206 GTi / '07 VW Golf GTI
    Now this is a .sig
    AF'd in PER, MEL, SYD, ADL, CBR

  14. #14
    Sense Pug307's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    4,355

    Default

    There is the ETCC in Europe, which has a good mix of cars.

    I miss the BTCC. What was the reason it died, I know various manufacturers were pulling out, but what lead to that? Financial pressures? It seemed popular at the time.

    BTCC cars also had much more relevance to the road cars - you used the same suspension designs as the road cars (although Audi was creative with its interpretation of its front suspension design in the A4 )

    A lot of the appeal of the BTCC for me came from the fact that the cars actually had relevance to the cars we drive on the roads in real life. The racing was good and the championships tight. A pity it's gone now.

    Peugeot 307 XS 1.6
    Aussiefrogged in MEL, PER, SYD, BNE & ADL.
    Rendezvous Adelaide 2005

  15. #15
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Queensland, Australia
    Posts
    8,923

    Default

    Ref: The ACT.

    Did anyone pick up Bill Woods comment "It should be interesting at the V8 Superstars next edition, after all, those two sit next to each other...be a bit like 'World Championship Wrestling" (giggle giggle) and I think it was Crompton responding "but before that Bill we have the V8 Superstar awards night on ten on Monday (?) night....that could get interesting also" Woods "But I doubt there'll be too much action there with families and sponsors around, although I've no doubts that the speeches could get a bit interesting...."
    Let's face it. Racing's finished for the year, so they need something to attract the punters and hold their sponsors interest.



    Alan S

  16. #16
    Fellow Frogger! jfn180's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    sydney
    Posts
    725

    Default

    i don`t mind holden`s my dad has one and i`ve always like them as for ford well

    Found
    On
    Rubbish
    Dump
    97`black 306 style sold JFN 306
    04 Black 206 GTI 180 JFN 180 FOR SALE
    I HATE V8 LANDCRUISERS


    WEST TIGERS= PREMIERS 05

  17. #17
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Adelaide
    Posts
    642

    Default

    Just read in the paper that Skaife and Ingall both got championship points deducted and got a three race ban, they are both appealing the decision.

    The BTCC got stopped because costs were getting way out of hand the new series ETCC is very tightly regulated keeping costs in check and hopefully more manufacturers will join, I think at the moment there is MG, Vauxhall, Honda and a couple of others,I can't remember, Volvo was in and out and then maybe back in.

    Despite all the behind the scenes crap that goes on with AVESCO and CAMS the series is entertaining but they are not French, oh well.
    05' Megane 225 Cup

  18. #18
    1000+ Posts tekkie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    1,516

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by GTI124
    I drove up alongside a new XR8 ute the other day and couldn't believe the rumble coming from it. Yeah, I know it's politically incorrect, and they're fuel ineficient and they don't handle the best, but that engine does sound great! hehe
    Im getting 14.2L/100kms in the city, and 10.1 on hwy.
    that seems to be a lot better that some 4cyl's and a lot of 6's. (keeping in mind its a 1600kg car)

    The handling can be improved, granted


    I thought that there were no fibreglass panels allowed in V8's, all the lights and panels have to be the same as the road going cars as well as operating doors, windows etc.
    And when people start sprouting stuff like its so different to road going cars, the 2L series shared very few components with road going cars as well.

    The V8 series is a great spectacle, and gets the crowds in. People australia wide know the top 10 drivers and can express an opinion on the racing and who should, could win etc. Its a great recepie to get sponsors in, generate more money and ultimately lead to close competition. Wonder what will replace the show when they start racing overseas. Nations Cup and Carrera Cup look good.


    Im staying out of the Skaife / Ingall thing with exception of one comment. Skaife lost 2nd place in a championship to a guy who had nothing to gain. I can see why Skaife was a tad pissed as a driver and as a manager. Ross Stone was a tad upset too, and he was Ingall's manager....
    .
    1300cc's of jap buzzbox delivered the times below.

    EC 1:54.6 , Wakefield 1:13.15 , OP (short) 52.00 , OP GP 1:24.40


  19. #19
    XTC
    XTC is offline
    VIC: a fine driving state XTC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Location Location Location
    Posts
    8,566

    Default

    First/Fails
    On
    Racing
    Day

    - XTC206 -
    You're not fooling everyone, or did you forget? .......




    '02 Peugeot 206 GTi / '07 VW Golf GTI
    Now this is a .sig
    AF'd in PER, MEL, SYD, ADL, CBR

  20. #20
    1000+ Posts Pugnut403's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Tasmania
    Posts
    1,419

    Default

    OK, Fords use Ford engines. I believe they are a highly modified Windsor.
    Holdens use Chev motors.
    They are not identical chassis with fibreglass panels like NASCAR. They are actually built on Falcon or Commodore shells.
    The shells arrive at the racing workshop as bare shells. They are stripped of brackets etc, and filled with chrome moly roll cage. Granted the mechanicals are quite heavily modified, but they are basically the same family of engine, and they are in the same shell as the road cars. I've never seen Pugs sold with sequential gearboxes and souped up engines with racing suspension either.

    I do prefer the 2 litre stuff, but I enjoy watching the V8s too. Sadly I cannot get the television channel that they are on . I can't get F1 either
    I believe that the Bathurst race went downhill when it became Ford v Holden. I love watching the tapes of the early races where you could see a Lotus Cortina battling with a Mini Cooper and the Holden way behind.
    Pugs Rule!

    403, now sold
    404, project
    2010 Mitsubishi i MiEV electric car

  21. #21
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Burpengary and Murrumburrah, Qld and NSW
    Posts
    9,223

    Default

    I have no qualms about saying that I'd prefer the V8 rear-drive cars to the 2-litre cars any day.

    They behave like cars should, they exhibit a high level of technology, they are fast and the racing is close.

    But it's artificially close, which is a problem I do have with it.

    As for Skaife and Ingall, well how predictable this was.

    Ingall has been encouraged by all form of media to behave like this for years... Skaife has an ego the combined horsepower of the whole field couldn't stop.

  22. #22
    Tadpole
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    11

    Default

    I think it was a crime what the AVESCO group did in basically squeezing out the fantastic 2L Australian touring cars. There are two sides for me to enjoying motor racing, one is the skill of the drivers the other is the awe of phenomenal racing cars. Australias best drivers are in the V8 series, where else do they go? The cars themselves are fat, ugly, dinosaurs that have nothing in common with the road going examples. One of the joys of F1 for example is to see the Williams scream down the straight and then have a little Renault try and outbrake it into the corner and take it through the twistys. From a race car perspective the V8's are dull. Now the British touring cars, that was a great series....

  23. #23
    XTC
    XTC is offline
    VIC: a fine driving state XTC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Location Location Location
    Posts
    8,566

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bleek206
    Now the British touring cars, that was a great series....
    They (BTC) used to allow a lot more "racing incidents"
    Some of the V8 boys need to pull their heads in !

    - XTC206 -
    You're not fooling everyone, or did you forget? .......




    '02 Peugeot 206 GTi / '07 VW Golf GTI
    Now this is a .sig
    AF'd in PER, MEL, SYD, ADL, CBR

  24. #24
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Burpengary and Murrumburrah, Qld and NSW
    Posts
    9,223

    Default

    Originally posted by Bleek206
    I think it was a crime what the AVESCO group did in basically squeezing out the fantastic 2L Australian touring cars. There are two sides for me to enjoying motor racing, one is the skill of the drivers the other is the awe of phenomenal racing cars. Australias best drivers are in the V8 series, where else do they go? The cars themselves are fat, ugly, dinosaurs that have nothing in common with the road going examples. One of the joys of F1 for example is to see the Williams scream down the straight and then have a little Renault try and outbrake it into the corner and take it through the twistys. From a race car perspective the V8's are dull. Now the British touring cars, that was a great series....
    While I quite agree with you that there is nowhere else for our top drivers to head (and still stay in Australia...), I disagree on a couple of points.

    For a start, the relevance issue. If the V8s have nothing in common with road going examples, then the 2-litre cars had even less!

    They had engine locations that bore no resemblence, for instance, to where the maker intended them. I remember looking down into the Volvo and Peugeot racers and seeing just how low down the engines lay.

    Then they had sequential gearboxes, something the V8s don't have even today. I know, you may say that Alfa have their Celespeed in production, but let's face it, the 'road going' cars by and large have conventional H-pattern changes.

    Many other things are the same, of course. The lightweighting, the suspension systems etc. But on these two points the 2-litre cars could be said to be much more radically modified than their V8 cousins.

    I don't see why, either, you can say that there is a difference in the skills or technology between the two types. Both have technology to burn, both have drivers of great skill.

    What we really need, of course, is for a bit of a pullback in the freedoms and for all makes and models to be able to run. Classes... different cars... lapping slower traffic... joy of joys...

  25. #25
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Parkes - N.S.W - Australia - Earth
    Posts
    12,283

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Bell

    What we really need, of course, is for a bit of a pullback in the freedoms and for all makes and models to be able to run. Classes... different cars... lapping slower traffic... joy of joys...
    and have to listen to dick johnson whinge and whine about that as well
    since the slower cars haven't been there he has had to find other things to gripe about
    anything from bloody rocks to slow cars
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x 2018 3008

    1 x 2000 Citroen XM,

    1 x '98 306 GTi6 sadly sold

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •