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    Default Speed Alert

    I've had a horrendous time with speed cameras in the past couple of weeks, just waiting to see how many points I rack up! Problem with driving a responsive car like the 205.
    Quite frankly the number of times that the speed limits change in even a short trip is ridiculous, overseas vistors can't believe it.
    Wanting to do something about this before I lose my licence, I had a look and came up with Speed Alert, this is software that runs and is preloaded in the Navig8r GPS range. All the speed zones are there and if you are going above these limits an audible warning is given.
    Luckily the Navig8r I35 is on special at Harvey Norman, Nunawading store at least, for $99!
    After a test run seems to work OK, let you know in greater detail later on.
    Graham

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    SWMBO ran out of points a few years ago. They gave her the option of parting with some green stuff and going on a twelve month contract to lose absolutely no points. It slowed her down somewhat
    Those people that say I know - generally don't.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Boulton View Post
    SWMBO ran out of points a few years ago. They gave her the option of parting with some green stuff and going on a twelve month contract to lose absolutely no points. It slowed her down somewhat
    I did the 12 month thing 13 years ago. I don't think I would have a hope with todays roads, so I hope this gadget does the job.
    Thing is I have been very cautious but still getting caught out ocasionally when concentration lapsed.
    I will probably be travelling at a higher average speed now.
    Graham

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    Sorry to say it, Graham, but I think you'd better start cozying up to an obliging chauffeur if you're going to depend on any sort of a machine to keep you out of trouble. If you're sailing that close to the wind, then </SERMON ON> there's really no substitute for concentrating on where you are and driving at an appropriate speed </SERMON OFF>.

    For your sake, I hope I'm wrong, but through no fault of your own (well, ... that's possibly moot), you will inevitably find that the GPS will eventually let you down, and fail to warn you of a speed zone mismatch at just the wrong time, and I reckon it'll happen within 12 months, too. Colour me fatalistic where technology's concerned; call it Murphy's Law; but these things just fail, usually because somebody stuffs up an update, and you're likely to find that that goes double if you're depending on it to deliver benign or desirable outcomes every time, and to do so many times every day.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr bern View Post
    Sorry to say it, Graham, but I think you'd better start cozying up to an obliging chauffeur if you're going to depend on any sort of a machine to keep you out of trouble. If you're sailing that close to the wind, then </SERMON ON> there's really no substitute for concentrating on where you are and driving at an appropriate speed </SERMON OFF>.

    For your sake, I hope I'm wrong, but through no fault of your own (well, ... that's possibly moot), you will inevitably find that the GPS will eventually let you down, and fail to warn you of a speed zone mismatch at just the wrong time, and I reckon it'll happen within 12 months, too. Colour me fatalistic where technology's concerned; call it Murphy's Law; but these things just fail, usually because somebody stuffs up an update, and you're likely to find that that goes double if you're depending on it to deliver benign or desirable outcomes every time, and to do so many times every day.
    .
    It will at least remind me of the need to concentrate on the many changes of speed required, however, and most importantly let me know my exact speed, a real problem as the car I am driving most of the time seems to read a bit low, most unusual, and made worse by the one size larger tyres fitted 165/70/13 to 185/60/14.
    Graham

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    Icon3 Just some observations....be safe...

    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS View Post
    It will at least remind me of the need to concentrate on the many changes of speed required, however, and most importantly let me know my exact speed, a real problem as the car I am driving most of the time seems to read a bit low, most unusual, and made worse by the one size larger tyres fitted 165/70/13 to 185/60/14.
    Graham
    Graham

    The best thing is the dumb driver, switch - cruise control, practice accelerating up to the speed limit and drop it into cruise, then let all the idiots pass you when they catch up....relaxing.

    Be careful when leaving a 60 kph road and then finding its a 50 kph as the camera car will be right in the spot where you are looking to see if there IS a 60 kph speed sign, by the time you realise there isn't a speed zone sign -your gone and so are your points .... tricky site selection....

    Give the speedo a check out on the highway, at 100kph its 36 seconds on a stop watch between the marked (numbered) Kilometre posts - if you look for them they are also on the freeways.

    Howard instruments in Heidelberg West, can do a calibration check of the speedo under $100 I believe.

    Ken

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    Graham,

    move to NSW, or Qld. Victoria is the absolute pits, when it comes to speed laws and enforcement.

    Tim

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenfuego View Post
    Graham

    The best thing is the dumb driver, switch - cruise control, practice accelerating up to the speed limit and drop it into cruise, then let all the idiots pass you when they catch up....relaxing.

    Be careful when leaving a 60 kph road and then finding its a 50 kph as the camera car will be right in the spot where you are looking to see if there IS a 60 kph speed sign, by the time you realise there isn't a speed zone sign -your gone and so are your points .... tricky site selection....

    Give the speedo a check out on the highway, at 100kph its 36 seconds on a stop watch between the marked (numbered) Kilometre posts - if you look for them they are also on the freeways.

    Howard instruments in Heidelberg West, can do a calibration check of the speedo under $100 I believe.

    Ken
    I would never use cruise control, highly dangerous, the driver just sits back and is really no longer in control. I was with a mate in his 406 Coupe and very neally had a monumental nose to tail with a slow moving car on the Western Highway when he didn't notice how slowly the car in front was moving.
    I really don't know how this was approved for use in cars.
    Also, useless in Victoria with the multiple speed limits.
    Thanks for the advice Ken, but not for me.
    I prefer a digital speed read out (Terratrip in rallycar is excellent) as I do a digital clock and a GPS should be 100% accurate.
    Graham

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    Quote Originally Posted by tcusack View Post
    Graham,

    move to NSW, or Qld. Victoria is the absolute pits, when it comes to speed laws and enforcement.

    Tim
    Yes, we are the laughing stock of the world.
    I think the plan was to closely control what the drivers did, in particular speed, to minimise the effects of accidents.
    The better way would be to upgrade the skills of the drivers so they could make these decisions for themselves. Trouble is the expense and the fact that there are a lot of stupid people out there.
    The result has been that driver skills have been reduced to a very low level and anything out of the ordinary is beyond the capabilities of the average driver, look at the problems people had driving through water recently.
    It was a real eye opener to observe the skills of drivers in Europe recently. At no time did I feel unsafe in the taxis we travelled in as compared to Melbourne where you take your life in your hands much of the time.
    I'm afraid that we aren't going to increase driver skills in the current environment, especially when cars are so easy to drive (one reason for the higher skills in Europe could be their preference for manual gearboxes), so more of the same is the only way to give a reasonable safety outcome.

    Graham

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    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS View Post
    I was with a mate in his 406 Coupe and very neally had a monumental nose to tail with a slow moving car on the Western Highway when he didn't notice how slowly the car in front was moving.
    I don't see how this relates to cruise control being "dangerous"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fingers View Post
    I don't see how
    Well, nature made it so we can't all be top of the class...................

    Tim

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    I don't agree that the choice for manual gearboxes makes for a safer driver. I do however think that we are extremely lax in the way we hand out licences and never retest for over 50 years.

    Europeans know how to drive. Any country where three lanes of traffic can zip along at 130 km/h with confidence and accuracy is OK by me.

    This is not a call to up our speed limits either. As I have stated before we do not have the population to fund separation barriers down the middle of our long freeways - unless of course we put tolls on them... shudder.

    The use of cruise control is a choice of the driver, and is perfectly safe if used correctly. I have seen drivers of non CC vehicles do exactly as you described. The most recent was on Victoria Rd at Ryde the other night. My C5 nearly got turned into a C4 by an Astra driver not watching further ahead than his bonnet. My two passengers wondered why I was suddenly expleting "don't run up my @rse you little pr!ck!" as myself and three other cars in front braked in a normal manner.

    I do find the speed advisories on a GPS to be of use, but when in Melglum last year and driving a borrowed Turbo Mondeo I was somewhat paranoid about the dreaded cameras.
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    Quote Originally Posted by UFO View Post
    I don't agree that the choice for manual gearboxes makes for a safer driver. I do however think that we are extremely lax in the way we hand out licences and never retest for over 50 years.

    Europeans know how to drive. Any country where three lanes of traffic can zip along at 130 km/h with confidence and accuracy is OK by me.

    This is not a call to up our speed limits either. As I have stated before we do not have the population to fund separation barriers down the middle of our long freeways - unless of course we put tolls on them... shudder.

    The use of cruise control is a choice of the driver, and is perfectly safe if used correctly. I have seen drivers of non CC vehicles do exactly as you described. The most recent was on Victoria Rd at Ryde the other night. My C5 nearly got turned into a C4 by an Astra driver not watching further ahead than his bonnet. My two passengers wondered why I was suddenly expleting "don't run up my @rse you little pr!ck!" as myself and three other cars in front braked in a normal manner.

    I do find the speed advisories on a GPS to be of use, but when in Melglum last year and driving a borrowed Turbo Mondeo I was somewhat paranoid about the dreaded cameras.

    The driver of the 406 was extremely experienced but had "switched off" due to the speed control.
    Personally I always feel very unsafe when using cruise control.
    Same goes for ALB, terrifying on a gravel road. You can't compete in a grass motorkhana with ABS, the car simply won't stop in the finish garage, luckily fuses can be removed!
    Same again for ESP, I had recent experience with this on some remote roads in a Disco 3, you have no control over your destiny, instead of being able to control the car with use of the throttle we were taken right to the edge of the road, sometimes into the drain.
    Still, for the unskilled driver this is a safer outcome than spinning or overcorrecting then hitting a tree or rolling.
    Another example of deskilling is the now almost total use of red turn arrows.
    Previously you were able to make a turn if there was no oncoming traffic. Now you have to wait until you are told you can go.
    Very frustrating at times and deskilling in the sense that people don't have to make judgements involving time and space, this may come back to bite them if they find themselves in an unusual situation.

    Graham

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    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS View Post
    Another example of deskilling is the now almost total use of red turn arrows.
    Previously you were able to make a turn if there was no oncoming traffic. Now you have to wait until you are told you can go.
    Very frustrating at times and deskilling in the sense that people don't have to make judgements involving time and space, this may come back to bite them if they find themselves in an unusual situation.

    Graham
    On the contrary, it takes a great deal of skill to treat the red arrows, or any other red light for that matter as stop signs, and not have an accident or get busted driving through them before they change.


    There is one of those electric stop signs near my place that gets ignored at least twice a day.
    The funny thing about it is the cop sits around the corner in his bright green m&m, but hasn't cottoned on to what people are up to just around the corner.


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    Icon14 Cruise is not dangerous if you drive accordingly....IMHO!

    Quote Originally Posted by Fingers View Post
    I don't see how this relates to cruise control being "dangerous"
    Many years ago, I was of the same opinion. When police cars were fitted with cruise controls, I probably felt that way too, as it was rather disconcerting to approach an intersection or find the car in front decelerating and yours seemingly increasing speed as if you were driving without caution.

    With the increasing use of roadside camera cars, and the multitude of official reports demanded by the police department if you infringed (even if justified under the then generous road traffic exemptions to police performing their "duty" (no not going for lunch!!) and also due to my involvement with traffic groups under my line of command, I certainly did not want to be put under the spotlight for NOT sticking to speed limits while supervising police operations.

    The beep alert was handy, but the actual cruise control was better - virtually no chance of exceeding the speed limit, all you had to do was master its use, develop a better perception of closing speeds, and modify your speed by gently applying the brake, which took it out of cruise and then resume to the set speed when safe (the original cruises fitted had to be reset) and keep well aware of changes in traffic, which is something that you can do, because you are not constantly looking at your speedo.

    Totally eliminated any report writing anyway to dodge infringements, so it was pretty easy to slip back into use of the cruise control when I bought the Laguna. I have always prided myself on "knowing" my road speed and found the Laguna cruise excellent for making that adjustment accurately, and within a few weeks of ownership could slip into cruise and set the digital speed almost without checking, so great for getting quickly familiar with your speed and take off, as all cars are a different in that respect.

    I certainly use cruise more than most, it is safer, keeps you alert to the traffic around you as you constantly check traffic and mirrors and only reference check the speedo for confirmation, and I find I am spot on with the selected speed, its easy to manually flick out using your right thumb and resume when safe, and on rare occasions, a touch to the brake does the same thing.

    Cruise helps a driver resist the temptation to go faster when another car decides to overtake and pass you, let them, as there are some drivers who see it as some sort of challenge race to get ahead of the driver in front, that's their problem and their issues, and I usually get to see them charge ahead, get in the wrong lane and you end up passing them as you have a better perception of the flow of traffic, closing speeds etc.

    The worst drivers I hate to say, are some (not all) green P platers, that rocket past you, race up to the traffic ahead and then have to stand on their brakes as the lane slows (and they should have been well aware of that fact if they had been observing all the traffic, not just the car immediately in front!!) and they have poor lane and traffic perception and get trapped.

    I would emphasize that I DO NOT use cruise control in extremely congested, bumper to bumper traffic when your speed is being constantly adjusted. I would prefer to maintain safe distances between my car and the other cars, (defensive driving) than be concerned about either doing the speed limit or under it - in other words driving to the condition of the traffic. The 2 km adjustment up or down is excellent for adjusting to a point where you are well clear of the traffic at the rear of you, and only marginally catching up on the slower cars in front - a sweet driving spot and well within limits.

    Overall I feel that cruise control is a valuable tool to be used by a thinking driver, sure I call it dumb driver, as it takes all the thrill of driving over and under road speeds, and I have no desire to contribute to government coffers!!

    You should know your vehicle, its performance and the operation of the equipment IF you are professional in your approach to your driving - and safe and courteous to others - cruise is great for curbing the reactions of years of pursuit driving - the have a go...attitude. Try it, its relaxing!!

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    Last edited by Kenfuego; 9th February 2011 at 08:39 PM.

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    JBN
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    Ken, you have given good reasons for using cruise control from the point of view of obeying the rules and not getting caught for speeding.

    I don't know if the cruise control works on the Xantia. Sometimes the wand gets in the way when I operate the indicator stalk. I have never taken any interest in using it. I drive a car basically using the right pedal, which balances the car. I rarely touch the brakes as the ZF auto reacts very well to a trailing throttle and drops down a gear. Most of my driving is within the urban environment.

    With the 2CV, it doesn't have the power to operate a cruise control. Both the right a left pedals get a good workout as the car is constantly having the gears changed to keep it in its narrow torque band (Talk band? Nah, whisper band). The left pedal is also used to slip the clutch in second on slow corners to stop the engine stalling. Brakes rarely touched. The accelerator is constantly used to balance the car through S bends, corners and lane changes. With the high angles of roll, rythmic driving coordinating steering and accelerator is the way to go.

    Basically, I really like to drive in the first instance, and obey the rules in spirit (ie don't hit anyone or anything and respect other road users).

    John

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    I reckon any car you drive JBN has a talk band.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JBN View Post
    Ken, you have given good reasons for using cruise control from the point of view of obeying the rules and not getting caught for speeding.

    I don't know if the cruise control works on the Xantia. Sometimes the wand gets in the way when I operate the indicator stalk. I have never taken any interest in using it. I drive a car basically using the right pedal, which balances the car. I rarely touch the brakes as the ZF auto reacts very well to a trailing throttle and drops down a gear. Most of my driving is within the urban environment.

    With the 2CV, it doesn't have the power to operate a cruise control. Both the right a left pedals get a good workout as the car is constantly having the gears changed to keep it in its narrow torque band (Talk band? Nah, whisper band). The left pedal is also used to slip the clutch in second on slow corners to stop the engine stalling. Brakes rarely touched. The accelerator is constantly used to balance the car through S bends, corners and lane changes. With the high angles of roll, rythmic driving coordinating steering and accelerator is the way to go.

    Basically, I really like to drive in the first instance, and obey the rules in spirit (ie don't hit anyone or anything and respect other road users).

    John
    Cruise control doesn't address my problem, I went through 30 changes of speed limits on a trip from North Balwyn to Ashburton last night.
    My problem is keeping track of the current speed limit in built up areas.
    So far the Speed Alert has pointed out to me just how many permanent 40 km/h zones there are .
    It is certainly not at all enjoyable driving below the limit all the time, I think a large engined automatic would make it easier compared with the revy nature of the 205 Si.
    I would say my driving is less safe at these slow speeds, demands too much concentration and I would much prefer to drive at the speed the car feels happiest.
    I fully agree with your last statement John, in 44 years of driving I have never made an insurance claim and haven't run into anyone since 1973, soon after that they got rid of the give way to the right rule, a big factor in accidents in Victoria at the time.

    Graham

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    I counted 12 different speed zones between Mornington and Stumpy Gully Road a couple of hours ago - a distance of about 5 kms. Brilliant! Is there an award for this stuff? Mornington Shire Council are stand-out contenders for most of the drongo awards I can think of. This may be another potential winner for them.

    Tim

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    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS View Post
    I fully agree with your last statement John, in 44 years of driving I have never made an insurance claim and haven't run into anyone since 1973, soon after that they got rid of the give way to the right rule, a big factor in accidents in Victoria at the time.

    Graham
    I nearly T boned an old timer in his big merc last year using the the give right of way to the right rule.
    He was damn lucky I was on the ball.
    When we both came to a standstill in a cloud of tyre smoke, I asked him WTF was he thinking, and he told me it was my fault, I needed to give way to the right (in spite of the fact that he had a give way sign and I did not ).
    I'd never heard of the give way to the right rule before (and still hadn't until you mentioned it), so I told the old fart who was still swearing black and blue it was my fault to shape up and learn the road rule for 2010, not 1950, and reminded his wife that if hubby pulls another stunt like that, it will be her who is killed, not him as the next unsuspecting car T bones the passengers side.


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    Quote Originally Posted by tcusack View Post
    I counted 12 different speed zones between Mornington and Stumpy Gully Road a couple of hours ago - a distance of about 5 kms. Brilliant! Is there an award for this stuff? Mornington Shire Council are stand-out contenders for most of the drongo awards I can think of. This may be another potential winner for them.

    Tim
    I turned left off the Eastern Freeway onto Doncaster road, into a 70 km/h zone as shown on the speed alert and the road signs, less than 100m later it changes to 60km/h!
    What was wrong with changing from the 70 (used for the dual carriageway up the Doncaster Hill) to the 60km/h (undivided Doncaster Rd) at the Freeway intersection not after it. I would have thought 70 km/h was too fast to drive through a major and complicated intersection anyway.

    Graham

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    Quote Originally Posted by mr bern View Post
    For your sake, I hope I'm wrong, but through no fault of your own (well, ... that's possibly moot), you will inevitably find that the GPS will eventually let you down, and fail to warn you of a speed zone mismatch at just the wrong time, and I reckon it'll happen within 12 months, too.
    Probably by the time that happens Graham will have adjusted his driving and will probably automatically be driving to the speed limits and won't notice, this assumes driving the same routes day to day.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uffee View Post
    Probably by the time that happens Graham will have adjusted his driving and will probably automatically be driving to the speed limits and won't notice, this assumes driving the same routes day to day.
    Yes, a learning process but I've got to say it takes away any remaining enjoyment that city driving offered. You get a bit tired of getting passed by everyone too!
    Graham

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    Quote Originally Posted by GRAHAM WALLIS View Post
    I turned left off the Eastern Freeway onto Doncaster road, into a 70 km/h zone as shown on the speed alert and the road signs, less than 100m later it changes to 60km/h!
    Graham
    So is it 60 all the way up the hill now? I went to Doncaster Park P.S. just next to the jewish centre were you speak of. I remember Dony rd prior to the 3 lanes each way and even after they fix it, it was 75 all the way up even past our school.
    Mind you i used to do a lot more than 75 on my bike coming down the hill.

    On further thought, i think it was actually 90 at first, then 75, 70 and now 60. In 30 years how things have changed, for the same stretch of road, nothing has changed along it but the speed limit keeps coming down.
    Last edited by 63-1092; 11th February 2011 at 11:31 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 63-1092 View Post
    So is it 60 all the way up the hill now? I went to Doncaster Park P.S. just next to the jewish centre were you speak of. I remember Dony rd prior to the 3 lanes each way and even after they fix it, it was 75 all the way up even past our school.
    Mind you i used to do a lot more than 75 on my bike coming down the hill.
    No, sorry I should have said I was heading west along the freeway, 70 km/h up the hill.
    Graham

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