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  1. #1
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    People's fuel buying habits

    I was just standing out the front of work, and watched a nice black 306 GTI6 drive past (nice and shiny I thought it might be Lincoln!) but was horrified to hear it pinging like crazy.

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    Now today's warm in Sydney, but not that hot.. not that that should matter in a modern car... but what would possess someone to fill up a 306 GTI6 with normal unleaded fuel? dead

    I'm assuming people just don't understand that certain cars need better fuel than others? I bet he complains about lack of performance in that car! If only he'd been going slower I would have stickered him

    Derek.

  2. #2
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    Lincoln goes and checks that his car is still in the parking lot...

    Insane is the word for it, no other word would describe such lunacy.

    As for my fuel buying habit, I try and buy 98 all the time, but occasionally will use 95 BP fuel. I buy on a Sunday, Monday or Tuesday. I've found recently that Tuesday is the cheapest day for the Shell I go to in Dundas.
    - Lincoln

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  3. #3
    2000+ Brad's Avatar
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    I ONLY buy BP Ultimate (98RON). I find Sheel Optimax to be quite inconsistent and will make the car hard to start after it has been siting for a few hours in the heat...+ BP is about 2c cheaper at any time.
    B to the R to the A from the D
    1994 MX5 Clubman...are you sure it's not French?

  4. #4
    Tadpole
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    I've only tried a few fuels so far but my 206 seems to run better/smoother on 95 RON. I've read in a few places that it doesn't have the necessary engine management to adjust for 98 RON. Is this true?

    Also, a bit off topic but does the 206 have passive rear steering? If so, it would explain a certain handling characteristic that I have observed. Anyone know where I can find some good technical info on it?
    2002 206 GTi

  5. #5
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    206 has passive rear wheel steer.

    There really isn't any place that has great info on it in all honesty - I've spent time looking.

    There was a small discussion on it on the Yahoo 206GTi mailing list. In addition, try searching groups.google.com for more discussion.

    Cheers,

    Justin

    Peugeot 307 XS 1.6
    Aussiefrogged in MEL, PER, SYD, BNE & ADL.
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  6. #6
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    since having modern pugs (405/306) for the last 7 years i have never put anything but premium unleaded in them
    i even used to carry a jery can in the 405 when i went west in qld just in case i ran short
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x '98 306 GTi6

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0


    WTD long range fuel tank for 605

  7. #7
    Fellow Frogger! MYT205's Avatar
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    I will only ever put 98 Octane fuel in ANY car I own. The SP20 is supposed to use Premium ATLEAST anyway.

    I'd prefer to spend the few c/L extra and know that I am getting decent fuel. I will only put normal Unleaded in when I have NO OPTION but to, and then I will only put enough in to get me to another servo that will have decent fuel.

  8. #8
    1000+ Posts TroyO's Avatar
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    I only ever use BP Ultimate in my car. I did use 95 octane Premium in the old car at one time, but I found that I would get better economy with BP Ultimate. I didn't feel much of a difference in performance though.

    As for that person running normal unleaded in their GTI6, that's crazy! They don't deserve that sort of car. They might as well give it to me.

    Troy.

  9. #9
    1000+ Posts Rod Hagen's Avatar
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    Be careful of some of the stuff being sold as "premium unleaded" by some of the independent small operators (these often carry 'company" brand name, but aren't actually owned by the big guys), especially in areas where the turnover is low. In some cases its actually worse than 'regular" unleaded.

    Wether its bad fuel to begin with, just deteriorates with age in "low turnover" situations, or is stored in old, dirty underground tanks I don't know, but I've had a few bad experiences with it now.

    I've never had any problems at all with the new generation stuff (the Vortexs, Optimaxs, Ultimates etc). I've had no problems with the 95 octane stuff from Singapore that comes out of Safeway premium unleaded pumps. I can even, at a pinch, run on "regular" unleaded from major Shell and BP stations without much "pinging" (but a bit of power loss) , but some of the stuff coming out of pumps identified as "BP premium unleaded", "Shell premium unleaded" and the "Mobil premium unleaded" from small country and suburban petrol stations has been about as good as running on heating kerosene in a 505sLi!

    Maybe the poor bloke got caught out this way too. ( I should add, that "premium unleaded" purchased from some independent operators has been fine too. Its just that I've now been caught too often to risk it unless i know the dealer.)

    Cheers

    Rod

    <small>[ 15 January 2003, 03:58 PM: Message edited by: Rod Hagen ]</small>
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  10. #10
    rek
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    I buy fill up with BP Ultimate nowadays. It's cheaper than the other 98RON fuels, and better refined too (well at least it causes less pollutants or what have you.) Win-win.

    About a year ago, I did a few little tests, and found that the added economy of 98RON fuel vs. 95RON made it cheaper in the long run, even if you collect those supermarket fuel discount thingys.

    I fill up on or about the cheapest part of the petrol-cycle, even if I've only used a quarter of the tank in the past week.

    Guessing the right day to fill up is sort of like a pathetic imitation of F1 pit-stop strategy (insert unrealistic dream sequence of a 306 getting fueled up at Albert Park etc. wink )
    Peter
    2008 Saab 9-3 1.9 TiD Sportcombi
    2011 Volvo C30 DRIVe 1.6D

  11. #11
    1000+ Posts Rod Hagen's Avatar
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    rek:
    I buy fill up with BP Ultimate nowadays. It's cheaper than the other 98RON fuels, and better refined too (well at least it causes less pollutants or what have you.) Win-win
    Price seems to vary a fair bit from station to staion, rek. I've seen 'Vortex" at lower prices than "Ultimate" on some occasions, for example. Optimax does tend to be a little dearer most of the time though, at least in the stations I regularly frequent.

    My best deal locally involves a BP station immediately over the road from a 'Safeway" outlet. Its still dearer in absolute terms than the "Safeway" PULP though, especially if you have a 4 cent discount docket. On average, with the docket, probably around 6 cents per litre difference. If cost was the only factor, to make up for the price difference I'd need to be getting another 30k's per tank using the 98 octane instead of the 95. In fact my estimate is that I probably only get around 5 to 10 k's more on average. Like you, though, I still usually buy the 98.

    Cheers

    Rod
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  12. #12
    rek
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    Rod Hagen
    Price seems to vary a fair bit from station to staion, rek. I've seen 'Vortex" at lower prices than "Ultimate" on some occasions, for example. Optimax does tend to be a little dearer most of the time though, at least in the stations I regularly frequent.
    Sorry, I forgot to clarify -- I meant "cheaper" in terms of the added price over standard ULP. BP typically costs 7c/l more than ULP, Shell and Mobil (in my experience) is closer to 8.5-9.5c/l (it seems to vary a bit from servo to servo, and week by week.)

    On average, with the docket, probably around 6 cents per litre difference. If cost was the only factor, to make up for the price difference I'd need to be getting another 30k's per tank using the 98 octane instead of the 95. In fact my estimate is that I probably only get around 5 to 10 k's more on average. Like you, though, I still usually buy the 98.
    In the GTi6, I found I got ~50-60km extra to a tank using the 98 RON stuff (over 95.) The extra benefit I presume is because it has a knock sensor and all the other techo stuff to optimise the engine's operation to the fuel.

    In any case, you're getting a higher quality fuel with the 98; so as you say, even if the savings are negligible you may as well get the 98 anyway.
    Peter
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    2011 Volvo C30 DRIVe 1.6D

  13. #13
    1000+ Posts Rod Hagen's Avatar
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    The extra benefit I presume is because it has a knock sensor and all the other techo stuff to optimise the engine's operation to the fuel.
    Yes. Given that I'm getting a small , but still significant, mileage benefit in the sLi I would imagine that a GTi6 could well end up in front, even on the cost question.

    Cheers

    Rod
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  14. #14
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
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    i use mainly BP ultimate and then will use optimax if bp isn't close.
    i also use Mobil 8000 sometimes, but its the least effective, i did find though that good servicing and good oil also contribute to the S16's characteristics, (specially that darn flat spot at about 3100 rpm,lol).
    But its BP and Nulon Octane booster when im gonna go hard, just to be on the safe side, even thouh i know that without tuning for the higher octane fuel (ie avgas 115 Ron), there is no major power gain, i would like to use this when we get/go down to wakefield, just to avoid any detonation when fanning (which if its anything like our sydney cruise there will be plenty of that). hopefully all other egine mods will be done by then. Must bring some spare NGK's just in case i foul a plug,lol.
    Xq

    ps, as for the gti-6 owner, i would most likely associate that fuel stunt with BMW owners, as my mate who's a huge bm fan says, the biggest problem with BMW's is that most are owned by Jonses who should have bought a camry!lol
    We know of a 46 M3 running on "wat ever is cheapest", oh dear.
    ... ptui!

  15. #15
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    I've done it again Created a nice long thread.. Thanks guys greenblood..you there?

    Incidentally, I run my car on Shell Optimax almost 100% of the time. Last year in country NSW and far western Victoria I had a few instances of filling up with 'Premium Unleaded' where my car did ping occasionally.

    I do know my car hasn't been a fan of the Caltex Vortex at the servo that we run our business account at, which is a pain! (no free fuel for me..)

    Derek.

  16. #16
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    [quote/]

    "just to be on the safe side, even thouh i know that without tuning for the higher octane fuel (ie avgas 115 Ron),"

    In case you're unaware; tread a bit gentle on that one as my understanding is that it's leaded...this being the case, if used in an unleaded car you'll probably poison the Kat (cat sp?) If you get caught using it for anything other than competition you may also be in the pooh with the 'powers that be' mallet

    Alan S wink
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  17. #17
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
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    <span><span class=ResizableText0>
    Originally</span> posted by Alan S: <span class=ResizableText0><strong>[quote/]</span> <span class=ResizableText0>"just</span>
    to be on the safe side, even thouh i know that without tuning for the higher octane fuel (ie avgas 115 <span class=ResizableText0>Ron),"</span> In case you're unaware; tread a bit gentle on that one as my <span class=ResizableText0>understanding</span> is that it's <span class=ResizableText0>leaded...this</span> being the case, if used in an unleaded car you'll probably poison the Kat (cat sp?) If you get caught using it for anything other than <span class=ResizableText0>competition</span> you may also be in the pooh with the 'powers that be' mallet Alan S <span class=ResizableText0> wink
    </span>
    </span>
    Yeah sorry alan, your right i was supposed to write Elf/ C16 fuel, but coz the term avgas has become so common i just tend to use that term all the time.
    AUTHORITIES!!???, obviuosly you've never seen/read about my car, Deka and the sydney boys have, so they all know too well that ill have several issues with the athorities (spell?), let alone Catalitist Converter issues, lol. but its mre of the lead contaminatio that worries me. Cheers
    Xq,
    ps, interested parties on the trac day at wakefield? please read sydney cruise post.
    ... ptui!

  18. #18
    nJm
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    Ok, well I'll be the first person to reply to this thread who has a pre '86 car and this funny ol' thingy called a carbie clown

    Last year the GR was run exclusively on Optimax, however that was when my father was driving it (and paying for petrol). Since the start of this year I've been running half half LRP and 98RON. As long as the LRP comes from somewhere reasonable (BP is usually ok), it runs fine. On Optimax it does go a bit harder and runs more fuel efficiently, but it also blows more smoke (must be those cleaning agents in the Optimax). No matter what I use though, I put in a squirt of Flashlube. Even if I don't strictly need a valve lubricant in my March 1982 build 505, it seems to make the car run better.

    Oh well, just my 2.2c

    Incidently, in Melb I tend to fill up on a Wednesday or Thursday as it is usually cheaper.
    Nick
    1983 Peugeot 505 GR


    "All of its cars from the 1.1 litre 205 through the ugly duckling 309 to the 2.2 litre 505 GTi had a rightness and a righteousness about them that turned every humdrum drive into a journey. Someone, I once wrote, in the bowels of Peugeot understands handling and how a chassis should feel." - Jeremy Clarkson

  19. #19
    Sense Pug307's Avatar
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    ...and statistically, it is cheapest in Melbourne on a Thursday!

    Peugeot 307 XS 1.6
    Aussiefrogged in MEL, PER, SYD, BNE & ADL.
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  20. #20
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    I run the R12 on BP Ultimate, a shot of Redline and three degrees more ignition advance. It's like a different car than when using plain ULP. Therefore, recommended for old bangers too...

    Stuey


    2003 PEUGEOT 206 GTi

  21. #21
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    Just to throw in my 2c worth, I always run the car on Optimax (although after reading some of the earlier posts in this list, I might give the BP fuel a go). I have certainly found that the quality differs between stations, and that it deteriorates in the tank quite quickly. However, 95RON was absolutely awful.

    Despite this, the car still pings - to the extent that last time I had it serviced the guy knocked the timing back 2 degrees, which didn't sound much but I have been assured that it is, in fact, quite a lot. Car still runs fine, and still pings... but a lot less.

    Just as an aside, I too have driven past other peugeot 306s, only to hear the most awful pinging. I suspect that the average car buyer doesn't necessarily know that it isn't supposed to sound like that... they probably think it's because it's french!

    penelope_s

  22. #22
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    What does pinging sound like exactly? Anyone got a sound clip?
    - Lincoln

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  23. #23
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    it sounds like a little rattle when the car is under load
    or a bit like a ticking sound
    but only under load will you hear this sound
    putting it laymans terms
    it's like having a little man in the cylinder with a hammer hitting the piston untill finally he breaks through
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x '98 306 GTi6

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0


    WTD long range fuel tank for 605

  24. #24
    rek
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    GTI124:
    What does pinging sound like exactly? Anyone got a sound clip?
    It sounds kind of half-way between the ticking of a geiger counter, and marbles being rattled about in a tin can.

    Next time you're at a pedestrian intersection, listen to the cars as they take off from the stop light. A fair few cars seem to ping lightly on initial acceleration.
    Peter
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  25. #25
    1000+ Posts tekkie's Avatar
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    I've been using Optimax when I 1st got the car almost religiously but have soon taken to writing my km's down as the Shell seems to be inconsistent even from the same station.

    Mobil likewise can give phenomenal milage but equally awful one. One constant seems to be Caltex. Crappy milage and pinging every time I have filled it up especially in country areas.

    BP seems to be the most consistant so far. And prices seem to be the most fair as well. Go well go BP.

    btw, the best milage around town I got was from Mobil in Hornsby (as u leave the freeway going towards city). It seems to be a bit of a lucky dip ... get it.. dip - into a fuel tank... get it.. eh... ahh .. better keep my current job.
    wink

    <small>[ 16 January 2003, 06:20 PM: Message edited by: tekkie ]</small>
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