Track Day Questions???
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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! WRCPUG's Avatar
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    Track Day Questions???

    Im very keen on going up to a Track day at Philip Island on the 8-9th November.

    I have done a track day once before in my Mitsu GTO but never taken the pug to the track.

    I know alot of you have done track days in your pugs and i know CHRIS16 is a track day nutter so any advice u give me would be much appreciated.

    I am going to go buy sum tyres for my 15" GTi6 rims. What do u guys recommend? I dont really want semi comps as i cant really afford them ATM.

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    I was thinking about getting some 2nd hand tyres but more sticky compound. I know that the tyres will be destroyed after this track day soi dont want to waste like $600 in one weekend.

    Should i upgrade to semi race brake pads? Is brake fade bad in the GTi6? I know that in the GTO it was horrible.....i really should of had race pads.

    Any reliabilty idssues with pugs on the track? I really dont want to damage the running gear in any way. I will service the car with new oil before the meet. I just put Castrol Systrax gear box oil in last week.

    Any other helpful tipd, advice warnings would be greatly appreciated.
    PEUGEOT 306 GTi6 (1997-1999 HYBRID)
    105.4kw (141HP) ATW
    2:09 Phillip Island (Toyo Street Tyres)

    2001 YAMAHA YZF-R6
    119HP

    1993 MITSUBISHI 3000GT Twin Turbo
    300BHP
    STOCK-14.006 @97.4mph HEATHCOTE
    STOCK-1:15 CALDER Long Circuit (Stock Street Tyres + Stock Pads :banghead )
    (For Sale)

  2. #2
    1000+ Posts brenno's Avatar
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    I'm sure the others with much more experience can fill you in, but here goes anyway.

    * Don't under-estimate the importance of cool down laps.

    * First time at a track? Forget timing anything early on. Pace yourself. It takes ages to understand corners and get the lines right.

    * Call a few race workshops around the place and see if they have some spare/old 15" slicks lying about the place. They might have some that have been heat cycled too many times so are useless for competition but are OK for mucking around on. 195/55 15 is a pretty common size. As a suggestion, call one of the GTP teams that ran DC2R's.

    * I didn't find brake fade to be an issue, but brake wear is. Don't be surprised if you munch a set of rotors, but it depends how hard you brake, and the cool-down laps.

    * Reliability? I broke an engine mount at every track day I went to. Esscargo reckons that they broke them so much it became part of the budget. I'd recommend not hopping over the ripple strips, as I felt that was putting a lot of stress on the mounts. GTi6's may have stronger mounts, but I really don't know. Apart from that, and the brakes....nothing went wrong with my car.

    * Have fun, it's bloody addictive (and expensive)

  3. #3
    1000+ Posts tekkie's Avatar
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    to add to what Brenno said:

    1. limit your laps to about 3 hot laps (upto 5 for smaller tracks) + cooldown lap at 3/4 pace. Likewise warmup 1/2 lap to get used to cold tyres and cold brakes is a must.

    2. any set of tyres you can get your hands on. Toyo Proxes arent tha expensive, expect front tyres to wear more so maybe buy 2 semi slicks this time around.

    3. dot4+ brake fluid is a must. expect to have to bleed it afterwards as the pedal may become spongy. purple/blue rotors means you are pushing it and prob having fun.

    4. take everything loose out of the car before going out on track

    5. wear long sleeved stuff that doesnt burn. Cotton is good. Dont skimp on safety gear. Buy best melon protector you can afford!

    6. drive within your limits and limits of your car.

    7. check oil level, water level, brake fluid level periodically

    8. DO NOT use handbrake until you get home. DO NOT sit on hot brakes locked when you come in, let the brakes cool off without pads touching.

    9. use mirrors, let others through, and enjoy the day. Remember you want to drive home, not be driven home. wink

    ENJOY. Cheers
    Voytek
    .
    1300cc's of jap buzzbox delivered the times below.

    EC 1:54.6 , Wakefield 1:13.15 , OP (short) 52.00 , OP GP 1:24.40


  4. #4
    1000+ Posts Damien Gardner's Avatar
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    The only additions i'll add, is please fit a 2kg fire extinguisher. Preferably within reach whilst still buckled into the seat belt.
    Look for one with 2002 or 2003 date stamp as in a road registered car CAMS deem them to have a 6 yr life, it's only 3 i think for my race car.

    If the bonnet lifts from the front an occy strap as a safety measure is also required.
    Cheers.
    Health and good fortune always,
    Damien.

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  5. #5
    1000+ Posts alan moore's Avatar
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    I did 40 laps of the Willowbank long circuit (about 140Km) in my 306 on standard Continental EcoContact tyres, and took maybe 1/4 of the life out of them. Tyre wear is not that big of a worry. I had 46 psi F 36psi R. Brakes though are, and I would recommend the EBC greenstuff pads as a good compromise, just for the front. On the long circuit there are four long straights and even with their very superior speed, two E46 M3s were only seven seconds a lap faster. So enjoy the great handling and verve of your 306.
    '56 Renault 750 (16TS Power)
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  6. #6
    Cal
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    I just bought a set of Silverstone semi slicks in 195/50/15. They were $200ea. Much cheaper than the other choices available. I will do my first track day on them on Saturday. I had been on normal street tyres until now. I am spinning the back wheels quite a lot and I got about 6 track days, two tarmac rallies, a motorkana and another few thousand roads kms out of the rears. They would do that again on the front. If I was smoother, they would last even longer.

    I change my brake fluid after every track day.

    Just pay attention to the faster cars around you and let them through if they are catching you quickly.

    Have fun,

    Cal.
    1995 Mazda MX5 - 2F Race Car
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  7. #7
    Fellow Frogger! WRCPUG's Avatar
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    Thanks for the help guys but some are already taken care of.
    To be eligable to race I need
    -0.9kg Fire Extinguisher
    -Full non flamable clothing
    -Bonnet Strap
    -Approved Hemet
    -Cams Lv 2 License
    -Cams Affiliated car club membership (im joining Alfa Club)

    I know about the hand brake thing from the last track day i did at Calder and i am very warey of brake fades and cool down laps

    Umm the day has sessions...each sesion has 4 laps...1 warm up lap and 3 flying laps. I will be taking it easy to determine braking markers and turn in points and racing lines until i get confident in the car i wont be pushing too hard.

    The saturday has instructors they will take me around the track. Saturday is NOT timed.

    Sunday is the race day...alot of ppl and cars and the laps are timed. So ill be taking it easy i dont wanna hold anyone up.
    PEUGEOT 306 GTi6 (1997-1999 HYBRID)
    105.4kw (141HP) ATW
    2:09 Phillip Island (Toyo Street Tyres)

    2001 YAMAHA YZF-R6
    119HP

    1993 MITSUBISHI 3000GT Twin Turbo
    300BHP
    STOCK-14.006 @97.4mph HEATHCOTE
    STOCK-1:15 CALDER Long Circuit (Stock Street Tyres + Stock Pads :banghead )
    (For Sale)

  8. #8
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
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    ..... i don't know if i can add anything. The boys here have served you well.

    *As Tekkie said,(you can do it at the track) REMOVE; jack & brace, spare tyre( do up the bolt ALL the way on the spares cradle), all mats, and cable-tie down or click them in place your rear seat belts ive seen them wave about and break a side window.., any interior items, including all glove box contents as you don't need any distractions even minor ones. Remove the EOM battery cover and x3 check the battery is in snug and terminals all good.
    Id remove the leather surround on the gear stick,... im being picky, but it all helps, if you have a stereo, REMOVE what you can (ie sub etc) including the actual FACE if its detachable face. Remove all head-rests (except yours). The fule cap trim (small black piece, ive lost x2 at the track), replace with AF sticker.
    * BOLT down the extinguisher, id use the front seat bolts.
    *Top up fluids if need be, check oil and coolant when COLD that morning. Double check your fuel cap is on tightly, you will get knabed for this quick smart.
    *Just what ive heard about Phillip Island, the 1st hi-speed sweeper at the bottom of the main straight can catch you out as the car gets a little light there. The up and over the crest heading back is also a heavy break point, so as Brenno suggested, learn what gear to be in and look fo braking markers you can refrence off so you keep it consistent.
    * With some red electrical tape put a neat VISIBLE marker at the point you want to UP-shift, over your tacho. If you kept the factory limit, id change at about 6900 rpm, a little marker will help you look for that much less time.
    * Also make sure you have enough fuel, no less than 1/2 tank, it could dry out your pump and it could cook over...
    * As for tyres, just about anything will do, if you use something rufly about 195/55/15, i recommend "COLD" settings at 36 PSI at front and 34PSI at rear, use a guage and get it right.
    * If you see a "checkered" or "RED" flag come in to pit, you don't want to get the stewarsd PO'd your first time out. Check with you club, exactly how they run events.
    *Wear good comfy sturdy shoes, one you can feel the pedals.
    * i like using race gloves, but thats not really important.
    * Clean your steering wheel using a chamois, it can get very exciting your first time out and sweaty hands could have you slip up on the steering wheel...
    Good luck - chris

    <small>[ 14 October 2003, 05:15 PM: Message edited by: CHRI'S16 ]</small>
    ... ptui!

  9. #9
    Fellow Frogger! jfn180's Avatar
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    you have 2 do a track day i did my first track day 2moths ago and it was so much fun,i had a big smile on my face ,its just so good to see how good the pugs go around its the best and aslo haveing people their that can help you just like tekkie and chirs did for me makes the day that much better
    97`black 306 style sold JFN 306
    04 Black 206 GTI 180 JFN 180 FOR SALE
    I HATE V8 LANDCRUISERS


    WEST TIGERS= PREMIERS 05

  10. #10
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
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    97`black 306 style(new car maybe in the books)

    Johny, a new car aye? what you looking at? - chris

    <small>[ 14 October 2003, 06:12 PM: Message edited by: CHRI'S16 ]</small>
    ... ptui!

  11. #11
    Fellow Frogger! jfn180's Avatar
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    looking at a few cars citroen_ peugeot_ renault_ and a few others but nothing has cought my eye so it maybe a few more months
    97`black 306 style sold JFN 306
    04 Black 206 GTI 180 JFN 180 FOR SALE
    I HATE V8 LANDCRUISERS


    WEST TIGERS= PREMIERS 05

  12. #12
    1000+ Posts Warwick's Avatar
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    Bleed the brakes before you go. This is a must.
    "Now my dream lies shattered like the shards of a broken dream"

  13. #13
    Fellow Frogger! WRCPUG's Avatar
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    Thanks heaps guys ill note down alot of these.
    Im gonna remove the rear seats and parcel shelf.

    The space tyre is going to stay in the pits too.
    I will remove any loose items too...i dont like things fying about. Ive got nice soft shoes that feel like im wearing socks...they really help throttle control.

    Umm only one question...is removing all this weight from the rear of the 306 (jack, spare tyre, seat, parcel shelf ect) is that going to make the car alot more tail end happy and twicthy?

    Or is it negligable? I abit of lift off oversteer could be a bit of fun though hehe

    But thanks again..i cant wait for this event. Alot of hondas are going to be there.....my friend with the Prelude convinced me to come down. He pulled a 2.06 around PI...hopefully i can come close to that

    Ps- If anyone in Melbourne is interested in this event let me know...its an open track day. Id love to have some more Frenchies along to stick it up those overconfident honda drivers hehe
    PEUGEOT 306 GTi6 (1997-1999 HYBRID)
    105.4kw (141HP) ATW
    2:09 Phillip Island (Toyo Street Tyres)

    2001 YAMAHA YZF-R6
    119HP

    1993 MITSUBISHI 3000GT Twin Turbo
    300BHP
    STOCK-14.006 @97.4mph HEATHCOTE
    STOCK-1:15 CALDER Long Circuit (Stock Street Tyres + Stock Pads :banghead )
    (For Sale)

  14. #14
    Fellow Frogger! WRX2PUG's Avatar
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    I think the guys have done a great job listing items - so nothing key to add other than pace yourself and you'll have lots of fun

    Only other thing I would suggest is that if you do land up getting some nice new R-spec tyres, take the time to bed them in a little if possible before your track-day. Also I'd recommend having a look at them after each set of laps and alter tyre-pressures (and driving style perhaps) accordingly - this can make the difference between minimal/reasonable tyre wear and eating a set of R-specs (which I did at my first track-day a few years ago).

    Have fun
    Steve
    Renault Clio F1R27 road car and Supercharged Lotus Elise track car

  15. #15
    XTC
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    DON'T tell your insurance company ... taking a car on track days when they are timed, voids your insurance ... and possibly voids certain parts of your insurance from then on (believe it or not) ... driver training days - which are not timed are usually OK, but they may increase your premium (as certain insurance companies now put you at a higher risk - rather then a lower one)

    - XTC206 -
    You're not fooling everyone, or did you forget? .......




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  16. #16
    Cal
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    Many cars are written off just down the road for race tracks. wink

    Cal.
    1995 Mazda MX5 - 2F Race Car
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    1977 Jaguar XJS V12
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  17. #17
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    WRCPUG:
    But thanks again..i cant wait for this event. Alot of hondas are going to be there.....my friend with the Prelude convinced me to come down. He pulled a 2.06 around PI...hopefully i can come close to that

    Ps- If anyone in Melbourne is interested in this event let me know...its an open track day. Id love to have some more Frenchies along to stick it up those overconfident honda drivers hehe
    2.06 is a pretty good time. Is your friend's Prelude modified? My best is a 2.07 in the Clio Sport on standard tyres and no engine mods.

    Are entries still open for this event? Who is organising it? How much? Do you have any more info? I am interested, but I have an exam 2 days later which I probably should be studying for....

    Dave

  18. #18
    Fellow Frogger! nchandler's Avatar
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    I'm so very tempted. I mean, the Ovlov is no track beast, but I finish exams on the 5th, and then I've got till the 15th to clear out of Melbourne. What sort of $$$ are we talking?

    Nick

  19. #19
    Fellow Frogger! WRCPUG's Avatar
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    2.06 is a pretty good time. Is your friend's Prelude modified? My best is a 2.07 in the Clio Sport on standard tyres and no engine mods.
    Yeah hes done like 6 track days before...he had Unichip, 2.5 Inch Exhaust, Mugen Copy Extractors and CAI.

    I think he ran that time on stockish suspension on street tyres. He now has full Tein Coilver Suspension.

    Ohhhh a Clio...please come down I need more froggies to combat these Honda poofs.

    Ahh exams...i know wat u mean..im doing all my work this week hopefully i can have 1 week to prepare for the track day then i got my final year exhibition on the 17th Nov

    Ahh the stress of final year uni...I hate it.

    Here are the details....(they have been copied from another forums)

    Please if u have any questions PM me but remind me u have PM me cause i dont check PM much.

    -------------------------------------------------

    Phillip Island Track day November 8 & 9th 2003
    here is a map of phillip island circuit
    <a href="http://members.optushome.com.au/vtk94lude/pi/pi.gif" target="_blank">http://members.optushome.com.au/vtk94lude/pi/pi.gif</a>

    Things required:
    -CAMS Level 2s licence $91 (12 month licence)
    -Car club membership.
    -either $90 or $100 track fee
    -0.9kg fire extinguisher, must be brand new or refilled by an approved place( i think fire stations/CFA do this).
    -you must wear non-flamable clothing.
    -HELMET, must be an approved helmet.
    -Vechile requirements: vechile must be in satisfactory condition, meaning road worthy to a certain extent.
    -Bonnet strap.
    -Recommendations: i will post info on what i recommend u have (performance wise) before attendeding such an event.

    -Phillip Island is a CAMS L2s event, to qualifiy for a licence, u have to be a sik cvnt and pay up $91 (thats it). and You

    receive your licence:
    Here is a form that u can fill out now or wait till the day.
    <a href="http://cams.com.au/downloads/competitors/2003/Level2SLicenceApplication.PDF" target="_blank">http://cams.com.au/downloads/competitors/2003/Level2SLicenceApplication.PDF</a>

    -Car club Membership:
    Must be a memebership with a 'CAMS affiliated club', such as WRX club/Holden car club/Honda sports car club/PIARC $55 (6month membership, this one u can purchase on the day).
    <a href="http://cams.com.au/content.asp?PageID=Clubs" target="_blank">http://cams.com.au/content.asp?PageID=Clubs</a>

    - Fire extinguisher:
    an extinguider or 0.9kg minium rating is required, these can be pruchased from Kmart $45 roughly, or bunnings etc.
    the fire Etx. must be fitted securely in a location thats in reach of you, such as the passenger foot well. i will post a picture of the location of my Ext tonight. (NOTE: BCF/Halon extinguishers are illegal)

    - Clothing:
    Clothing that will protect the skin from flame from neck to wrist to ankles (i.e. long woolen jumper, long trousers or slacks, suitable shoes and socks).

    -Helmet:
    Because we are in a vechile with a roof, you are permitted to have an open face helmet.
    Only Australian standard approved helments are permitted. MUST have a sticker on it "Australian Standard AS 1698" if no sticker you won't qualify.
    If you already have a Helmet, you must make sure it has NO CHIPS & NO SCRATCHS. they are very strict with this.

    -Vechile Requirements:
    Cars must be in a presentable and roadworthy condition, meaning Tyres must be in good condition, i recommend some decent

    tyres as well. no oil leaks, battery secured properly, they dont care how high off the fground your car is, or if yoru car is a xmas tree, as long as those lights arn't on when racing its fine. EVERYTHING must be secured, your spare wheel must be revmoved, along with any subs/amps in yoru boot, and the cables must be securely straped together to prevent them from floating around the boot. EVERYTHING in your glove box, arm rest and inside the car must be removed, incase of an accident, you dont want something to fly up and hit u. theres a few other things here and there. but u get the drift.

    -Whell steel Valve caps:
    just goto autobarn/burons/repco, purchase some metal vavle caps. these will cost maxium $6, if your paying anymore your jsut wasting your money as they all do the same job. try avoid the bullet shaped valve caps, get something thats more practical such as these which i have on my car (DO NOT STEAL MINE )
    <a href="http://members.optushome.com.au/vtk94lude/misc/valve.jpg" target="_blank">http://members.optushome.com.au/vtk94lude/misc/valve.jpg</a>

    -Bonnet Strap.
    strong peice of string or a strap, to tie the bonnet down, ( i will take a picutre of my strap)
    Just a rope that ties the bonnet hook thing to your body, incase it comes undone when yoru doing excessive speeds.

    Entry form for Phillip Islands June sprints, you might like to read through it to get some specific information to the event.
    <a href="http://www.piarc.com.au/June%2003%20Sprint%20PM6.5.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.piarc.com.au/June%2003%20Sprint%20PM6.5.pdf</a>
    Saturday 2nd: in a non-timed event, driver instructors available (free, and Recomended for first timers without a doubt)
    Sunday 3rd: is a timed event, so many cars will be going full on. and no instructors available

    *EDIT* added to checklist.
    -Recommendations:
    -Bring at least 1 Litre of oil (you can purchase 1 litre form the mobil we will stop at on the way (roughly $15 for mobile 1, 5w-50)
    - bring any tools you need for your car, IE 10/12/17/19 sockets etc. you must come prepared incase something 'may' go wrong. ( we will have a few people there to help u out if u have a problem, but u need some tools)
    - at least 10L JerryCan for fuel incase u run out (saves you going to a petrol station when u in need of fuel)

    As someone has mentioned, THERE IS NO INSURANCE if u write your car off your ***'t!. So this is a risk your willing to take. There are serveral saftey measures that are taken, all cars will be scrutinized before they are permitted onto the track. IN NO WAY are you able to take shortcuts, SAFETY first at all times of the day.

    For those that dont have a helmet and are planning to purchase one. Remember one thing, the price of a helmet is nothing compared to your head. Consider getting a decent helmet from any motorbike shop.

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    If there are any questions, please PM me or
    e-mail: [email protected]
    Mob: 0412760076

    I hope we have all have a safe and fun day(s) at phillip island. hope to see all you cvnts there.
    PEUGEOT 306 GTi6 (1997-1999 HYBRID)
    105.4kw (141HP) ATW
    2:09 Phillip Island (Toyo Street Tyres)

    2001 YAMAHA YZF-R6
    119HP

    1993 MITSUBISHI 3000GT Twin Turbo
    300BHP
    STOCK-14.006 @97.4mph HEATHCOTE
    STOCK-1:15 CALDER Long Circuit (Stock Street Tyres + Stock Pads :banghead )
    (For Sale)

  20. #20
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    Sounds good. Do you have a current entry form for this event? When do entries close?

    I would probably just go on the Sunday as I have already driven on the track before. That way I can spend Saturday studying for my exam.

    Dave

  21. #21
    Fellow Frogger! WRCPUG's Avatar
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    Umm i dont have an entry form ATM...i will go to the place to pay the money sumtime next week (when uni is finished)

    I hope i can get a set of 15: tyres in time for the event...i really ont want to run with 17"s

    It would be great if u come down...need more Euros and 2.07 is a very good time for a stock Clio. Should keep those Type R drivers mouth shut
    PEUGEOT 306 GTi6 (1997-1999 HYBRID)
    105.4kw (141HP) ATW
    2:09 Phillip Island (Toyo Street Tyres)

    2001 YAMAHA YZF-R6
    119HP

    1993 MITSUBISHI 3000GT Twin Turbo
    300BHP
    STOCK-14.006 @97.4mph HEATHCOTE
    STOCK-1:15 CALDER Long Circuit (Stock Street Tyres + Stock Pads :banghead )
    (For Sale)

  22. #22
    1000+ Posts purrr-geot's Avatar
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    Thats it Alex stick that vtec crap up em!!
    All the best bro!!

  23. #23
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    Alex, I don't think I will be able to make it to Philip Island at this stage. Hopefully next time....

    As I mentioned to you the other night, a few of us from the 206GTi.net forum will be going for a drive tomorrow morning (Melbourne Cup day) if you want to come along. We will be heading out to the Marysville area where there are some really good driving roads.

    We are meeting at the BP service station on St Kilda esplanade at 10.30 tomorrow morning. Just turn up if you want to join us. My number is 0411 090 697 if you need to contact me before then.

    Hope to see you there.

    David

  24. #24
    Fellow Frogger! WRCPUG's Avatar
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    Thanks Dave it was good to meet u the other night hopefully we can have another run soon hehe

    Ummm i wont be able to make it tommorow unfortunately its my brothers birthday so i have to spend time with the family
    Sorry hopefully we can go for a drive soon enough though

    Good luck with ur exams
    PEUGEOT 306 GTi6 (1997-1999 HYBRID)
    105.4kw (141HP) ATW
    2:09 Phillip Island (Toyo Street Tyres)

    2001 YAMAHA YZF-R6
    119HP

    1993 MITSUBISHI 3000GT Twin Turbo
    300BHP
    STOCK-14.006 @97.4mph HEATHCOTE
    STOCK-1:15 CALDER Long Circuit (Stock Street Tyres + Stock Pads :banghead )
    (For Sale)

  25. #25
    1000+ Posts Damien Gardner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Wendouree Vic. Aust
    Posts
    2,436
    Just a point to note with Fire extinguishers, regarding mounting them, CAMS have ammended the rules. The straps that hold the extinguisher into it's holder must now be of steel construction not Plastic as is usual with modern equip.
    cheers!
    Health and good fortune always,
    Damien.

    We rode on the winds of the rising storm,
    We ran to the sounds of thunder.
    We danced among the lightning bolts,
    and tore the R10's assfromunder.

    Robert Jordan & memyself&I

    1/48th Scale Alpine A310,
    N-scale 1/160th Renault & Citroen, Advert. Signs & Billboards

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