OT - Calling those Electrically minded.
  • Register
  • Help
Page 1 of 2 12 Last
Results 1 to 25 of 28
  1. #1
    XTC
    XTC is offline
    VIC: a fine driving state XTC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Location Location Location
    Posts
    8,566

    OT - Calling those Electrically minded.

    OK .. looking for help / advice.

    First of all, does anyone have some documentation (web site locations) where I can find instructions on how to properly make my own 8-10 way star wired 240 volt distribution power board/block ?

    And secondly ... electricians snakes (the plastic flexible things for putting cables in wall and floor cavities), where can one find one of these ? (without getting charged like a wounded bull) - checked everything from Farnell and came up blank.

    Many thanx in advance.

    Advertisement


    - XTC206 -
    You're not fooling everyone, or did you forget? .......




    '02 Peugeot 206 GTi / '07 VW Golf GTI
    Now this is a .sig
    AF'd in PER, MEL, SYD, ADL, CBR

  2. #2
    1000+ Posts silverexec's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Melbourne, Victoria
    Posts
    1,001
    XTC206:
    And secondly ... electricians snakes (the plastic flexible things for putting cables in wall and floor cavities), where can one find one of these ? (without getting charged like a wounded bull) - checked everything from Farnell and came up blank.
    I don't know what stores you'd have up in "Sandgroper Country" but have you tried some of the electrical wholesaler places like <a href="http://www.middendorp.com.au/" target="_blank">Middendorp Electrical</a> (Middy's - big pink coloured buildings) or <a href="http://www.norcab.com.au/" target="_blank">Norcab Electrical</a>.

    I believe they sell direct to public and for reasonable prices.

    Cheers,
    Richard
    - Richard

    Now: 405 SRI D70 '93
    - 2.0L manual
    Earlier: 505 GTi Executive '85
    - hence "Silver Exec"...
    25 GTX '86
    - manual conversion

  3. #3
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    3,298
    XTC206:
    OK .. looking for help / advice.

    First of all, does anyone have some documentation (web site locations) where I can find instructions on how to properly make my own 8-10 way star wired 240 volt distribution power board/block ?

    And secondly ... electricians snakes (the plastic flexible things for putting cables in wall and floor cavities), where can one find one of these ? (without getting charged like a wounded bull) - checked everything from Farnell and came up blank.

    Many thanx in advance.

    - XTC206 -
    XTC, ill start with im a electrician by trade...
    When you say 8-10 star wired board, 99.99% of the time STAR wiring is only for 3 phase power which measured as 415Volts 3phase 20amps or more!!!, for really big things such as big Refrogeration/AirCon items etc.
    Ill assume this is for Household use, and you are looking for LOTS of outlets on 1 board? correct?
    To make one with 8-10 outlets you MUST consider what you will plug in, read the electrical label on EVERY item and you are looking for the amperage (amps-current) that the item draws, then add them all up.
    If the total is MORE than 10 amps, then you run a major FIRE/ELECTRICAL fire happening, which if your insurance company find eveidence of will VOID YOUR INSURANCE!!!!!!!! eek! eek! !!!! so be CAREFUL!!!! as you will be found liable!!.

    But to make one will cost $$$$$$, you are looking at CLipsal products, on a 1.5mm extention cord, Heavy Duty plug, x10 GPO ( GPO is a oultet) x10 MOUNTING boxes and x3meters of 1.5mm Building wire in RED, Black, and Green/Yellow. Honestly you are up to $60-$70 bucks alone just in parts, plus GST, all items are From electrical wholesalers.

    Next the plastic snakes! .. are called Conduit, in general come in diameters of 16mm, 20mm(most common), 25mm, 32mm >>>> and so on. The stiff stuff is called Rigid Conduit, and comes in 4meter lengths, the floppy stuff is called Coregated Conduit and both can be Normal and Heavy Duty, etc.... and the floppy stuff comes in rolls, all again at ANY good Electrical Wholesalers. Also i don't know were you plan to use it, but as a good GENERAL rule, for engine bays the black floppy ones are ussually more heat resistant, but ask first!!! explain what you need to do with the stuff and they will help, also think about how you will fasten/hold it to the wall or whatever... they have special clips/saddles/cable-ties for this too... so much stuff...
    Here in NSW, we have Turk and Sons Electrical, TLE electrical, Salamon Bros electrical etc...

    As for the power board Dick Smith and Jaycar both sell about 6 and 8 outlet power boards for about 30-50 bucks, and ussualy come with a built in Over-Current protector too. Which is needed to meet ARR and AC rules.
    This is a much better option, BUT!!!!!!!!!!! again as above think about HOW MUCH AMPS/CURRENT your item will soak up, as near or above 10 amps the flexible lead and plug can start to melt and fire up!!!! eek! eek! !!!

    PLEASE OH PLEASE promise me you will be carefull, part of my apprenticeship was a 1 day training course at the Fire Brigade, 1 in 3 home fires are elcetrically related!!!!! eek! ... so don't take risks, if you need to plug in lots of items, think about getting more power points put in by a licensed elctritian, and use as few power boards as possible, and this also applies to extantion cords, they are No1 cause of death/injury on work sites!!!!!!!..

    If you have any more Q's.. please ask!!!!! - chris
    ... ptui!

  4. #4
    Fellow Frogger! AlsPug504's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Posts
    310
    Lawrence & Hanson are also pretty good when it come serious industry eletrics

  5. #5
    Fellow Frogger! Ralph's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Wodonga
    Posts
    928
    Hi all,

    Chris, I think what XTC means by the snakes is the flat, rigid flexible plastic strap you electricians use to poke or pull wires up through wall cavities, roof spaces and anywhere else the apprentice won't fit. I don't know it's official name but you should be able to get them from Middy's or Arlec etc. Perhaps you could tell us what it's called.

    From what I understand most electrically related fatalities in the household are caused by playing with wiring that is live and incorrectly wired extension leads and power cords connected to appliances such as jugs and toasters. People swap the active and neutral and even the earth wire with the other two. A read of the AS3000 may help.

    Cheers,

    Ralph.

    <small>[ 10 October 2003, 06:14 PM: Message edited by: Ralph ]</small>
    On the internet, no one knows that you are only wearing a fez.

  6. #6
    nJm
    nJm is offline
    Guru nJm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    2,930
    After reading Chris' post I peeked under my desk and found coming off a two outlet powerpoint (only one in the room) a 6 outlet powerboard and a 4 outlet power board. The 4 outlet powerboard is running off a double adaptor on the power point, which also has a small extension lead going off to another double adaptor...

    I'm guessing this isn't a great setup? It is always a problem having 2 computers + tv vcr etc in one room.
    Nick
    1983 Peugeot 505 GR


    "All of its cars from the 1.1 litre 205 through the ugly duckling 309 to the 2.2 litre 505 GTi had a rightness and a righteousness about them that turned every humdrum drive into a journey. Someone, I once wrote, in the bowels of Peugeot understands handling and how a chassis should feel." - Jeremy Clarkson

  7. #7
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    3,298
    Ralph:
    Hi all,

    Chris, I think what XTC means by the snakes is the flat, rigid flexible plastic strap you electricians use to poke or pull wires up through wall cavities, roof spaces and anywhere else the apprentice won't fit. I don't know it's official name but you should be able to get them from Middy's or Arlec etc. Perhaps you could tell us what it's called.

    From what I understand most electrically related fatalities in the household are caused by playing with wiring that is live and incorrectly wired extension leads and power cords connected to appliances such as jugs and toasters. People swap the active and neutral and even the earth wire with the other two. A read of the AS3000 may help.

    Cheers,

    Ralph.
    Ok, the snake thing. This is called many things, but some sparkies call it pulling plastic, cable pulling snake etc, its a very common thing to own, i got mine at Turks, and cost about $4 bucks... lol.
    As for fires in home, there is basically 2 types, 1, like you said people playing with electracs, and the other is overloaded power boards and extention leads!... simply put, guys don't prove me right the hard way!!! make me look silly and just have a quick snip in your home, spesh if you got little ones...please .
    Rarely is a fire caused of electrical malpractice, but this happens too....
    FATALITIES, are another story all together, ELECTRICITY KILLSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SIMPLE!!!! , its not worth your life.

    NJM- whip noty boy. please fix your set up, an extra power point, providing you don't live in a double brick on birck/concrete home will cost about $150 bucks by a proper licensed sparky, the cost really varies on how far the cable run is and how hard it is for the sparky.....

    - chris
    ... ptui!

  8. #8
    1000+ Posts
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Location
    Sydney, NSW, Australia
    Posts
    3,617
    I *bet* I know what you need SO many power outlets for wink

    The snakey things are actually the same as the plastic tongue between particleboard flooring. We have (had?) some here which we used for the same purpose. Drill a hole in the end of it to poke the wire through and hey presto wink

    Find a building site where they might be using the large sheets of particleboard flooring (1.2x2.4m I'd say they are) - you always end up with extras.

    Derek.

  9. #9
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Parkes - N.S.W - Australia - Earth
    Posts
    12,256
    you are going to shoot me here but just to run my machine here i have 3x4 outlet power boards and 2-3 double adaptors coming off them from one GPO
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x '98 306 GTi6

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0


    WTD long range fuel tank for 605

  10. #10
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    3,298
    pugrambo:
    you are going to shoot me here but just to run my machine here i have 3x4 outlet power boards and 2-3 double adaptors coming off them from one GPO
    eek! eek! eek! .... holly eek! - chris
    ... ptui!

  11. #11
    XTC
    XTC is offline
    VIC: a fine driving state XTC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Location Location Location
    Posts
    8,566
    OK Chris,

    Firstly I treat electrcity with the greatest of respect - i.e. I don't touch it.

    Other then my passion for Peugeots, it pales in comparison for my passion for Hi-Fi - yes I'm an Audio Geek as well eek! Hey Deka

    Obviously I've had separate power runs from the mains board for my hi-fi - but one still needs power boards .. trouble is .. all of these power boards are cheap made in China stamped off a single sheet of copper, the connecters are not firm and they are wired in such a way that each component can interfere with the draw of the other..

    I have looked = taken apart just about every power board I can find .. they are all crap.

    Then I found these guys.

    <a href="http://www.sat.net.au/" target="_blank">http://www.sat.net.au/</a>

    The website is applauling (pathetic actually) but his products are well put together. They make some well constructed power boards ...

    <a href="http://www.sat.net.au/home8.html" target="_blank">http://www.sat.net.au/home8.html</a>

    But at $500 I can't justify it (not to treasury anyway). Surely it can't be that hard to put together a custom one, propery wired and such. (none of this stamped out copper sheet junk). Even if parts cost more then $100 I'd be happy to put it together with some friendly electrical advice/plans. Hey I'd even pay someone to do it. I already have one of their Triple Pass Power Filters (not on the website but here is a <a href="http://www.sat.net.au/twinpasx.html" target="_blank">link</a> to one of their twin pass jobs - not cheap but worth every cent. But the cost of these distribution boards is a bit rich I think.

    So you can see what I'm trying to do - need help in securing parts (not at retail prices I hope) and a wiring diagram I can understand ... I'm pretty good with a soldering iron.

    Many thanx in advance - XTC206 -
    You're not fooling everyone, or did you forget? .......




    '02 Peugeot 206 GTi / '07 VW Golf GTI
    Now this is a .sig
    AF'd in PER, MEL, SYD, ADL, CBR

  12. #12
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    3,298
    XTC- ok.. i see why.
    Don't worry, i was (and still am) a Car-audiphile.
    And ive experianced excelent home-audio, ever heard of Duntec speakers? and Vestate valve amps, plus Denon Glod line components.. anyway moving on.
    Ok, all i can help you with is how to build a board as any Electrician would, but im not sure how we would match those mega bucks boards for sound. But im quite confident we can get very close....
    Either way, i need to know if you have 3phse power in your home, which id be very suprised if you do.
    One way to reduce 240volt 50hz noise is to make the board on an earthed metal case. So we/you could put all the components on a painted metal plate, which we can earth out from the last power point...
    As for wiring use 8guage DC electrical in the power points and you could buy 2mm eletrical flex lead and a 3phase industrial switch and box, to then wire the board directly to the power point, NO PLUG, means LESS ELECTRICAL RESISTANCE, MORE STEADY VOLTAGE.... thus less noise. Your looking at about $150-$180 bucks and then your labour time.
    If you want to proceed let me know, and it really shouldn't be a problem. But i will need to FAX or send diagrams etc, the wiring is simple but VERY important... what do you think?
    let me know - chris

    <small>[ 11 October 2003, 10:54 AM: Message edited by: CHRI'S16 ]</small>
    ... ptui!

  13. #13
    nJm
    nJm is offline
    Guru nJm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    2,930
    XTC, I'm also a huge audiophile . Money has always been a problem with this hobby, but I find ways to extract the best out of what I have. Interferance has always been a problem here. Our living room setup has an 18 year old Rotel receiver (really nice one), but it tended to emit a loud buzz every now and then. What did I find? Mum had plugged the cordless phone into the same powerboard! I promptly went to dick smith and put a phone socket in the kitchen (shouldn't have a cordless phone anywhere near hi-fi!).

    At the moment I'm trying to talk the folks into getting a nice pair of KEF speakers. I've been listening around and was very impressed. I believe they'll suit us as as our living room is hopeless for stereo imaging due to the furniture and placement of windows.
    Nick
    1983 Peugeot 505 GR


    "All of its cars from the 1.1 litre 205 through the ugly duckling 309 to the 2.2 litre 505 GTi had a rightness and a righteousness about them that turned every humdrum drive into a journey. Someone, I once wrote, in the bowels of Peugeot understands handling and how a chassis should feel." - Jeremy Clarkson

  14. #14
    1000+ Posts
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Location
    Sydney, NSW, Australia
    Posts
    3,617
    XTC206:
    (not to treasury anyway)
    Tell the treasury it's for "safety"

    That should help, given her profession and all! Wouldn't want poor XTC ending up in hospital cos he got zapped holding his hi-fi remote wink

    Derek

  15. #15
    XTC
    XTC is offline
    VIC: a fine driving state XTC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Location Location Location
    Posts
    8,566
    CHRI'S16:
    And ive experianced excelent home-audio, ever heard of Duntec speakers? and Vestate valve amps, plus Denon Glod line components.. anyway moving on.
    Yes heard Duntechs .. but not the Sovereigns - Did get to experience a pair of Genesis 1's ($250,000 a pair) While I'm a lot below that par, my car is worth less then my Hi-fi. Mainly Cyrus & Mission inc. DC power supplies for most units combined with Siltech, Audioquest and Taralabs interconnects and cables.

    <strong>
    Either way, i need to know if you have 3phse power in your home,
    As you might have guessed .. nope (and I'm moving home in 3 months anyway).

    <strong>
    One way to reduce 240volt 50hz noise is to make the board on an earthed metal case.
    The triple pass filter takes care of that, but I want to plug the power board into that.

    <strong>
    As for wiring use 8guage DC electrical in the power points and you could buy 2mm eletrical flex lead and a 3phase industrial switch and box, to then wire the board directly to the power point, NO PLUG, means LESS ELECTRICAL RESISTANCE, MORE STEADY VOLTAGE.... thus less noise.
    Can't wire it direct as it'll come from the filter .. which uses IEC connectors.

    <strong>
    Your looking at about $150-$180 bucks and then your labour time.
    That's cool. Less then 1/2 the cost of buying one. Where to get parts from (rather black then white) maybe an issue.

    <strong>
    If you want to proceed let me know, and it really shouldn't be a problem. But i will need to FAX or send diagrams etc, the wiring is simple but VERY important... what do you think?
    let me know - chris
    Yep very interested .. I'll PM my details to you. At least I know how to use a multi meter

    Cheers - XTC206 -
    You're not fooling everyone, or did you forget? .......




    '02 Peugeot 206 GTi / '07 VW Golf GTI
    Now this is a .sig
    AF'd in PER, MEL, SYD, ADL, CBR

  16. #16
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    3,298
    XTC, no probs mate when youre ready.
    As for the duntechs, i honestly don't know the particular models, but what i do know is the owner is loaded. i didn't think a projector could look so good in a dark room,..... id actaully say better than the Cinemas.
    he also had this SA-CD player, Super Audio Compact Disk from Alesis, and a 1/3 Octave Alesis EQ rack, a lot of the gear was ex-studio gear, like his rear fill was a pair of S10 yamaha's, like what the faaa... these are recording studio monitors, being used for rear fill!!... ok ill stop, but add just one thing, and Deka will love this too, he has a new Dual 2hz G Mac, buger. - chris
    ... ptui!

  17. #17
    XTC
    XTC is offline
    VIC: a fine driving state XTC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Location Location Location
    Posts
    8,566
    CHRI'S16:
    he also had this SA-CD player, Super Audio Compact Disk from Alesis, and a 1/3 Octave Alesis EQ rack, a lot of the gear was ex-studio gear, like his rear fill was a pair of S10 yamaha's, like what the faaa... these are recording studio monitors, being used for rear fill!!... ok ill stop, but add just one thing, and Deka will love this too, he has a new Dual 2hz G Mac, buger. - chris
    Sounds like he has tooooooooo much money, although my rear speakers are running off a NAD THX amp ...

    Cheers - XTC206 -
    You're not fooling everyone, or did you forget? .......




    '02 Peugeot 206 GTi / '07 VW Golf GTI
    Now this is a .sig
    AF'd in PER, MEL, SYD, ADL, CBR

  18. #18
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    3,298
    ....lol.
    Funy that,..He is loaded, but spends his money in unusual ways, invests in US and other foreing currency, got his home loan from a japanes bank at some crazy interest rate like 2% or something.
    Has never "owned" a car but lease brand new Audi's every year through his work, and although he is 34, he won't marry up.
    The home-cinema he set-up is very well researched, but funny enough nothing fancy for power, just x3 extra power points. oh and im not 100% on this but why do so many home audio freaks love valve amps? - chris
    ... ptui!

  19. #19
    Sense Pug307's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    4,355
    XTC206:
    Did get to experience a pair of Genesis 1's ($250,000 a pair) While I'm a lot below that par, my car is worth less then my Hi-fi.
    Wow. Ahwell, you can rest knowing I thought it sounded good

    XTC206:
    Other then my passion for Peugeots, it pales in comparison for my passion for Hi-Fi - yes I'm an Audio Geek as well eek! Hey Deka
    Where would Aussiefrogs be without its geeks

    We have our tyre, oil, home audio, gadget, Volvo, cycling, mac, car audio, sticker, and who knows what else geeks That's not to say we have our Peugeot, Renault and Citroen geeks too!

    Peugeot 307 XS 1.6
    Aussiefrogged in MEL, PER, SYD, BNE & ADL.
    Rendezvous Adelaide 2005

  20. #20
    1000+ Posts Haakon's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    canberra...
    Posts
    8,651
    nJm:


    At the moment I'm trying to talk the folks into getting a nice pair of KEF speakers. I've been listening around and was very impressed. I believe they'll suit us as as our living room is hopeless for stereo imaging due to the furniture and placement of windows.
    Have a listen to Orpheus speakers, bloody gorgeous sound.
    I tried to drown my sorrows in alcohol, but the bastards learnt how to swim

  21. #21
    Fellow Frogger! Ralph's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Wodonga
    Posts
    928
    Hi all,

    Here's my mess of cables and powerboards!

    <a href="http://users.tpg.com.au/nosneb/MESS.JPG" target="_blank">Mess</a>

    Cheers,

    Ralph.
    On the internet, no one knows that you are only wearing a fez.

  22. #22
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    3,298
    Ralph:
    Hi all,

    Here's my mess of cables and powerboards!

    <a href="http://users.tpg.com.au/nosneb/MESS.JPG" target="_blank">Mess</a>

    Cheers,

    Ralph.
    ......mmm, atleats its off the floor, but still as a sparky its holy eek! for me ... fix it Ralph, please prove me wong and show me that aussie frogs homes are smarter than the average, and don't catch on fire.... ..lol. - chris
    ... ptui!

  23. #23
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    3,298
    Ralph:
    Hi all,

    Here's my mess of cables and powerboards!

    <a href="http://users.tpg.com.au/nosneb/MESS.JPG" target="_blank">Mess</a>

    Cheers,

    Ralph.
    ......mmm, atleats its off the floor, but still as a sparky its holy eek! for me ... fix it Ralph, please prove me wong and show me that aussie frogs homes are smarter than the average, and don't catch on fire.... ..lol. - chris
    ... ptui!

  24. #24
    1000+ Posts Damien Gardner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Wendouree Vic. Aust
    Posts
    2,436
    Originally posted by Ralph:
    Hi all,

    Here's my mess of cables and powerboards!

    Mess

    Cheers,

    Ralph.

    Apart from the mess, the really silly & Xtremely dangerous part of the MESS. Is the 2400 Watt heater under the CPU, this heater alone puts the power board at it's rated limit and cause it's plug and lead to get warm. Any additioinal load should if it has, one trip the overload cutout.
    As our Sparky will tell you the idear is to have several GPo's per room preferably on seperate fuses, unfortunately older premises don't confirm to the ideal.
    My rented 3Br has 2 2xGPO's on the one fuse in the lounge, with ix4 p/board for TV, Vid & stereo,
    and 2x4 foir the computer stuff & fan for gas heater. Fortunately not close to the 10A limit of any of the GPO's.
    cheers
    Health and good fortune always,
    Damien.

    We rode on the winds of the rising storm,
    We ran to the sounds of thunder.
    We danced among the lightning bolts,
    and tore the R10's assfromunder.

    Robert Jordan & memyself&I

    1/48th Scale Alpine A310,
    N-scale 1/160th Renault & Citroen, Advert. Signs & Billboards

  25. #25
    Fellow Frogger! Ralph's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Wodonga
    Posts
    928
    Hi all,

    Looks can be deceiving! It really is quite safe, only messy. I put my clamp meter on this lot with all computers and peripherals running and the total current draw was about 3.5A.

    The big power board has a 10A over current trip and the smaller one runs off it. The heater has been kicked under the table to get it out of the way. It is only ever used on low heat anyway as on high it would trip the circuit breaker (2400W/240V=10A). The house is protected with an RCD.

    I agree with you, it's a mess and will be tidied up! Any one else as messy as me?

    Ralph.
    On the internet, no one knows that you are only wearing a fez.

Page 1 of 2 12 Last

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •