Advanced Driving School
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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Advanced Driving School

    If you enrolled in a 3 day advanced driving school with private instructor and could ask your instructor to demonstrate any maneuver or technique, what would you ask him to demonstrate?
    Also, what's the best high performance driving school in Australia? I've heard of Ian Luff
    Why are the schools down there so much less expensive than in England or USA?

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  2. #2
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
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    I've heard that Peter Finlay is pretty good. Ian Luff gives me the impression of somebody who is a bit short tempered and insensitive to be a suitable driving instructor for all types of people, but I could be wrong, that could be just the way he comes across on TV. I get the impression that alot of Australian racing drivers don't have the interpersonal skills that are needed to be great instructors. They definitely seem to mellow out and improve with age. Peter Brock is a case in point. He really seemed to mellow out and become a real nice bloke once he reached about 50. Before that he seemed a bit too tense. Unfortunately, as far as I know, Peter Brock doesn't run a permanent driving school.

    Dave
    NZ Fleet
    1976 504 Ti
    1984 205 GT twin carb
    1991 205 SI 1.6GTI motor
    1994 106 Xsi
    1996 Mondeo V6
    Aus Fleet
    1955 203C
    1997 Civic Cxi (great allrounder- revy, flexible, nimble, comfortable , economical, simple and durable )

  3. #3
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Yeah the best drivers don't always make the best teachers and vice versa, kinna like calculus teachers
    So are there any maneuvers/techniques you'd ask them to demonstrate if you could pick one difficult one?

  4. #4
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
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    I'm not really sure what I would most want them to show me. I've noticed that some of the driving schools use cars which really make it difficult to drive well. I saw one test on TV where they were asking a group of people to drive towards an object at 60km/h, on a very wet section of road. When the instructor put his arm out they were supposed to apply the brakes and steer around the object. They were driving non-abs VS Holden Commodores. I'm certain I could have passed that test in my 504, however with the over assisted brakes and over assisted steering of the Commodore, I think I would probably slide right into the object, as most of the students did. I hate brakes and steering which have no feel. I think you need to be a Jedi Knight and "use the force" to drive some cars. Maybe I should be looking for a Jedi instructor?

    Regards,
    Dave
    NZ Fleet
    1976 504 Ti
    1984 205 GT twin carb
    1991 205 SI 1.6GTI motor
    1994 106 Xsi
    1996 Mondeo V6
    Aus Fleet
    1955 203C
    1997 Civic Cxi (great allrounder- revy, flexible, nimble, comfortable , economical, simple and durable )

  5. #5
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Hi Guys,

    I once saw on 'A current Affair' I think it was this braking test in the wet where they had to swerve around cones and stop. It was the biggest load of shit I've seen in a long time. They were attempting to show how dangerous young drivers are.

    Craig lownes walks in and shows them how it's done. Brand new HSV Commadore with ABS, lots of rubber and makes it. Now the 'dangerous young drivers turns'. The all slid straight into the cones, wether it was before or after swerving. The had 10-20year old crap box's with shitty tyres.... Gee's the young people were dangerous. I say give them another go with the ABS Race bred HSV commadore!!

    seeya,

    Shane Leviston
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  6. #6
    Administrator GreenBlood's Avatar
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    James
    If I had the chance of some expert tuition I think I'd like to know more about cadance breaking, for all us drivers of vehicles without ABS it should shorten stopping distances. My understaning is that you bring your vehicle to the point where one or more wheels locks under heavy braking and at that point release and reaply the brakes, repeating this action until you are out of danger, theoreticly (only because I have not mastered this technique) this also alows you to steer to avoid obstacles. Poor mans ABS. In an emergency stop situation I find it very difficult to get my foot off the brakes and end up in a slide where basicly the vehicle is out of my control. I must add that these days this is a very uncommon circumstance as I tend to try to drive where possible leaving a safe stopping distance ahead of me.
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  7. #7
    Tadpole
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    Hello all,
    I have a new 2001 206 GTi... and I would love to have a chance to do some driver training in it. I am just glad that this cars handling / grip ability far exceed my level of driving ability / guts / sphincter control. *laugh*
    Anyway I did about 4 different Ian Luff courses back in 1994 when I had a Suzuki Swift GTi. From beginners up to race day around Oran Park. They were very good although Ian Luff always tried to make jokes about everything. A bit impatient as outlined earlier. I had Warren Luff instructing me and he was very good indeed. I would recommend them. I also failed the panic brake turn thing in the wet on my first attempt.. Oopps!!
    Cheers
    Damian

  8. #8
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    Righto - you've got me in.
    For what it's worth, the general talk in the pits at Queensland Raceway last weekend apparently, was the rumour of a track being built adjacent to or across from the racing complex which will be used for advanced driver training right up to race driver standard. Names being bandied around were Brabham (not Jack), Batlett & a couple of other "name" drivers of that era.
    Bartlett who apparently has a property these days at Maleny was not bashful about admitting that he had been approached but having had involvement in Motor Sport in by-gone years I am more aware than most of the ego problems all these characters tend to have & this could tend to put the dampeners on what could be a brilliant idea.
    Statements to the effect that they were interested but at about "3 times" the figure presently being offered tells me that once James Packer, Lachlan Murdoch and the rest of the silver spoon in the gob brigade have passed through, the price tag might end up being too high for the average punter to consider & the whole thing may become an accessory to the "V8 Super car circus"
    Presently, Roadcraft at Gympie who also have a branch at Lakeside will be putting a group of 17/18 year olds at my suggestion from a local Anglican College on my suggestion. This should happen in the next few weeks & I'll post after the event & let everyone know how it went.
    For this age group driver they come highly recommended but may not go quite far enough for some of you guys

    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  9. #9
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
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    i must admit i had a chance with ian luff and went for two courses with him and now dying to go for the next one but i must admit i had a very good time and learnt a lot.i would recomend luff to anyone. also it was good when on the second course we got into some more free time type manouvres and the instructors were teaching us scandy flicks and other such fun things. in the first course it was good to see a bloke turn up in an L300 van loaded to the brim with all his plumbing gear and walk away at the end of the day more confident and in more control of his vehicle.if he can do that in a van i think anyone has a chance of learning something
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  10. #10
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Ask the instructor to show you how to "double-de-clutch" as well.......

  11. #11
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
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    Doesn't everyone here double de-clutch most of the time already? That was probably the first thing I taught myself in the week after I got my licence. I can't say I always get the revs matched right, but that doesn't matter too much. I remember giving a friend a lift home about ten years ago and she asked me why I always hit the clutch pedal twice. I'm not sure how well I answered that question.
    Changing gears without the clutch at all is the thing which takes alot more work. I can do it in an Escort or a Cortina, but I find it alot more difficult in 504s and 404s. It must be something to do with the gearbox design. I've had the clutch hydraulics fail on the 504 a few times and changing gears without the clutch was a real hit and miss process, compared to the Cortina I had.

    Dave
    NZ Fleet
    1976 504 Ti
    1984 205 GT twin carb
    1991 205 SI 1.6GTI motor
    1994 106 Xsi
    1996 Mondeo V6
    Aus Fleet
    1955 203C
    1997 Civic Cxi (great allrounder- revy, flexible, nimble, comfortable , economical, simple and durable )

  12. #12
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    I used to own a Driving school down the Gold Coast many years ago & I used to do what was known as "C" class licences in those days. Among my clients were coppers, firemen, garbos, readymix owner/operators & people who had lost their licences & had to be retested plus soldiers wanting to get a "civvys" truck licence.
    The truck I used was a side valve DeSoto with a RHD conversion, (hence the exhaust pipe passed between the clutch & brake pedals & blew red hot air in your face ) no power steering & non power assisted brakes with a mechanical handbrake and clutch AND a full crash gearbox. It was fun in the middle of Surfers in Summer on a public Holiday.
    The Transport Dept Testers loved it because they reckoned if they could drive this around the block, they could drive anything. I even had a few coppers come down from Brisbane for lessons & licence test (this was so they could legally shift trucks where they had copped the driver DUI) for the same reason.
    The thing that I had the big reputation for was, that I would make them go up & down through the gears without using the clutch & if they couldn't manage it, they didn't go for their test until they could. With a genuine full crash box, it happens much easier than with a synchro or what they used to call a "semi" synchro box.

    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  13. #13
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Alan,

    I used to be a driving instructor as well

    Dave,

    I think James doesnt drive yet, mainly a passenger, so maybe a few more basic things like double-de-clutching, emergency braking, swerve control and the like would be of benifit to him.

    Chipper

  14. #14
    Guru davemcbean's Avatar
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    Alan,

    Yeah, I've heard that crash boxes are much easier to do clutchless shifting with, than synchro boxes.

    I've heard VW boxes are pretty easy to do clutchless shifts on too. As I said before, the Cortina I had was pretty good for that, but the 504 is a real bastard.

    Steve Reinhart in the NSW Pug club always does clutchless shifts on his 504. His the only person I've seen do it pretty succesfully, all the time. The way he does it, is different though. He blips the throttle while applying pressure to the gearstick and when the revs hit the spot where they're matched it goes into gear, but it's the jerkiest way of doing it I've seen.

    On my Cortina I used to just hold the revs close to where I thought they should be (by ear) and it would slide into gear really easy, whereas on the 504 it has to be spot on before it will go into gear. Steve Reinhart told me he does his method of clutchless shifts in every car he drives, including his mother's Corolla, which apparently drew some strange looks from his mother when she was in the passengers seat.

    Dave
    NZ Fleet
    1976 504 Ti
    1984 205 GT twin carb
    1991 205 SI 1.6GTI motor
    1994 106 Xsi
    1996 Mondeo V6
    Aus Fleet
    1955 203C
    1997 Civic Cxi (great allrounder- revy, flexible, nimble, comfortable , economical, simple and durable )

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