Here we go again..
  • Register
  • Help
Results 1 to 19 of 19
  1. #1
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Queensland, Australia
    Posts
    8,923

    Here we go again..

    Well, yesterday afternoon it happened again!
    Another 4WD full of backpackers within about 2 miles of my place went A over with 2 dead and a third who will possibly not make it.
    When's the penny going to drop with these dopey politicians that something has to be done about the licensing of drivers of these things!!!
    The only cold comfort of this one is that at least they didn't take anybody else out when it happened which round here so often happens.
    You can put quids on there being a "blitz" now on everything BUT wank tanks round here for the next month "in an attempt to halt the spiralling Road Toll."
    You have to wonder whether there is such an affliction as brain cell incontinence that is the exclusive domain of Politicians & senior Police or is it just coincidence that both groups seem to suffer from it?
    mallet mallet mallet whip

    Alan S

    Advertisement
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  2. #2
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Perth, WA, Australia
    Posts
    10,638
    I'm with you Alan. There's just been a new book from USA on this subject about SUVs - it was ABC Radio National's breakfast programme with Vivienne Schenker so you might even be able to find the title there. The author was just as rude about the damn things as you are!! Lots of good information. It's really a lot to do with the ridiculously low tax on such unsociable devices. Should be priced back to farms and mineral exploration where they belong.

    I won't start on the subject of the tyres they fit to them and how they behave on wet bitumen!!!

    I was told that Avis or Herz had Suzuki Vitaras in Alice Springs a few years back but the tourists from O/S were rolling one a week and I presume they stopped buying them (or hope they did).

    Cheers

    JohnW
    JohnW

    Renault 4CV 1951
    Renault R8 1965
    Renault Scenic 2005 (wife's)
    Renault Scenic 2007 (mine)
    Renault Scenic 2006 (daughter's)
    Citroën CX Pallas 1980

    National Co-ordinator, Renault 4CV Register of Australia

  3. #3
    1000+ Posts
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Perth, Western Australia
    Posts
    6,229
    I've resisted mentioning this for privacy reasons but a client stopped using Landrover Discovery's because they were very prone to rolling at the highway speed limit of 110 km/h. They rolled two or three (!). I was amazed - I generally have a lot of respect for Brit engineering, especially in the Landie range. After all, this is what they're renowned for - their off/on road compromise. That's as much as I can say, but there is an engineered fix for them.

    Stuey


    2003 PEUGEOT 206 GTi

  4. #4
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Queensland, Australia
    Posts
    8,923
    I know the obvious fix, which is what I said at first; proper driver training & licenses and in the case of tourists either escorted in groups or having to provide a driver or better still do like the locals do when we go to the Island & hop on an all terrain bus.
    The problem we have here is that because they are driving on sand, they deflate the tyres. There's no means to inflate at the barge terminal and although the last one (which was kept hush) was caused by flat tyres & locked in 4wd when they were going TO the barge, I'll bet this one was coming home on flat tyres.
    The excuses should make some interesting reading though. mallet mallet mallet

    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  5. #5
    1000+ Posts dino's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    melbourne
    Posts
    4,513
    u r right alan
    i think there should be a 4wd licence....one of the cars i own at the moment is a jeep cherokee...yes i know they r crap but i got it cheap at an auction,was bidding for delorean but was short on cash...this stolen and recovered jeep came up and i got it for less than 7 grand which is not bad for 95 with 83k on clock,,,anyway on the outside of the visor there is an orange sticker that basically tells one that the vehicle is easy to roll over ,loose control and crash...bla bla bla....
    U d think anybody buying the stupid things would know those issues..ie higher centre of gravity etc etc i am a reasonably experianced driver and i quickly learned to respect the cars limits and keep well under them...abs on the car is useless is one example, horse and cart dynamics are another etc etc...
    the issue of underinflated tyres does not seem to be well known by many 4wdrivers...when u mention to them that the underinflated tyres overheat very quickly (esp. on freways at lets say 100km/h)...and how they feel about handling tyre blow outs at that speed ..their usual response is ...huh, duh,,,what ,,,nooo....or my favourite "...but i ve got brand new tyres on it.."i think that underinflated tyres was the underscoring issue in the firestone / explorer farce...
    another interseting fact...last week i managed to get just over 350kays out of $60 of fuel...wonderfull...why anybody would buy the monsters and drive them around town as daily drivers is not just perplexing but COSMICALLY stupid...and please no comments about me owning one...i hate the bloody thing....

  6. #6
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Burpengary and Murrumburrah, Qld and NSW
    Posts
    9,223
    The general reason for owning one is "because they're big and safe if I have a crash!"

    Why would these folk worry about safety in a crash?

    For the same reason many people become Volvo owners... they're silly enough to have crashes...

  7. #7
    Sense Pug307's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    4,355
    Statistically, Volvo drivers actually have FEWER crashes!

    Just like to point out a certain urban myth that is often being perpetuated.

    Peugeot 307 XS 1.6
    Aussiefrogged in MEL, PER, SYD, BNE & ADL.
    Rendezvous Adelaide 2005

  8. #8
    Administrator GreenBlood's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    8,135
    Pug307:
    Statistically, Volvo drivers actually have FEWER crashes!

    Just like to point out a certain urban myth that is often being perpetuated.
    No they just leave them in their wake roll_lau

    Cheers
    Chris
    74 D(very Special) >>Rejuvenation Thread<<
    08 C5 X7 HDi very Noir



    "Déesse" Roland Barthes, 'Mythologies', 1957

    The Déesse has all the characteristics of one of those objects fallen from another universe that fed the mania for novelty in the eighteenth century and a similar mania expressed by modern science fiction: the Déesse is first and foremost the new Nautilus.

    (Umberto Eco [Ed], The History of Beauty, Rizzoli, NY, 2004)

  9. #9
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Posts
    396
    Ever noticed how 4WD drivers drive faster than everyone else, even on narrow winding roads with a rough and eroded shoulder?

    I don't know what drugs they're on, but I would have thought it obvious that if you drive such a high vehicle, with the tyres they use, in that way, in such conditions, that you're asking for trouble.

    There really has to be some sort of on going education campaign as to what compromises are inherent in various vehicles and how to drive accordingly. Such an education campaign should include basic maintenance also (most importantly tyre maintenance). No tourist should be allowed to drive such a vehicle without first passing some sort of course/test for these basics.

    Dave

  10. #10
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    3,298
    We all seems to agree that 4WD's generally are owned by people who treat/drive em like powerfull cars. At my second job (valet prk), i often ask women why a 4WD, most answer so they can over everyone else, and its easy to do shoping and quote.."ok if you tap something whilst parking..", coming from a woman in a Patrol with both f/r bars.
    Like you've mentioned driver education, shoud perhaps not limit to choice of Auto or Manual
    ... ptui!

  11. #11
    1000+ Posts CHRI'S16's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    3,298
    We all seems to agree that 4WD's generally are owned by people who treat/drive em like powerfull cars. At my second job (valet prk), i often ask women why a 4WD, most answer so they can see over everyone else, and its easy to do shopping and quote.."ok if you tap something whilst parking..", coming from a woman in a Patrol with both f/r bars.
    Like you've mentioned driver education, shoud perhaps not limit to choice of Auto or Manual, but also why i bought this car...
    Xqisid
    ps funny as froggies not also do we drive different/unique cars, but differently all together.
    ... ptui!

  12. #12
    Fellow Frogger! billtran's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Sydney, NSW, Australia
    Posts
    367
    fiveohs:
    Ever noticed how 4WD drivers drive faster than everyone else, even on narrow winding roads with a rough and eroded shoulder?

    I don't know what drugs they're on, but I would have thought it obvious that if you drive such a high vehicle, with the tyres they use, in that way, in such conditions, that you're asking for trouble.

    There really has to be some sort of on going education campaign as to what compromises are inherent in various vehicles and how to drive accordingly. Such an education campaign should include basic maintenance also (most importantly tyre maintenance). No tourist should be allowed to drive such a vehicle without first passing some sort of course/test for these basics.

    Dave
    Totally agreed there Dave. It's amazing how many people know nothing about basic maintenance or simple physics. Obviously, we don't need to know such things as programming the car's ECU but simple things such as checking tyre pressures, changing tyres or filling up the wiper water reservoir seems like a mystery to a lot of people.

    It's scary when I see how housewives drive their 4WDs. They treat the rest of the traffic with disdain and I'm usually left wondering when they will kill a child walking across the road to school. A friend of mine wants a big Landbruiser or Range Rover and yet has little idea about how to operate the air-con controls in her car (she was driving with her rear fog lights for a year until I explained to her what the fog light button was).
    You're not paranoid if everyone hates you.

  13. #13
    1000+ Posts
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Perth, Western Australia
    Posts
    6,229
    Strangely, I picked up this 'SUV' safety link on a photography website I frequent...

    <a href="http://enews.lbl.gov/Science-Articles/Archive/EETD-SUV-Safety.html" target="_blank">http://enews.lbl.gov/Science-Articles/Archive/EETD-SUV-Safety.html</a>

    Stuey


    2003 PEUGEOT 206 GTi

  14. #14
    1000+ Posts dino's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    melbourne
    Posts
    4,513
    regarding volvo drivers, as i used to be one of them (had a couple of 240 series)...i would think they are a pretty good choice considering who is behind the wheel of so many 4wds out there...i d hate to be hit while in my 205 (from any direction) by my jeep let alone something like the cruiser(bruiser) or patrol(nocontrol)...

  15. #15
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Gordon, NSW
    Posts
    4,527
    re: volvo drivers, that stat doesn't surprise me at all. We had Volvos in the family and they've never been in an accident...I tihnk it's mainly because a lot of other drivers look out for a Volvo. When they see one, they tend to be more cautious around it.

    The Golf has the highest amount of at-fault accidents. I must say I contributed to that stat
    - Lincoln

    Contribute to the World Community Grid.

  16. #16
    Fellow Frogger! PUG309's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    231
    I cant stand it when they go to all the expense of buying a off-road vechile and yet have difficulty driving on the shoulder.
    Daniel Djuracic

    Ex UK spec 89 309
    206 XT 1.6 16V (Diablo Red)with Peugeot Lion in back windows

  17. #17
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Posts
    396
    PUG309:
    I cant stand it when they go to all the expense of buying a off-road vechile and yet have difficulty driving on the shoulder.
    Actually a road car (especially if it's a Citroen or a 504/505) is ALOT more stable driving with one wheel on a rough shoulder than a 4WD is. The suspension is a bit too primitive on most 4WDs to be able to pull off this stunt safely.

    Dave

    <small>[ 04 December 2002, 09:13 AM: Message edited by: fiveohs ]</small>

  18. #18
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Queensland, Australia
    Posts
    8,923
    Yesterdays headlines in the local rag.

    "Buck passing over road upgrade" complete with some old fart (possibly one of the local wank tank squadron) waving a petition around and spruiking about State & Local bodies arguing about who should pay for the "upgrade."
    The pont is, this happened on a stretch of road which is full of dippers and the best road surface in the world won't stop one of these things getting airborne when an inexperienced driver hits it at about 100 KPH or more, fully loaded in a troop carrier with a roof rack stacked 3 foot high, which is the usual procedure. Ad to this tyres running at about 10 to 20 psi and you might as well drop it on a king sized trampoline.
    Last time we had a fatality, they sure knew how to fix it that time by upgrading; they painted all the guideposts, fitted reflectors to some, painted new lines on the road and reduced the speed limit for the next kilometer.
    They just don't get it do they?
    Or is it that they don't want to get it....chequebook road safety would be a good name for it mallet mallet mallet

    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  19. #19
    Fellow Frogger! billtran's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Sydney, NSW, Australia
    Posts
    367
    Like it or not Alan, I know you like to rubbish the pollies but there really isn't much they can do about 4WDs. Think about it, the SUV is the fastest growing sector for Automobiles and for a politician to put up taxes or barriers is going to cost him lots of votes (especially in the wealthier electorates). Even then, putting up massive taxes isn't necessarily going to work - look at Singapore for instance.

    I hate SUVs as much as anybody but we'll just have to learn to live with them. All we can hope for is that the manufacturers make more friendly SUVs such as the new Volvo XC70. As long as we have relatively cheap fuel, obnoxious people and a yearning for the great outdoors, the SUV will be here to stay.
    You're not paranoid if everyone hates you.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •