Fuel Prices Melb. Sydney!
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  1. #1
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    Default Fuel Prices Melb. Sydney!

    Did I hear it correctly that in Sydney drivers were complaining that Fuel was at a record high of 101.9 per litre unleaded and expected to remain at that level due to the high overseas oil price!

    Here in Melbourne most of the outlets raised their prices a week ago to 109 cents plus a litre and by last Friday when prices are usually tipped to drop, the independents ran against the trend and put it up to 111.9 cents a litre.

    Shell unusually bucked that for at least a day and you could get prices down to 102.9 litre in our area. I filled up with Optimax (109.9 cents litre) because we were heading for the country. The last time I travelled in the country prices ranged from 113 cents a litre to a whopping 123 cents a litre unleaded, so I expected the same.

    Driving from Melbourne to the Mallee the fuel prices were generally at 109.9 cents a litre (unleaded) and you could get 4 cents a litre off that at Ararat with a Safeway docket.

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    I still think that this whole Fuel pricing thing is a dead set racket, with oil bought during earlier pricing slumps processed/refined and then sold at higher prices!

    As Australia is mainly self sufficient in oil perhaps its time to drop World Parity Pricing in this country that ties our market to overseas commodity pricing.

    We arrived back in Melbourne to find that yes just about ALL Service stations had fallen into line with the 111.9 cents a litre pricing! Fortunately this artificial price is dropping as motorists refuse to fill up.

    What is the pattern of pricing in Sydney? or is this artificial manipulation to cover blatant ripoffs alternatively High Melb, Low Sydney and Vice Versa!!

    Ken - Motorist's let your voice be heard!!
    Last edited by Kenfuego; 21st March 2005 at 05:00 PM. Reason: minor you to your

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    Fellow Frogger! jfn180's Avatar
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    in sydeny on sunday shell unleaded is 112.9 and optimax was 120.9
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    normal premium unleaded has been 118.9cpl for a week here

    you city guys don't know how good you have it

    we pay more and have to travel further to go anywhere
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  4. #4
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    Default Yurk!!

    Quote Originally Posted by jfn180
    in sydeny on sunday shell unleaded is 112.9 and optimax was 120.9
    Its good that we keep this under observation and compare prices, can't say I am glad your prices are higher, as in my opinion the whole pricing of fuel is up the creek anyway.

    Our RACV is supposed to be monitoring fuel prices, but sometimes the RACV rep seems to sound like an oil industry apologist. I tried to check their site recently but it was out of commission. Par for the course!

    Still it is quite funny how prices jump so quickly when there is an international price peak, but never ever fall at the same rate as it decreases and as for real competition in the market its plain that a degree of collusion exists to hold prices high for as long as is possible.

    The recent Multi Million dollar fines (Unfair trading, profiteering) imposed just means they have to be more careful in managing the process.

    Wonder how Tasmania, WA, SA, and Queensland are coping with this price rise we had to have!

    Ken "Watch the boogers! it might keep them honest!"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenfuego
    I still think that this whole Fuel pricing thing is a dead set racket, with oil bought during earlier pricing slumps processed/refined and then sold at higher prices!

    As Australia is mainly self sufficient in oil perhaps its time to drop World Parity Pricing in this country that ties our market to overseas commodity pricing.
    In regards to self sufficiency, I've heard various figures ranging from "we import 60% of our crude supplies" to "we're about 80% self sufficient". I suspect the latter may be in regards to refining.

    However, drop the prices below world prices, where do you think local producers will want to sell their product? You may well could cause shortages in Australia as a result.

    Oil prices are very high at the moment now, but tapered to some degree by exchange rates. The timing of price increases may not be friendly, but bear in mind oil futures have been on a steep ascent since February.

    Fuel is about $1.90/litre here.

    To compare Aussie fuel prices, take a look at this site. In general, Sydney's price is higher than Melbourne's when I check. Note - in general!

    http://www.shell.com.au/petrolpricing/

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    Default Give me statistics anyday and I can make em dance!

    Justin

    That is an interesting exercise by Shell to shift the issue to one of taxing, when the beneficiary of W.P.Pricing is the oil companies - there are a number of unknowns in the charting (pretty old too!!).

    You can just about justify anything with charts and statistics, perhaps one of our members is a whizz that can analyse these in various ways, but we will never get the accurate base figures.

    What it does seem to show is that without this phoney highs and lows, fuel would be steady at about 8 cents a litre lower if you take out the weekly cycle and you would need to see the actual sales figures to see why the industry wants to promote this phoney image.

    We already sell oil and gas to world markets and we Do know that gas is sold round the 4 cents a litre mark, but WPP ensures that we pay substantially more for the product.

    The charts do not explain why the price goes up instantly when international prices rise, but comes down ever so slowly, but never to prices that it should if that was a real factor in pricing!

    By and large the International oil price fluctuation cycle is well known and companies buy crude around that cycle (buy low sell high) while allowing manipulation of spot prices to drive market prices higher (Good time to sell) and the peaks and lows provide opportunities for profit.

    Tying internal prices to World manipulation prices only serves the manipulators own ends leaving the motorist the poor end user. I'm no economist so don't have the worry about balancing an economy.

    But I do know when I am being ripped off - at least here we can try different things like bio-fuel blends without upsetting the tax/excise man like in Great Britain so thats some comfort (if your car will run on it!!).

    Shell here have been quitting some very high profile multi million litre storage/petrol selling sites, so perhaps they know something we don't , is that magic hydrogen/water powered car just around the corner ? or some super lubricant ( ) that will supercede crude oil waiting in the wings?

    I'll leave that speculation to the Toad pond - I just think that in this day and age a little intervention (not just taxing) by the Federal Govt, might blunt this economic weapon and make it easier for motorists (if we count for anything!)

    Ken

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    My mate was recently in Arab Emerites for a F3 race series. Fuel on the streets is 24c litre Aust Dollar! Back in Adelaide, I think I will change my name to Ben Dover, as PULP is now touching $1-20 litre. Then again we should probably be thankful we had the brains to buy these pocket rockets. Went to the Clipsal 500 yesterday, great event, but the number of big V8s 'cruising' around the streets of Adelaide afterwards chewing 20litres/100km makes me think that their days may be numbered.

  8. #8
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    Here in Tassie it's around the 1.08 mark for ULP in Launceston where I work. Where I live in Devonport, 100km down the road there is normally a 3c difference upwards. There also used to be a standard 4c difference between ULP and PULP regardless of where you went, but recently PULP has gone tp 6c higher than ULP - 1.14.

    Ends up pretty expensive when you use over 20l a day just travelling to and from work . You would think I spent so many years carrying this stuff around for the oil companies that they'd cut me some slack.

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    The weekly high price for ULP in Brisbane has floated to around 1.04.9, with the weekly low in some places 92.9.

    There's little point in talking about capital city prices without including both the weekly high and the weekly low. Of course, some people just don't notice that it happens... they just complain when they buy petrol because they always get it when it's high.

    There's generally a day when it goes from the low to the high, with a gradual decline to the low over the next six days. That used to mostly be Tuesday, but now it's Thursday or Friday in Brisbane.

    The oil prices hiked pretty high a week and a half ago, and this is now being reflected in the pump prices. And they're going higher, we're told.

    What I don't think is equitable is the fact that a 39 gallon barrel contains what? 175 litres or so? It goes from $29 to $55 and the price at the bowser goes up by 28c. 28c x 175 = $49... though I think the figures are actually greater than that. Anyway, the point is that the actual materials cost is passed on with a hefty on-cost, though all the manufacturing and distribution costs are essentially unchanged.

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    Prices for PULP has gone through the roof in Melb....118 cents per L and it's been that way for the past few days. No sign of abating either. For every 5 Litres I am paying for an extra Litre going by old prices!
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    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
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    But, as I pointed out in my last post, is that a weekly high or a weekly low?

    The price is going up and down every week, is it not? So quoting $1.18 as the price doesn't tell us if that's the low price or the high price.

    Or do you only look at the prices when your gauge is on empty. That's not a frivolous question, by the way. I can never understand why people don't actually know that the price has a regular fluctuation and I'm keen to understand it.

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    I know not melb or syd, but we havent been under 1.04 for ULP for a while now with 98RON avg'ing about 1.15 here in the perth metro (#'s from www.fuelwatch.wa.gov.au) , i feel for our regional drivers specially where 98RON is hitting over 1.30 in someplaces - but then I like the driving so am prepared to pay for it

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    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
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    I'm going gas as soon as I can get it fitted...

    I should have done it instead of putting in the TI gear four years ago. I would have saved better than $18,000 in fuel if I had. And had far fewer complications.

  14. #14
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    I filled up a full tank of BP Ultimate last thursday at $1.21 p/L. I haven't paid that much for quite a while, and I heard on TV it is expected to really go up over the Easter break. Hmm, time to get a more fuel efficient car I think!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Bell
    I'm going gas as soon as I can get it fitted...

    I should have done it instead of putting in the TI gear four years ago. I would have saved better than $18,000 in fuel if I had. And had far fewer complications.
    It's barely worth the effort for most poeple. If you buy a car new and sell it at less than 60,000kms it's cost you $$$.

    My uncle used to fit gas for a living. Now he does mostly mechanical work. The reason is 5-10years ago gas was 1/3rd the price of petrol. It's now 1/2+ the price of fuel. You really have to drive extreme milage to get the $$$ back on the conversion cost.

    eg: I'd never consider it for my cars, I just don't drive far enough to make it worthwhile.

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  16. #16
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    Default Petrol Price fluctuations

    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Bell
    But, as I pointed out in my last post, is that a weekly high or a weekly low?

    The price is going up and down every week, is it not? So quoting $1.18 as the price doesn't tell us if that's the low price or the high price.

    Or do you only look at the prices when your gauge is on empty. That's not a frivolous question, by the way. I can never understand why people don't actually know that the price has a regular fluctuation and I'm keen to understand it.

    I think the motoring public has come quite a way from the days that the mere mention of a shortage of fuel or price hike would cause massive lines of frustrated motorists trying to fill their tanks with "cheaper" fuel - All this did of course was to help a clever exercise to transfer refined fuel from bulk underground oil company tanks into motorists tanks in a spiralling upward price market.

    Sort of like the claimed CUB engineered Brewery strikes that each year used to clear the old stocks of beer at higher prices just before the christmas party rush, and employees then worked overtime rates to replenish stocks, so everyone was happy! that is except the consumer

    Now we have a carefully crafted "discount" cycle where one side of the Metropolitan area is higher than the other and a dip in price more than compensated for by a rise in price. Metro V Country prices and state by state variations.

    PULP is a case in point, it is rarely advertised on an external price list, but more and more cars live on this stuff and it seems that they can charge what they like, I know I was a bit peeved when I went to Sydney and found PULP at 6 cents above unleaded, but I was then paying 8 cents up to 10 cents difference in Victoria

    Now did I hear 4 cents difference in Tasmania, now 6 cents ?

    I think that our motorists are being conned by the Petroleum spin doctors, and the so called discount "cycle" is in reality a merry-go-round of collusion and computer based jiggery pokery that will only be exposed when some courageous employee blows the whistle.

    Perhaps this thread is read and noticed because today our RACV petro. expert publically denounced the present high pricing "anything over a dollar is still a shocking price" Quote Herald Sun Page 2. [Oil companies were not discounting petrol yesterday as the wholesale price remained at 100.4 cents a litre - At that level, petrol should be no cheaper than between 103.9 and 104.5 cents a litre] refreshing to hear this change of attitude in our interests. hmmm.

    Yes I think that we need to keep a close eye on this industry and its impact upon our disposable income, a one cent variation per litre equates to a huge ripoff nationally. In the case of PULP 4 to 6 cents difference per litre (state to state) screams out for punitive controls!

    There has been a noticeable change in the so called "discount cycles" with high level pricing extending over more than two weekends. It will be interesting if the Easter Long Weekend was the real target for this present extended price hike bubble commencing when it did.

    Keep the high and low reports rolling in especially PULP (my Fuego loves it!! )

    Ken.

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    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
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    Yes, the difference between regular and premium varies quite a lot... it's almost a factor in deciding where to buy petrol. Though I tend to stick to Woolworths as I feel (and it's only a feeling...) that their Vortex is more consistent that Shell's 'Lead Free Super'.

    I think the media spruiking about high prices over Easter is just a beat-up... it's on all the time and they just go along with normal pessimism to either sound righteous or maybe later claim that their 'revelations' about prices on Monday have forced fuel companies to drop prices before the long weekend.

    Almost every time, holiday weekends see no change to the normal pattern...

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    I got some BP Ultimate today for $1.18 and while I was annoyed about the price beeing quite high at the moment I became even more annoyed when I worked out fuel consumption. With only city driving my 94 306 S16 usually does between 10 and 11L / 100km. Today's calculations revealed a fuel consumption of 12.66L/100 I've driven the car as sensibly as possible in the last few weeks and the only thing that's contributed negatively to my fuel consumption were the 2 traffic jams I was stuck in last week in Chatswood. One took 30 minutes to get out and the other 45 minutes (with bumper to bumper traffic presumably using up fuel a hell of a lot more then 90km/h cruising)....

    Anyway I'll take it easy again for the next week or 2 and try my best to avoid traffic jams. I'll stop using air con too just to see if I can get fuel consumption under 10L/100km with only city driving...

    Anway that's the end of my rant.
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    I'm seriously thinking of just putting my cars on club reg and taking the train or riding a pushbike to work. It's only gonna get worse.

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    Club Rego is near bloody pointless. You can't drive the cars as a once off, or go for a Sunday drive .... Nothing .... You can ONLY drive to advertised club events. When most of them are the otherside of Melbourne from me ...

    We need a usable "limited use" rego system. The current club permit scheme is simply to limited.

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    I find it funny how petrol seems to be most expensive around fri, sat and sun and starts to drop by a few cents on tue and wed. From what ive observed mobile truck tankers are filling stations on weekdays usually late at night or in the early hours of the morning. So delivery costs cannot justify weekend price hikes.

    Either way, The oil industry is one big oligopoly which is beyond the scope of this reply.
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  22. #22
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    Default I agree shortsighted AOMC!

    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleChevron
    Club Rego is near bloody pointless. You can't drive the cars as a once off, or go for a Sunday drive .... Nothing .... You can ONLY drive to advertised club events. When most of them are the otherside of Melbourne from me ...

    We need a usable "limited use" rego system. The current club permit scheme is simply to limited.

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    Shane

    We HAD a wonderful open permit system in Victoria until the AOMC stuck its nose into the pond. They lobbied the Motor Registration Branch to tighten up controls due to a belief that "someone" might abuse the openness of the system.

    They cited "rumours" that "they" had been seen by "someone" who told someone else that abuse had taken place, but could never specifically cite an incident or person - no police reports ever existed citing any such abuse or reports of abuse.

    It WAS ok to drive your car in preparation and testing for an event and then attend ANY event run by a motor vehicle club authorised to conduct such an event.

    Unfortunately the AOMC and Car clubs lobbied the Government for control of the process and its become an unusable process by way of OVER regulation and narrow interpretation and sheer fright that they may be held responsible for anything now they have almost absolute control over the process.

    Far better that an owner pay once for issue of a "Collector" plate that can be linked to a number of vehicles in his possession. After all this would entail one registration fee, one third party fee and additional vehicles added on a sliding scale of fees and production of a relevant R/Worthy certificate.

    Then keep motoring clubs fingers OUT of the policing and regulation process or the collector plate legislation will be stuffed up too.

    Comment should start a thread on collectors plates lest this one dilute the Petrol pricing thread!

    Ken

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    Originally posted by blackster
    I find it funny how petrol seems to be most expensive around fri, sat and sun and starts to drop by a few cents on tue and wed. From what ive observed mobile truck tankers are filling stations on weekdays usually late at night or in the early hours of the morning. So delivery costs cannot justify weekend price hikes.

    Either way, The oil industry is one big oligopoly which is beyond the scope of this reply.
    You haven't read this thread, have you?

    Nobody ever tried to justify the price by saying anything like that, nobody ever said anything other than it was a marketing exercise. The price drops until somebody drops the ball, then the whole industry lift the price again...

    Sure, some suburbs are a day or two different in their cycles to other suburbs, but that's what's happening.

    It has nothing to do with deliveries or costs, it's to do with local competition.

  24. #24
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    Default Easter pricing

    Ray, surely you'd expect prices to be at maximum wack at Easter, it always is over here!

    ed ge

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    Edgy... I keep a close watch on the fuel prices, I use heaps of the stuff...

    And I can tell you that it will be high this weekend because it's a weekend, not because it's Easter. And if it had been last year, it wouldn't have been so high (relatively) because the price change took place on Tuesdays, not Thursdays.

    When the price goes up, it stays up for about two days, then drops slowly until the last day or two it's right down. There's ten to twelve cents difference in the price according to what day of the week you're buying.

    Anyone who says that Easter fuel prices are 'always high' is kidding themselves or simply doesn't watch the fuel prices closely... it just isn't so. Same with any other holiday.

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