Apology Alan & Co.
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  1. #1
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    Default Apology Alan

    Alan

    I went to edit out a few comments on a "tongue In Cheek" post I made a few days back, but could not as it is closed. No Offence Alan, sorry I didn't read your earlier post I respect you as a moderator was intending to go back that night to modify but got sidetracked.

    Ken

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    Last edited by Kenfuego; 5th April 2005 at 12:30 AM. Reason: Removed & Co.

  2. #2
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    Default Edited post.Peaceful debate please.

    I have spent a few days re-reading through the closed and locked post and frankly I was shocked at some of the agenda that was revealed - The attempts to hijack the thread also activity that one would loosley describe as troll - like

    (Troll behaviour -posting a carefully crafted (often innocuous post) containing bait, usually an outlandish very loose claim that runs counter to the thread and when some unlucky individual opposes the bait post - its on for young and old)

    The trolls working together often have an abundance of pre-researched material ready to throw at the victim.

    The disturbing thing is that often the innocent victim is defending the theme of the thread and is then set upon in tag team fashion - it is interesting to note who these people are, and then to have a look at other threads they enter, usually at post in the 20's or thereabouts - sometimes they actually target and bait a particular fellow member and when that member responds he cops a very personal serve.

    The hijack of a thread is complete when the troll manages to generate the majority of posts off theme, even if it is just a toe to toe battle of useless words it does destroy and stifle genuine discussion and debate when this behaviour is allowed to prevail.

    If anyone doubts my analysis, they only have to have a look at the various speed camera threads, the Radar for Ray thread in the toad pond and a query by a young poster on safe driving - there are Troll tracks all over the threads.

    Now as far as I am concerned, this behaviour if allowed to continue will destroy the wonderful theme we have of French car enthusiasts, helping other French car enthusiasts and promoting open discussion with as many participants as possible.

    I hate it when I see a young poster thumped by these gorillas. Froggy Forum IS NOT a private playground for a few individuals to engage in a dubious sport, or for settling grievances or conducting vendettas.

    Lets keep it open, respectful and lighthearted - and above all be prepared to back off when issues become personal and if my post seems to be directed at your activities, all I ask is that you have a good hard look at yourself and what you are doing to the Forum

    I have made this an open post in the hope that the dust will settle without fanfare. Now for the moderators all I ask is that this be allowed to run in the hope that it will curb the individuals who may be completely unaware of what they are actually doing.

    If you wish to shift it to the Toad pond, do so, we should not be frightened to have a good hard look at our activities for the long term good of the Forum

    Ken.
    Last edited by Kenfuego; 5th April 2005 at 01:30 AM. Reason: minor

  3. #3
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    Default

    Are you referring to the speeding one? I totally missed that thread so just went back and had a read. I agree with what you've said, Ken, I think some of the posts in there were quite disappointing.

    There were good points from both sides, but appears some just like to shout down other opinions, rather than having a civil discussion.

    I've got some ideas on road safety, but don't feel it's worth voicing them on AF because of the degenerative nature of those threads.
    Last edited by GTI124; 6th April 2005 at 12:59 AM. Reason: minor
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  4. #4
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Default Stick together

    A lot of good comes from the AF site however there are a lot of attacks made as described by Ken.

    I would have thought that we who drive our French cars would be supportive of each other. Debating points is fine but when it gets to personal level it is time to back off before the Subaru site has a post "Meanwhile back in Aussie Froggs".

    Good natured bantering in the spirit would normally bee seen for what it is but "BULLYING" would certainly not be in the spirit.

    I have owned all three major French manufacturers cars and find it pointless arguing and getting personal over which is best.

    The one that you have bought is generally the one that is best for you taking in to account all the factors important to YOU.

    If the car can put a smile on your face it is a good place to be. There are cars form all French manufacturers that could do that for me.

    This site should be enjoyable for all of the Members and Moderators, it should and must not degenerate to a place where people get so sick of the attacks that they find something more productive to be doing. If this happens we are all the poorer as the knowlege is then lost to us all.

    I have found AF to be a great sharing of information and I take my hat of to Simon and his detailed knowlege that he so freely shares on Renaults.

    As an owner of an older Renault and not having a strong mechanical background this resource is invaluable. Most of the knowlegable mechanics from the earlier days in Perth have hung up their tools for an easier life and this information is being lost.

    I feel it is time to focus on what we have, probably the best site in the world for this purpose and make sure that our asctions improve it.

    Graelin

  5. #5
    Administrator GreenBlood's Avatar
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    Icon14 Thank you Ken

    Just a short note to thank Ken, for the time and trouble he has taken, (including a fairly lengthy phone conversation on Friday night - I owe you a beer or two Ken) to highlight and discuss concerns regarding some negative activity we are seeing on Aussiefrogs.

    The points raised are now being discussed in the moderators area.

    This site should be a sanctuary for it's membership, where discussion can take place without fear of derision or bullying - we get enough of that in the big cruel world. On an open board with an ever increasing membership, this kind of activity is always going to creep in, it's upto our more senior members, and in turn mods and admin to ensure this activity is kept in check (and of course not be drawn in to make a point or satisfy our own egos).

    Something that seems to crop up all too often is the emphasis some members place on post counts (not necessarily those with the higher post counts either), Ken suggested that this could be dealt with by stopping the count at say 1000 posts, this milestone should be sufficient to establish a members commitment and loyalty to the forum, and distinguish them from our newer members. Perhaps not a bad thought.....

    5 years and closing in on 5000 (members) personalities, we're not doing too badly hey....

    Let's not lose sight of what brought us together, as owners/ potential owners of French cars in Australia we are a minority group, Aussiefrogs allows us to source and share our knowledge, enthusiasm, experiences, thirsts and hopefully good humour.

    Thanks again Ken, a timely post...

    Cheers
    Chris
    74 D(very Special) >>Rejuvenation Thread<<
    08 C5 X7 HDi very Noir



    "Déesse" Roland Barthes, 'Mythologies', 1957

    The Déesse has all the characteristics of one of those objects fallen from another universe that fed the mania for novelty in the eighteenth century and a similar mania expressed by modern science fiction: the Déesse is first and foremost the new Nautilus.

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  6. #6
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    and former owners

    I nub you guysh
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  7. #7
    Administrator GreenBlood's Avatar
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    Icon10

    Quote Originally Posted by GTI124
    and former owners

    I nub you guysh
    Ha ha, you fall into the catagory of potential owner.... you'll be back, once you have experienced your parents latest acquisition.... maybe not a Cit but you'll own and drive French again, it's in your blood now - you're infected

    Cheers
    Chris
    74 D(very Special) >>Rejuvenation Thread<<
    08 C5 X7 HDi very Noir



    "Déesse" Roland Barthes, 'Mythologies', 1957

    The Déesse has all the characteristics of one of those objects fallen from another universe that fed the mania for novelty in the eighteenth century and a similar mania expressed by modern science fiction: the Déesse is first and foremost the new Nautilus.

    (Umberto Eco [Ed], The History of Beauty, Rizzoli, NY, 2004)

  8. #8
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreenBlood
    Just a short note to thank Ken, for the time and trouble he has taken, (including a fairly lengthy phone conversation on Friday night - I owe you a beer or two Ken) to highlight and discuss concerns regarding some negative activity we are seeing on Aussiefrogs.

    The points raised are now being discussed in the moderators area.

    This site should be a sanctuary for it's membership, where discussion can take place without fear of derision or bullying - we get enough of that in the big cruel world. On an open board with an ever increasing membership, this kind of activity is always going to creep in, it's upto our more senior members, and in turn mods and admin to ensure this activity is kept in check (and of course not be drawn in to make a point or satisfy our own egos).

    Something that seems to crop up all too often is the emphasis some members place on post counts (not necessarily those with the higher post counts either), Ken suggested that this could be dealt with by stopping the count at say 1000 posts, this milestone should be sufficient to establish a members commitment and loyalty to the forum, and distinguish them from our newer members. Perhaps not a bad thought.....

    5 years and closing in on 5000 (members) personalities, we're not doing too badly hey....

    Let's not lose sight of what brought us together, as owners/ potential owners of French cars in Australia we are a minority group, Aussiefrogs allows us to source and share our knowledge, enthusiasm, experiences, thirsts and hopefully good humour.

    Thanks again Ken, a timely post...

    Cheers
    Chris
    Good on you, all Moderators. This isn't an overwhelming issue for me, but there are times when I walk away from a thread if it gets a bit ugly.

    I reckon the comment above sums it up "Let's not lose sight of what brought us together, as owners/ potential owners of French cars in Australia we are a minority group, Aussiefrogs allows us to source and share our knowledge, enthusiasm, experiences, thirsts and hopefully good humour."

    Personally, I find Aussiefrogs a useful and enjoyable forum. I'd never have ventured into Citroens without it and try to pay back the good advice by assisting (?) in some Renault matters. And then there are all the local people (in Perth for example) who might never have met otherwise.

    JohnW

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