Transmission Debate?
  • Register
  • Help
Page 1 of 2 12 Last
Results 1 to 25 of 30
  1. #1
    Sans Pond. STALLED's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    2,862

    Default Transmission Debate?

    Hey,

    Some of you may know me as the "commodore" driving Aussiefrogger. Today, i was out driving with dad and i encountered some very steep inclines going down Berowra Waters Rd for some of you which may know it. I decided to put the car into second gear on the selecter to keep the car fro gaining speed to much. The question is, By placing an automatic transmission in a certain gear, does it place excess wear on the box at all?

    I continued driving and when i got back to the top of the hill, i proceeded back onto the pacific hwy, still leaving it in 2nd and then shifting into 3rd and then back into D when i got to the legal speed limit- By doing this does this place wear on the automatic box treating it sort of like a manual?

    Thanks heaps froggers and keep on froggin!

    Cyas Stalled

    Advertisement
    2005 Renault Clio 182 Cup

    2011 Renault Megane 250 Cup Trophee - Sold

    1997 Peugeot 406 2.0 Manual - On Loan

    2004 Citroen C3 1.4 80th Anniversary (RIP)

  2. #2
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Parkes - N.S.W - Australia - Earth
    Posts
    12,256

    Default

    when my sister had her auto 504 her then boyfriend used to drive it like a manual and after a while it died

    the auto in the car was in good condition when she got the car and had done many miles in it before she started going with him

    another one was my missus ex

    when i first met her she had an EA falcon that the ex used to drive all the time when they were together, when the car finally died (head gasket, stuffed head) we sold the car to the wrecker as it wasn't worth repairing. now the car had been driven like a manual by the ex and pretty well caned by him and when the wrecker pulled the box out and pulled the pan off it the box was stuffed

    the car had just started playing up a bit before the engine died

    so driving them like a manual may not be a good idea
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x '98 306 GTi6

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0


    WTD long range fuel tank for 605

  3. #3
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Burpengary and Murrumburrah, Qld and NSW
    Posts
    9,223

    Default

    However, in circumstances like that, putting it into second or third hold is actually saving the box some work. Fewer changes when you know what's coming up and it doesn't.

  4. #4
    Sans Pond. STALLED's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    2,862

    Default

    Thanks heaps for that Pugrambo!

    Its really cleared up this debate which my dad and i have been having about automatic gearboxes and how they should be driven. Today was a "once off" as the road was really steep and by holding second gear, there was considerably more control over the car- well thats what i thought anyways!

    What would cause the autobox to stuff up when driven like a manual, like what would actually go wrong with the box itself?

    Thanks heaps!

    Cyas Stalled
    2005 Renault Clio 182 Cup

    2011 Renault Megane 250 Cup Trophee - Sold

    1997 Peugeot 406 2.0 Manual - On Loan

    2004 Citroen C3 1.4 80th Anniversary (RIP)

  5. #5
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Parkes - N.S.W - Australia - Earth
    Posts
    12,256

    Default

    holding it in gear going down hills should be fine with them but forcing them to change using the stick i have found seems to kill them (ie driving them like a manual)

    both boxes in my post above had masses of alloy shavings in the pans when pulled off

    not a good sign that's for sure
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x '98 306 GTi6

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0


    WTD long range fuel tank for 605

  6. #6
    Fellow Frogger! MR604's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Bathurst
    Posts
    946

    Default

    I think that driving them like a manual every day will cause them to expire earlier. But on occasions like you've described I don't think its a problem.

    If it was a problem for the box they would only let you select drive and reverse and that would be it

    A computer lets you make more mistakes faster than any other invention in human history, with the possible exception of handguns and tequila. - Mitch Radcliffe

  7. #7
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Parkes - N.S.W - Australia - Earth
    Posts
    12,256

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by STALLED
    Thanks heaps for that Pugrambo!

    Its really cleared up this debate which my dad and i have been having about automatic gearboxes and how they should be driven. Today was a "once off" as the road was really steep and by holding second gear, there was considerably more control over the car- well thats what i thought anyways!

    What would cause the autobox to stuff up when driven like a manual, like what would actually go wrong with the box itself?

    Thanks heaps!

    Cyas Stalled

    also remembering the transmission is automatic for a reason and isn't designed to be driven as a manual unless it's one of those new fang dangled tip tronic or sensodrive thingamabobs
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x '98 306 GTi6

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0


    WTD long range fuel tank for 605

  8. #8
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Burpengary and Murrumburrah, Qld and NSW
    Posts
    9,223

    Default

    Mind you, some modern 4-speeds die an early death no matter how they're treated...

    Ask your mates who own Foulcans if you like.

  9. #9
    Banned orestes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Sunshine Coast
    Posts
    4,520

    Default

    Forgive my ignorance, but the only way i can see an auto box dieing from being driven like a manual is being in the wrong gear for the situation, over reving, or just plain putting to much stress on the box.

    I personally don't understand how changing the gears yourself could be any more detrimental then the gearbox doing its own job. if it were driven properly, i don't see why it should cause any damage to the box.

    i'm not rejecting any of what your all saying, but i don't understand how it changing the gears itself, is any difrent from you changing the gears when it comes to gearbox wear.

    Also, how would using the kick down any diffrent to using the gear stick

    could i make a statement that using the kickdown in a slushbox causes as much as damage as changing the gears with the gear stick
    Last edited by orestes; 26th February 2005 at 05:55 PM.

  10. #10
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Parkes - N.S.W - Australia - Earth
    Posts
    12,256

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Bell
    Mind you, some modern 4-speeds die an early death no matter how they're treated...

    Ask your mates who own Foulcans if you like.

    no need to ask anyone just look in the auto transmission places to see what is in there all the time getting work done on them

    amazing how many late model things are in there
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x '98 306 GTi6

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0


    WTD long range fuel tank for 605

  11. #11
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Parkes - N.S.W - Australia - Earth
    Posts
    12,256

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by orestes
    Forgive my ignorance, but the only way i can see an auto box dieing from being driven like a manual is being in the wrong gear for the situation, over reving, or just plain putting to much stress on the box.

    I personally don't understand how changing the gears yourself could be any more detrimental then the gearbox doing its own job, if it were driven properly, i don't see why it should cause any damage to the box.

    i'm not rejecting any of what your all saying, but i don't understand how it changing the gears itself, is any difrent from you changing the gears when it comes to gearbox wear.

    Also, how would be using the kick down any diffrent to using the gear stick

    could i make a statement that using the kickdown in a slushbox causes as much as damage as changing the gears with the gear stick

    but does the kickdown act the same as the stick ???

    i think if you were to drive your car for the next 12 months as a manual and never an auto you will soon have a dead auto

    i have personally seen 2 cars go the same way driven in this manner
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x '98 306 GTi6

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0


    WTD long range fuel tank for 605

  12. #12
    Banned orestes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Sunshine Coast
    Posts
    4,520

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by pugrambo
    but does the kickdown act the same as the stick ???
    not exactly, but it does still change gears

    Quote Originally Posted by pugrambo
    i think if you were to drive your car for the next 12 months as a manual and never an auto you will soon have a dead auto

    i have personally seen 2 cars go the same way driven in this manner
    well, i'm not about to test the theory on my own car, but if you want to lend me yours for the next 12 months i will

    p.s i guess that means that i will take what people have been saying here with caution, not that i give my gearbox a hard time

  13. #13
    Gone Fishin' Ray Bell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Burpengary and Murrumburrah, Qld and NSW
    Posts
    9,223

    Default

    The kickdown gives a full throttle burst in a lower gear, driving with the stick gives a full throttle burst in the next gear. Not the same, but similar.

  14. #14
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Parkes - N.S.W - Australia - Earth
    Posts
    12,256

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by orestes

    well, i'm not about to test the theory on my own car, but if you want to lend me yours for the next 12 months i will

    and have you unleashed on the roads in a warmed up 604

    you will never want to hop back into the family version of a 205 ever again
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x '98 306 GTi6

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0


    WTD long range fuel tank for 605

  15. #15
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Gordon, NSW
    Posts
    4,527

    Default

    For the situation that was decribed... step inclines and declines you've used the auto box perfectly.

    As for using it as a manual for every day driving, I've personally never heard of a problem doing this. But that doesn't mean much.
    - Lincoln

    Contribute to the World Community Grid.

  16. #16
    1000+ Posts
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    4,976

    Default

    Can't see how using the selector in a auto box would ruin it - presuming it is used in a mechanically sensitive way. That is not whacking it down when driving at high speed.
    In fact my mate uses the auto on his 505 diesel and Toyota Highlux like a manual when towing a trailer. The 505 is very impessive as a tow car with his double axle trailer.
    If you hold an auto in second for example, it's only the engine that has to rev harder if you want to go faster.
    Holding gears in auto makes sense when you want to stay in the max. torque band.
    Jobo

  17. #17
    Member Malcolm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Canberra
    Posts
    59

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by pugrambo
    ...when the car finally died (head gasket, stuffed head)
    I recently did that Cooked it real good, smells of oil now and the water keeps disappearing from the radiator. The switch for the electric fans blew or something and unfortuntely didnt pick it up until the engine started running really really rough. Pulled over to the side of the road and steam was coming out and water was boiling and boiling sounds could be heard throughout the car engine cooling system. I was driving it around for a few days after and it sounded like it always does but was still getting hot and as mention before the water was disappearing.
    For the last 2 months its been in the shed at home gathering dust until my dad gets time to pull it down.
    How much approx would it cost to fix it or should i not bother? ($5000 Subaru Brumby, second owner. The previous owner was an older gentlemen who used it as a town runabout, bought it in superb condition and now i've f***** it)
    Last edited by Malcolm; 26th February 2005 at 09:56 PM.

  18. #18
    Budding Architect ???? pugrambo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Parkes - N.S.W - Australia - Earth
    Posts
    12,256

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Malcolm
    I recently did that Cooked it real good, smells of oil now and the water keeps disappearing from the radiator. The switch for the electric fans blew or something and unfortuntely didnt pick it up until the engine started running really really rough. Pulled over to the side of the road and steam was coming out and water was boiling and boiling sounds could be heard throughout the car engine cooling system. I was driving it around for a few days after and it sounded like it always does but was still getting hot and as mention before the water was disappearing.
    For the last 2 months its been in the shed at home gathering dust until my dad gets time to pull it down.
    How much approx would it cost to fix it or should i not bother? ($5000 Subaru Brumby, second owner. The previous owner was an older gentlemen who used it as a town runabout, bought it in superb condition and now i've f***** it)

    i take it we are talking about the sooby ??

    all depends on how much damage has been done to it as to how much it would cost to rebuild

    in the EA falcons, when the gasket goes the head is normally stuffed as well as they are very very soft hence it jsut wasn't worth doing anythign with the car and when wreckers wanted in excess of $900 for another engine it was out of the question

    sooby engines are normally pretty good things and pretty simple to build
    3 x '78 604 SL

    1 x '98 306 GTi6

    1 x secret project

    1 x '98 406 STDT troop carrier and i don't care if it stinks, i don't sniff it's arse Death by wank tank

    1 x '99 406SV 5spd wagon, time to burn more fuel

    1 x 1994 605 SV3.0


    WTD long range fuel tank for 605

  19. #19
    Member Malcolm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Canberra
    Posts
    59

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by pugrambo
    i take it we are talking about the sooby ??
    yep, good old sooby
    Quote Originally Posted by pugrambo
    sooby engines are normally pretty good things and pretty simple to build
    Some good news. Gives me something to do when the next uni holidays come about.
    Last edited by Malcolm; 26th February 2005 at 10:15 PM.

  20. #20
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Ballarat,Vic,Aust.
    Posts
    16,288

    Default

    Hi Guys,

    I always drive the Xantia slugomatic manually forcing it hold hold the lower gears on a light throttle (otherwise you have your foot rammed nearly to the floor to acheive the same acceleration).

    I can't see how it can possibly hurt the gearbox. It's got to change gear anyway, why is it any different if you pick the time it changes gears

    Generally I lock it into 2nd so it'll run out to 60km/h before plonking into 3rd (Drive I only put it in at speeds over 80km/h).

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    'Cit' homepage:
    Citroen Workshop
    Proper cars--
    '85 Series II CX2500 GTi Turbo I
    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/citro%EBn-forum/90325-best-project-car-you-have-ever-seen.html
    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


    Modern Junk:
    '07 Poogoe 407 HDi 6spd manual

  21. #21
    1000+ Posts Wildebeest's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Perth Western Australia
    Posts
    2,659

    Default Trans debate.

    To use an auto box as a manual? To me that smacks of "Having a dog and barking yourself".

  22. #22
    1000+ Posts
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Perth, Western Australia
    Posts
    6,248

    Default

    My wife drives autos - I've always driven them manually, as they generally aren't set up properly to choose the right ratio for the conditions. Damn frustrating. Never had a problem, but that's not to say we wouldn't have.... (However, with her '02 Astra, it's the first time I've used an auto that doesn't need intervention. It's really well set up in both modes).

    Stalled, your usage of second on a decline is the correct use of the box. That's one of the reasons you can select second.

    Incidentally, the owner of an auto trans place told my Dad that taxi drivers get much better mileage out of their autos if they lock out 4th all the time around the city, and advised him to do the same.

    Stuey


    2003 PEUGEOT 206 GTi

  23. #23
    Sans Pond. STALLED's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    2,862

    Default

    Hey,

    Thanks everyone for their replies on the issue!

    Anyways i really dont see the point of driving the auto like a manual (like around the city), the changes are so much more clunkier compared to just leaving it in drive and having enough torque- i find the difference in the drivability of the car barely any different!



    CYas Stalled
    2005 Renault Clio 182 Cup

    2011 Renault Megane 250 Cup Trophee - Sold

    1997 Peugeot 406 2.0 Manual - On Loan

    2004 Citroen C3 1.4 80th Anniversary (RIP)

  24. #24
    sans witticism SLC206's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    North Parramatta
    Posts
    3,985

    Default

    Sure, I agree for the most part.

    Putting an auto into a lower gear to go down a hill is one of the few things I would do with an auto - it just seems such an obvious/natural thing to do, but most auto drivers I see on the road wouldn't even consider it - much preferring to ride that brake pedal all the way to the bottom, then wonder why their brakes wear out so quickly

    I guess that goes with the territory, like lurching forwards for no reason whilst waiting at the lights.
    Regards,

    Simon

    2018 308 GTi 2011 DS3 DSport
    ----
    2014 208 GTi 2007 207 GTi 2004 206 GTi180 2000 206 GTi 1995 306 XT

    www.peugeotclub.asn.au

  25. #25
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Gordon, NSW
    Posts
    4,527

    Default

    Did someone say Territory?
    - Lincoln

    Contribute to the World Community Grid.

Page 1 of 2 12 Last

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •