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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! MR206's Avatar
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    Default Car Care

    I was cleaning my car today, and as i was going over the paint, i noticed some very fine scratches and spots (not deep but can see some of the silver under the blue) . I put some polish on it, but it didn't do much. I was wondering, what is the best way to remove these small scratches? Would i be best off getting the colour pen from Peugeot and painting that area again? Or is there any other ways you can suggest

    Cheers.

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    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    Sure they're not watermarks?

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    Fellow Frogger! MR206's Avatar
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    Positive there not. Something was thrown at the car and it left the mark and now it won't go. It's left a circular scratch.
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    Administrator GreenBlood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MR206
    I was cleaning my car today, and as i was going over the paint, i noticed some very fine scratches and spots (not deep but can see some of the silver under the blue) . I put some polish on it, but it didn't do much. I was wondering, what is the best way to remove these small scratches? Would i be best off getting the colour pen from Peugeot and painting that area again? Or is there any other ways you can suggest

    Cheers.
    MR206, I'd be very reluctant to use the paint sticks, they tend to leave a raised area that is more noticable than the original scratch. Your paint has a clear coat over the metalic colour, a light cut in the local area of the scratch is possibly the better result.

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    2000+ Brad's Avatar
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    When I bought the MX5 it's paint was terrible. I've since bought Meguiers ScratchX and done two applications on the bonnet and boot and it has made a HUGE difference. It's actually what the call a jewlers rouge which is an extreamly fine cutting compound. I get paint residue on the applicator aswell , however if you're cutting into a cleat coat you won't get this.
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    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    FWIW, I have seen painters use corn flour with a lambswool buff to remove fine scratches.
    It has to be used extremely carefully so as not cause it to overheat, but it is so fine a cutter it is often used on perspex screens also.
    If you aren't wealthy enough to use meguires, try some "T cut" followed by a polymer polish. If it's silver showing, it had to be bare metal which I doubt it is. I think as Brad says, they are just swirl marks. Car washes are notorious for putting them all over dark coloured paint jobs; what colour is your car? Dark blue or black by any chance?



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  7. #7
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MR206
    Positive there not. Something was thrown at the car and it left the mark and now it won't go. It's left a circular scratch.
    Do you know what was thrown at the car? Lime water?

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    1000+ Posts dino's Avatar
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    none of the CUTTERS...wether by mequires or others are clearcoat safe (technically) .
    Smartest thing to do (if you want to do it yourself) is to get the finest cutter you can get...(maybe scratch X or autoglym).....either way,...its always best to WORK a lot HARDER at it with a fine cutter than going for something HEAVY.....
    Why dont you try and get a quote from a reputable detailer......Some panelbeaters have been known to use heavy cutters (and can be pricey)....and many are actually not as good as some detailers ......I ll cut a car as good as any panelbeater...and than some...POLISH up afterwards and seal with wax or alternative...I recently used the SONAX (german wax-liquid)...on my merc and its also great stuff......





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    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    SONAX is very good. Depending on what has scoured the paint, I don't think Scratch X will do the job. If you've gotten some lime water on the car, that's near on impossible to get out.

    Can you take a photo of it? If it looks like it's under clear coat, it sounds like water marks. If the clear coat is actually chipped through, then there's not much you can do. If the clear coat is all ghosted through it could be something like lime water...very hard to remove, if at all.

    I'd pop into Meguiars at Silverwater and ask them to look at it. They'll tell you on the spot if it's fixable.

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    I managed to remove my water marks (very faint outlines) by using elbow grease & Klasse (non-abrasive polish)

    Took some time though!

  11. #11
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    You did it with Klasse only? I have water marks on the ST's bonnet... I had forgotten how you ended up removing it.

  12. #12
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    A good way to find a quality detailer is to call Meguiars and ask who is a "trained meguiar's detailer" in your area. Quality should be a lot higher here.

    However, there are a lot of dodgy panel beaters, too. Just pays to be careful all round, really.

  13. #13
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Hi Guys,

    I just use the 3M micro-cutter available from any auto-paint store (there an incredibly fine cutter, this is followed by the 3M glow/mirror finish stuff. The mirror finish produces a finish that's like glass. It's bloody brilliant, however I think all it does is remove any leftover cutters/swirl marks.

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    1000+ Posts dino's Avatar
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    Hi Guys,

    I just use the 3M micro-cutter available from any auto-paint store (there an incredibly fine cutter, this is followed by the 3M glow/mirror finish stuff. The mirror finish produces a finish that's like glass. It's bloody brilliant, however I think all it does is remove any leftover cutters/swirl marks.


    thats the stuff.....I love 3M...for prep and polish...nothing can touch it....microfinishing compound is absolutely sensational...one of the few one can use on black cars....
    If 3m went retail (like mequires etcetc)....it wouldn t be long before the rest shut shop....


    cheers

    dino

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    Its interesting that no one has mentioned using Brasso or toothpaste as a light buffing agent as that is just about all we had years ago and both did a great job at little or no cost! but then I am a miserable old bastard!

    Dragging myself into the modern era, I have used a few different clear coat sprays to carefully mask small scratches in the surface coating on a car. Alas there, it seems that better equates to higher cost and smaller pack.

    You need a spray that will lay into the old surface (bond) without runs and dry quickly. Some of the cheaper products will develop a milky bloom after several mistings ( a real bugger to remove!!)

    A good product will dry hard and take a light buffing and I would suggest that you develop your skill and test the product on either someone elses car or a spare panel before tackling your jewel!!

    Ken

  16. #16
    1000+ Posts dino's Avatar
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    They all dmage clear coat... 'technically'. So do polishes.. even the silicon based ones. Thats how they all work.. by removing a layer of paint film. Technically, canauba wax and things like Meguiars "Fast detail" aren't actually a polish... so don't anyone start wit hthe 'what about canauba wax' thing.
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by dino

    Why dont you try and get a quote from a reputable detailer......Some panelbeaters have been known to use heavy cutters (and can be pricey)....and many are actually not as good as some detailers ......I ll cut a car as good as any panelbeater...and than some...POLISH up afterwards and seal with wax or alternative...I recently used the SONAX (german wax-liquid)...on my merc and its also great stuff......

    You have panel shops that do a worse job than detailers in your area?? Man, you have some pretty dodgy panel shops! I've never ever known a painter who used a compound that was in-appropriate for the paintwork on the car, but i've seen SOOOOO many cars with buff marks or fine scratches worked into the paint by a detailer that didn't have a clue what they where doing... There are so many people around claiming to be detailers these days... and there isn't any 'formal' training for them, so how do you know who's good and who isn't, other than by the cars in their shop? And if they have the right cars.. they'll have the right price.. know what i mean. It's proably just me.. but i know the panel shops in my area, not from using them, but by reputation and by staff, so i know where to go, and there's no way any of them would charge more than $50 to do just the bonnet...




    Have u heard of a place called LA LA LAND.....




    cheers


    dino

    ps....have detailed more cars than u ve had lunches...set up RACV repair centre(detailing departemnt) in Vermont (more than 100 cars a week), worked with Pitstop, fowles,old christies, camberwell honda, jupps, ward etc etc etc.....
    So like I was saying.....yes u can paint a car with spray cans (jester-fu I wouldn t recomend you do this)...just a matter of refinishing.....man I m in a funny mood today....
    Last edited by dino; 22nd July 2004 at 05:06 PM.

  17. #17
    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    I don't have a problem with you being a Newbie.... more some of your points and the way in which you have delivered some of them.

    On this, however, I agree with you. All products designed to remove swirl marks are a type of cutting compound, varying in level of aggresiveness. With todays' clear coats the objective is to smooth out the edges of the swirls to remove the reflection you get off them. If the finish isn't that scratched, you could make do with a non-cleaner polish, such as Meg's Show Car Glaze (#7 I believe) and follow that with a sealant. Something like Klasse AIO has cleaner in it, but it's not very abrasive at all.

    There aren't many non-abrasive cleaners at the moment, but you're not able to go through a clear coat using a product like Scratch X anyway, so Mr206 may as well try it... although I'm still puzzled as to what the mark is on his car.

    I think you and Dino are basically saying the same thing, btw.

  18. #18
    Fellow Frogger! MR206's Avatar
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    The car was hit with eggs. That's where the mark has come from, it's where the actual egg hit. So it's etched into the paint down to the primer. So im not sure if these suggestions will help the problem. Any ideas?
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  19. #19
    1000+ Posts dino's Avatar
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    So you're a "yard rat"?? Good for you. I use to detail cars, i certainly can't claim i did 100 per week like you... but i use to do around 10 a weekend... in about 5 hours per day (by hand... i use to get the local detailers asking how i got the windows totaly streak free... but that would have been telling!)



    No...no...no....the RACV center was repairing 100 cars plus a week...we only (a team of five) gave them LIGHT details....some only got bonnets polished...others just a door or a guard...and so on.....


    AS far as your detailing TEN (10) CARS over weekend (5 hours per day)....
    WELL...thats just bull (actually if you could do that...you d be the fastest on the planet)......What you were doing WAS NOT detailing......A GOOD detail . takes at least a day (maybe more)....a few cups of coffee and some nice music thrown in (I wonder who the real yard rat is around here)....


    So here is a quick list of SOME things that need to be done during a detail

    1. blast car with water...maybe give it a quick wash
    2. dry (depending on colour and cut) and then CUT the vehicle.....
    3. Wash the vehicle again, removing residue around gaps etc etc
    4. One might do their engine bay at this stage (taking protective measures)
    5. Dry car
    6. polish car (apply /remove)
    7. Steam clean the interior....
    8. detail interior plastics, vents etc etc....apply treatment
    9. Glassworks
    10.Going over car...further inspectin and detailing...things like spare tyre, brushiing back upholstery and carpets (just before dry)

    ETC ETC ETC ETC...

    NOW....multiplay this by ten cars....and from my reading YOU DO ALL OF this in TEN hours.....

    Biggest load of crok I ve heard in a long bloody time....


    As for your STREAK FREE trick.........GEEEZZZZZ even if there was something that you knew that worked so well.....I would no longer DO IT.....hell I dont think I m ever going to clean my windows again.....just going to go out and smear vaseline and armourall over them......







    anal retentive indeed.....



    cheers


    dino

  20. #20
    1000+ Posts dino's Avatar
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    GTI124...of course...you r right....WE WERE SAYING the same thing....just look at my original reply:



    none of the CUTTERS...wether by mequires or others are clearcoat safe (technically) .
    Smartest thing to do (if you want to do it yourself) is to get the finest cutter you can get...(maybe scratch X or autoglym).....either way,...its always best to WORK a lot HARDER at it with a fine cutter than going for something HEAVY.....
    Why dont you try and get a quote from a reputable detailer......Some panelbeaters have been known to use heavy cutters (and can be pricey)....and many are actually not as good as some detailers ......I ll cut a car as good as any panelbeater...and than some...POLISH up afterwards and seal with wax or alternative...I recently used the SONAX (german wax-liquid)...on my merc and its also great stuff......





    dino


    NOW...i dont think there is anything anally retentive about warning some of our members that a lot of these products are NOT clear coat safe as they claimed to be......These days EVEN some of the budget cut/polishes claim to be ....which is unfair when a customer comes in with a dark honda (soft paint) and later finds out that he or she has just scratched the living daylights out of their car.......I try to remeber that this forum is open not just to members but to visitors 2...my comment was not directed at jester....

    I then recommended getting a quote from a REPUTABLE detailer (and there is not a lot of these around...ie people who take pride in their work)...So I think this comment was fair especially considering what some panel beaters charge....

    And then the guy goes on attack.......



    cheers


    dino

  21. #21
    1000+ Posts dino's Avatar
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    The car was hit with eggs. That's where the mark has come from, it's where the actual egg hit. So it's etched into the paint down to the primer. So im not sure if these suggestions will help the problem. Any ideas?


    thats nasty...how long was the EGG on the car....with eggs (especially if its ahot day)....you pretty much have to remove it almost emidiatelly....washing them off afew hours later is usually to late.....
    I d say...your best option is a panel shop.....




    dino

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    Fellow Frogger! MR206's Avatar
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    It was parked in the garage, not in the sun...i don't know how long though. I washed it off when i saw it, and there was no marks left except where the actual eggs hit the car....
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    who? when? huh? GTI124's Avatar
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    I've had egg on one of my cars. Nothing you can do but panel shop it. I never bothered repairing it, just kept polish on it and had Meguiars do a detail on it and remove as many scratches as possible.

  24. #24
    1000+ Posts dino's Avatar
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    ...well in a way...you r ight about not having to wash after cutting if they r white cars....simply dust of and hand polish (or machine)....
    what I like to do is...use a graded cutting compound (dependant of status of paint and colour)...I then cut the car and after its done I STILL liked to give it a good wash to get rid of any cutting compound because I didnt want it polluting the straight polish, this is especially important if detailing black or dark cars or cars that have exceptionally soft finish...
    Anyway...i was (I think) a very pedantic detailer and I always tryed to make sure customers jaws dropped when they picked up the cars,...obviously dealers were a bit different if busy but even with many of them I still tryed hard...just me...
    The auction haouses were a completely differnt cup of tea.....numbers were important and when the detailing department was being payed something like $30 per car...SURE.....we flew though them and many cars were cut to pieces but I assure you even then there werent to many burn marks left by me....using a buffer requires some skill and admitedly many detailers are real butchers...they dont care how much clear they cut as long as the car is SHINY.....probably half the reason why so many silver and red commodore VNs have no more paint left of the top .....
    But I ve given detailing long time ago (and yes even at 35 I do occasionally feel the effcts this job has had on my hands).....But hell it helped me earn a buck and pay for a few dinners while at uni...I honestly never did it for the money.....Just that those jobs were easy to come by and I changed them often if the employer didn t dance to my tune....So, you might think of me as a yard rat......fine.....I liked the job then, it was hassle free and it kept me around cars...which was cool and something I m not ashamed of.....I still enjoy doing an occasional detail for good friends and family and do not charge for it....If I was to do a payed detail these days it would take many hundred dollar bills for me to pick up that sponge and bucket....

    cheers and hopefully no hard feelings.....sometimes I think all new members should do a nice introductory speech before people like me and others start putting their foot in places it dont belong....





    dino

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    Administrator GreenBlood's Avatar
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    Ahhh..... group hug smiley

    Dino, I owe you a AF shirt (promise I made when you made yourself scarce)

    Cheers
    Chris
    74 D(very Special) >>Rejuvenation Thread<<
    08 C5 X7 HDi very Noir



    "Déesse" Roland Barthes, 'Mythologies', 1957

    The Déesse has all the characteristics of one of those objects fallen from another universe that fed the mania for novelty in the eighteenth century and a similar mania expressed by modern science fiction: the Déesse is first and foremost the new Nautilus.

    (Umberto Eco [Ed], The History of Beauty, Rizzoli, NY, 2004)

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