Tesla share price drops on bid to scrap rebate/subsidy Tax breaks.!
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Thread: Tesla share price drops on bid to scrap rebate/subsidy Tax breaks.!

  1. #1
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    Icon11 Tesla share price drops on bid to scrap rebate/subsidy Tax breaks.!

    JBN might like this, apparently the .........USA Administration is dumping tax breaks for electric vehicles and that has caused the Tesla share price to slump.

    Though I kind of like one of the comments that likes electric vehicles for what they are. Anyway for what it is worth I do too, especially for urban dwellers to flaunt their environmental credentials to the hoy polloy that can't afford them.

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    I see that one other blogger takes up on that aspect, as what is it to a persons that can afford to spend US$100 k on a vehicle to spend an extra US$7,500 So electric cars will favour those that can afford . Wish I could too. you know, look at me street cred... (but still have my everyday vehicle for Diesel economy).

    https://wattsupwiththat.com/2017/11/...en-tax-breaks/

    Heck a saving of 4 billion, that's a lot of moola

    Ken.

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    1000+ Posts robmac's Avatar
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    Heck a saving of 4 billion, that's a lot of moola
    True.

    However the "kick in the guts" for those who are environmentally conscious and the removal of incentives to be may end up costing USA a lot more long term.

    Is it a rumor that Trump and Abbott are brothers ?
    Mutual Respect is Contagious


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    Quote Originally Posted by robmac View Post
    True.

    However the "kick in the guts" for those who are environmentally conscious and the removal of incentives to be may end up costing USA a lot more long term.

    Is it a rumor that Trump and Abbott are brothers ?
    I think that they may have been as Siamese twins, and they were separated at birth.
    It's any bodies guess who got the best of that deal.
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    Funny how it always gets back to personalities, when really, do we need to provide huge amounts of money to anyone that asks for it, in this case we have a promoter of a scheme who makes very expensive motor cars, that probably cost as much environmentally, use up resources spread just as much pollution as the stuff that we already have, and really cater for a wealthy market.

    What I would like to see is that all the little guys be allowed and encouraged to experiment by ditching nanny over regulation so that if I want to build an electric or steam car for my own use, I can do it, providing the basic safety and integrity of the machine doesn't endanger others.

    Why do we need to favour wealthy investors to get richer, when I am sure that they should be capable of doing it for themselves without putting their hand out.

    I guess if Holden and Fords were denied subsidies and huge tax breaks to keep going in Australia, why do we want to allow other vehicle makers to bring in their vehicles from heavily subsidised places of manufacture.

    In the case of our local situation I could see some strategic value in maintaining factories that could be turned over to manufacturing munitions, tanks, guns if we need to protect the country, as it is we won't really have either the skilled people or the machines to do that.

    Then of course if we only have battery cars and we don't make the batteries in this country or have the power available to charge them, god forbid if we were invaded we would only have foot soldiers and a few horsemen to defend us and maybe a submarine being built on the never never.

    Weird really and we pay higher prices for just about everything.

    Anyway if we had a bicycle industry, to export bicycles, we could at least be healthy pushing treadlies. Maybe put all the politicians out on bikes,and T A would be probably have no qualms about that, and Rob would be satisfied with the environment side as well.

    Jest a thought or two.!

    And what if all those fears turn out to be a crock of... as some say. All for nothing?

    Ken
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    Let’s hope we don’t see Trump in budgie smugglers any time soon.

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    That would be Clintonesque !

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    1000+ Posts robmac's Avatar
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    And what if all those fears turn out to be a crock of... as some say. All for nothing?
    Nobody in my circle of friends or acquaintances thinks it is a "crock". Just sayin'
    Mutual Respect is Contagious


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    Icon10 Seeing you mentioned IT.....

    Quote Originally Posted by robmac View Post
    Nobody in my circle of friends or acquaintances thinks it is a "crock". Just sayin'
    Wouldn't expect otherwise from the believers in the church of global warming, only a dive into cooling like the 1970's will change those believer minds and even then, there will be some scary but unscientific reason advanced blaming humans, after all we are just so guilty.

    IF we get to have a hot summer and I do hope we finally do after years of mild summers. this may be their last chance, hence the fervour to convince everyone. Just saying too

    Mind you there seems to be a real push on to find the atmospheric hot spot that wasn't there as they predicted/projected years ago, but some signs that we have some form of lower atmosphere warming, but also worrying signs of an overall drop in ocean temperatures. (ignore the Karlized adjustments to the old bucket dip data, the diving thermometers are much better at data, unless homogenized)

    There are some very good scientists looking at the satellite data, to see if that lower atmosphere is warming. But at the same time the cyclical weather guys are advancing their theories that indicate the minimal changes happened in the past and will happen in the future on a 60 year cycle and the data appears to be with them at the moment.

    As far as Australia is concerned there is minimal contribution to "pollution" by either the heavily promoted "suspect gases or industrial pollution as we cleaned up that in the 1950's and sixty's with filters and other environmental controls. That said all you and I and others can do is wait and see.

    There is likely a natural event (La Nina) developing and then it should be apparent with a quiet Sun and the fact some say we are overdue for the end of the inter glacial period. Scientists might agree on a real trend. The moot point if it trends cooler, is whether we should pump more of whatever you say is warming the planet, into the atmosphere ? in the hope that that will maybe heat us a little, and prevent a slide into a little ice age.

    But then we only need a massive chain of volcanic eruptions or a terrestrial strike event, to spread a curtain of dust in the upper atmosphere masking the sun and we humans will have to burn everything to keep our bodies warm, the planet of course will do what it always has...evolve.. we might have to adapt too.

    With a bit of luck we might both get to see the trend if not the far future to see if guesses pan out.

    Ken

    Thanks for raising that.
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  9. #9
    1000+ Posts robmac's Avatar
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    I could discuss the matter, but decline to do, because it would be contrary to the explicitly stated instructions of the moderators.

    And I have nothing to prove anyway, since traditional science supports my beliefs.
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    Mutual Respect is Contagious


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    Icon14 In defence of the electric car part 1.

    Back to the subject of electric cars, there is some interesting opinions of the future of the American scene and some comments from a major car maker who wishes he hadn't killed off their electric car concept years back and a defence of the electric car by one author. The owner of the blog site discloses he has had an electric car for 10 years.

    The LA times reported in 2009 that the outgoing CEO of GM said that the biggest mistake he made was to kill the electric EV1 and throw away the technology lead that GM had acquired[1] , [2]. It isn’t just GM. The turgid response of all the big Western automakers leaves them at risk of being overtaken by agile Eastern competitors in the same way that the Swiss (mechanical) watch industry was overtaken in the 1980s by agile Eastern competitors making cheap accurate quartz watches[
    https://wattsupwiththat.com/2017/11/...ic-car-part-1/

    Article comes in two parts this is part one

    Looks good so far as the article explains and sets out the opposing views as well while the author is supporting the concept of Electric vehicles, also has some detail of the construction and power plant of a Tesla. Hopefully worth the read. Especially for the background of the issue and what looms for the auto industry in the future.

    Ken

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    Icon14 In defense of the Electric car Part 2

    The discussion response to the first part was some 900 comments so obviously a hot topic. Lot to wade through but there was some very good comments from those for and those against EV's at least you learn the common talking points that are bandied about and some good technical information on the points discussed too.

    Here is the link to Part two of the story from John Hardy the author. over 500 comments now.

    https://wattsupwiththat.com/2017/11/...ric-car-part2/

    The main objection that seems to be running is the Battery technology and distance travelled with some good information on battery design, and the issue of cobalt as a problem in the way Lithium Ion batteries with develop in the future. The Internal combustion engine people of course don't accept the low maintenance claims typical is this exchange.
    November 7, 2017 at 8:12 am
    Teslas use a single reduction gear on the output of the electric motor. The lubricant for that reduction gear is changed in 5 year intervals.
    Teslas have battery coolant. This coolant should be replaced every 4 years/50,000 miles.
    Teslas also have traditional hydraulic brakes – that brake fluid should be changed every 2 years.
    Teslas do not have anything that relates to a traditional ICE – timing belts, engine oil, spark plugs, air filters, O2 sensors, catalytic converters, fuel injectors, diesel particulate filters, fuel filters, valve cover gaskets, oil pan gaskets, EGR valves…etc.
    Many Teslas are reporting 10 year old batteries with 90% capacity remaining or better. Tesla’s newest “drive unit” has a design lifespan of 1 million miles.
    In the short run (while under warranty) the electric car is probably a bit cheaper to maintain than an ICE. In the long run, an electric car is way cheaper to maintain than an ICE.

    November 7, 2017 at 9:18 am
    Gee, I’ve just replaced the rear brake pads on my ICE car – at 101,000+ miles. And I change the oil, and filters, regularly. 5 minutes at the gas pump still beats a “fast charge”.
    BTW, I doubt that we in Southern California drive 30 miles per day – before I retired, I was driving closer to 100 miles per day.
    I have recently found out that our house was wired with just enough power, barely, to run the house (it is a tract home). Any electrical upgrades will require a new circuit-breaker box, new wiring to the street, new grounding rods – $6400. Would I have to do that to be able to charge my plug-in EV in the garage every night?
    There are a few links that direct you to issues like this re UK requirements for electric vehicles to produce noise (shades of red flag stuff)

    Electric vehicles safety crackdown: New rules will force *cars to make noise so pedestrians can hear them coming | Daily Mail Online

    also few links to some technical papers on design of batteries etc. but to be frank too much troll type comments without any worthwhile input, but I guess that's standard even on our forum and of course the usual diversions
    I'll be happy to see what he comes up with in part three sorting the wheat and chaff to get the gems left to those determined to get information!

    Anyway there IF you want to read to see the many sides of the EV's.story. The Americans' don't seem to trust Elon Musk , maybe he is seen as a self promoter like D. Trump....

    Ken
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  12. #12
    1000+ Posts schlitzaugen's Avatar
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    Do you get paid to swamp us with that website nobody here is interested in? Do you really not see how out of place anything on that site is here? Do you not realise the ineptitude of the act of copying one website on another?

    Yeah, americans don't trust many things (I read a poll once where some american imbecil stated that she didn't believe in maths).

    They do however trust guns and god.

    Why don't you move there, get a gun and go to church.

    You can also join the flat earth society while you're at it.
    ACHTUNG ALLES LOOKENPEEPERS

    Das computermachine is nicht fur gefingerpoken und mittengrabben. Ist easy schnappen der springenwerk, blowenfusen und poppencorken mit spitssparken. Ist nicht fur gewerken bei das dummkopfen. Das rubbernecken sightseeren keepen hands in das pockets-relaxen und watch das blinkenlights.

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    Hint: Don't like it? Don't read it!
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    Quote Originally Posted by schlitzaugen View Post
    Do you get paid to swamp us with that website nobody here is interested in? Do you really not see how out of place anything on that site is here? Do you not realise the ineptitude of the act of copying one website on another?

    Yeah, americans don't trust many things (I read a poll once where some american imbecil stated that she didn't believe in maths).

    They do however trust guns and god.

    Why don't you move there, get a gun and go to church.

    You can also join the flat earth society while you're at it.
    Yep typical response and I thought you had an open mind, far better to read and ignore that which you don't agree with, Or as Jobo says don't read and don't go there, that way you will never learn what others are saying on many subjects. I do visit other sites, but many don't even mention things that may help all of us. Your choice but don't label others with your flat earth labels, that is disrespectful I suggest.

    Anyway for those that want too there is a lot of car related opinions and links there.
    PS I use that website because they are tolerant of others and allow posts, not censor them. If you object to what is being said there, I am sure they would welcome temperate posts on any subject. And plenty of accredited scientists in many fields there including the automotive industry.

    Regards

    Ken

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    Quote Originally Posted by JoBo View Post
    Hint: Don't like it? Don't read it!
    Which is why I pointed out that we don't need to copy websites onto other websites.
    ACHTUNG ALLES LOOKENPEEPERS

    Das computermachine is nicht fur gefingerpoken und mittengrabben. Ist easy schnappen der springenwerk, blowenfusen und poppencorken mit spitssparken. Ist nicht fur gewerken bei das dummkopfen. Das rubbernecken sightseeren keepen hands in das pockets-relaxen und watch das blinkenlights.

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    Yawn!
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