2017 Picasso or new 3008 both Aisin 6A.....?
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Thread: 2017 Picasso or new 3008 both Aisin 6A.....?

  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Default 2017 Picasso or new 3008 both Aisin 6A.....?

    Both appeal but price might determine if diesel is worth the extra money for the 3008.
    We have the 1.2 in a 308 but I'm not sure about the shared 1.6 petrol which is supposed to be in the 3008.
    Any thoughts.......

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  2. #2
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    Would not the transmissions be Aisin EAT6 in the 1.6 THP and the Aisin AM6 in the 2.0 diesel?

    The early 1.6 engines had a lot of problems leading to a lot of redesigns. Like all direct injected petrol motors, including the 1.2 three potter, you will need to keep the valves un-crudded. On the other hand the diesel needs a chance to regenerate the filter.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by seasink View Post
    Would not the transmissions be Aisin EAT6 in the 1.6 THP and the Aisin AM6 in the 2.0 diesel?

    The early 1.6 engines had a lot of problems leading to a lot of redesigns. Like all direct injected petrol motors, including the 1.2 three potter, you will need to keep the valves un-crudded. On the other hand the diesel needs a chance to regenerate the filter.
    I have de-crudded exhaust and intake valves over many decades and the result has been undetectable to my sensitive posterior.
    I feel positively righteous at the time but ultimately disappointed.
    I've read that it is overstated as a significant problem.
    Perhaps at revs in extremis it may be significant, but not for me who rarely sees the giddy heights of 3000.


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  4. #4
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    On the subject of a diesel version, I've noted that the used of a DEF (AdBlue) in the SCR system has not replaced the EGR/cooler valve assembly......according to the 2017 Tiguan specs.
    I'm confused as to what the EGR system does, in relation to NOx reduction, that is not achieved post combustion via the injection of the AdBlue.
    Why both?.


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    I drove a manual 2016 Grand Picasso around France last year. Covered a few thousand kms and enjoyed the drive. Suspension was good as was the fuel consumption.
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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by rmac View Post
    I drove a manual 2016 Grand Picasso around France last year. Covered a few thousand kms and enjoyed the drive. Suspension was good as was the fuel consumption.
    In 2015 we hired a Picasso 5 seat diesel for 3 weeks around England and Wales.
    Massive room, sliding sun visors, (which should be available more widely for Australian conditions) and great economy.
    I'm waiting for the Euro6 diesel version to arrive in the updated model.


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    Steer Clear of the 1.6Litre PETROL TURBO ( it's a DUD engine) go for the 1.6 or 2.0 HDi Turno Diesel THEY are 'Legendary' for reliability, economy & performance


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    Quote Originally Posted by Rod Slater View Post
    Steer Clear of the 1.6Litre PETROL TURBO ( it's a DUD engine) go for the 1.6 or 2.0 HDi Turno Diesel THEY are 'Legendary' for reliability, economy & performance


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    I understand there will only be two choices - 1.6 turbo petrol and the 2.0 turbo diesel.
    It appears the importers think we are still stuck in the 'no substitute for cubes' era.
    The 1.2 disproves that.


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  9. #9
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    Would not be surprised if the 1.6 is being gradually phased out, no longer an option in a 308.

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    The 1.6 THP is in the 308 GTi, now very much warmer - Review - 2017 Peugeot 308 GTi - Review | CarShowroom.com.au

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    Is there a purely Peugeot version of the 1.6 or is it the JV version?.
    If it was technically equal to the superb 1.2 I'd be interested.


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    It's a highly developed Euro 6 version of the PSA-BMW engine, with many changes. BMW are no longer involved.

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    Quote Originally Posted by seasink View Post
    It's a highly developed Euro 6 version of the PSA-BMW engine, with many changes. BMW are no longer involved.
    I'd like to see a 'clean sheet' Peugeot 1.6 as a scaled up version of the 1.2 in terms of advanced design and manufacture, otherwise it will probably be another diesel for me.


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    Quote Originally Posted by seasink View Post
    Would not the transmissions be Aisin EAT6 in the 1.6 THP and the Aisin AM6 in the 2.0 diesel?
    The BlueHDi diesel is also paired with the EAT6 (from https://info.citroen.co.uk/Assets/pd...o/brochure.pdf)

    Quote Originally Posted by Nagaman View Post
    On the subject of a diesel version, I've noted that the used of a DEF (AdBlue) in the SCR system has not replaced the EGR/cooler valve assembly......according to the 2017 Tiguan specs.
    I'm confused as to what the EGR system does, in relation to NOx reduction, that is not achieved post combustion via the injection of the AdBlue.
    Why both?.
    The EGR has other beneficial effects in addition to NOx reduction.
    However, as far as NOx reduction goes, the biggest benefit is that you use less Urea, meaning longer times between AdBlue tank refills. Without the EGR a typical Euro 6 engine would use 6% of your diesel consumption of Urea, or 3litres of Urea per 50 litre tank. The EGR gets rid of enough NOx that you would only need 3% of your diesel, or 1.5l / 50l tank. This ratio is just for one engine I found data on, not a PSA one, but the principle holds. The actual ratio will depend on the amount of NOx produced by the raw engine, and the effectiveness of the EGR and reduction process.

    The biggest advantage of this to the manufacturer is the Urea tank can be half the size to give you enough range to only fill up Urea at the dealer when you put it in for a service. The C4 Picasso is rated to get 20,000km on a 17l tank of Urea, with a 15,000km service interval. If they hadn't fitted an EGR, then the tank would have to be 35litres or more in size.
    2010 C4 1.6 HDi EGS
    2015 Grand C4 Picasso 2.0 BlueHDi

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by CitroenRabbit View Post
    The BlueHDi diesel

    The EGR has other beneficial effects in addition to NOx reduction.
    However, as far as NOx reduction goes, the biggest benefit is that you use less Urea, meaning longer times between AdBlue tank refills. Without the EGR a typical Euro 6 engine would use 6% of your diesel consumption of Urea, or 3litres of Urea per 50 litre tank. The EGR gets rid of enough NOx that you would only need 3% of your diesel, or 1.5l / 50l tank. This ratio is just for one engine I found data on, not a PSA one, but the principle holds. The actual ratio will depend on the amount of NOx produced by the raw engine, and the effectiveness of the EGR and reduction process.

    The biggest advantage of this to the manufacturer is the Urea tank can be half the size to give you enough range to only fill up Urea at the dealer when you put it in for a service. The C4 Picasso is rated to get 20,000km on a 17l tank of Urea, with a 15,000km service interval. If they hadn't fitted an EGR, then the tank would have to be 35litres or more in size.
    I was so hoping to be rid of an EGR cooler valve system, but it looks like it's needed during the cold start running phase.
    http://www.cdti.com/content/americas...gy/egr_scr.htm

    I'm more inclined to look for the 1.2 triple now, if it's available.



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  16. #16
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    Default 2017 Picasso or new 3008 both Aisin 6A.....?

    Oh well, according to a dealer, the 5 seat C4 Picasso has been discontinued.
    Sad.

    I guess the Aircross will be its replacement

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  17. #17
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    I've bought probably the last new (2015) C4 (5 seat) Picasso in Victoria .
    Strangely, the clock seems to revert to another time setting, and tonight it was back 9 hours which is UK summer time.
    I'm wondering if there is an 'initialising' issue which the dealer hasn't done.
    It's just a guess that Citroen UK are the suppliers to Australia.
    Has anybody got an explanation/solution?.


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  18. #18
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    I've bought probably the last new (2015) C4 (5 seat) Picasso in Victoria .
    Strangely, the clock seems to revert to another time setting, and tonight it was back 9 hours which is UK summer time.
    I'm wondering if there is an 'initialising' issue which the dealer hasn't done.
    It's just a guess that Citroen UK are the suppliers to Australia.
    Has anybody got an explanation/solution?.


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  19. #19
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    I've bought probably the last new (2015) C4 (5 seat) Picasso in Victoria .
    Strangely, the clock seems to revert to another time setting, and tonight it was back 9 hours which is UK summer time.
    I'm wondering if there is an 'initialising' issue which the dealer hasn't done.
    It's just a guess that Citroen UK are the suppliers to Australia.
    Has anybody got an explanation/solution?.


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  20. #20
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    To answer my own question....note time zone and adjust.
    Doh!


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