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Thread: Al4/dpo transmission discussion !

  1. #26
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    I think he is calling for a complete reorganisation of Aussie Frogs, in the hope that it will help him find technical info more easily...

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  2. #27
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    Fair request......Every time I looked at this section,over a long time, there was a heap of ,let's say crude smutty stuff which I have no appreciation of.Therefore I totally ignored same.Certainly no reference to the great cooperation that exists between the extreme majority of assists rendered between members on AussieFrogs. Absolutely no reference to anything else.

    Thankyou.
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  3. #28
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    As someone transitioning from 'newbie', I feel the forum has suffered from a very small minority with an antagonistic, abusive and unprofessional approach. More representative of what you would expect from a 'Great Wall' forum than this. Would be easy for moderators to remedy, by enforcing the following.
    Al4/dpo transmission discussion !-af-rules.jpg
    The indexation of topics, or occasional straying from the subject, pales into insignificance compared to this aspect of the forum.
    Last edited by turnbull151; 8th February 2017 at 07:20 PM.
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  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by frenchtranstech View Post
    Does anybody understand what this gentleman is trying to say, as i'm not the most scholar ed person in the world. i cannot understand what is below the belt in our discussions.
    Me neither, however, for me it's a case of "you can't please everyone: so you had better please yourself "

    Don't sell yourself short, Tony, in the topic of this thread, I see your as an intellectual giant trying to relate to DIYers, kind of the "casting pearls...... " scenario.

    I'm not even saddled with a vehicle besotted with an AL4 and I still enjoy soaking up the information you so freely give.

    Keep it up and don't become discouraged.
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    Mutual Respect is Contagious


  5. #30
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    I can't see this thread gaining any traction.....lol

    Cheers

    Justin
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  6. #31
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    I really hope i'm not the cause of all this, maybe i should just go away and leave all alone, but i really like all you guys, its now been nearly 4.5 years. i try to be polite and respectfull, and give the best advise possible when no one else can help. I always give priority to Froggers with pride when you call.

    Anyway let me know your thoughts.
    Last edited by frenchtranstech; 8th February 2017 at 10:45 PM.
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  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by frenchtranstech View Post
    I really hope i'm not the cause of all this, maybe i should just go away and leave all alone, but i really like all you guys, its now been nearly 4.5 years. i try to be polite and respectfull, and give the best advise possible when no one else can help. I always give priority to Froggers with pride when you call.

    Anyway let me know your thoughts.
    No, nothing to do with you. On my reading, the couple of posts by pekay49 point to the acrimony and sniping that sometimes breaks out in a few of the threads.

    Please do stay frenchtranstech - your expertise and knowledge is valued here.

    Ian.

  8. #33
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    Default Forums and imperfections and Frecnh cars seem to fit together somehow !!

    Hi
    I think perhaps the newer persons may be a bit unfamilar with the purpose of forums generally ! My limited experience is that they are for the entertainment and amusement of the members. That is it, like it or lump it If you expect more than that you are going to be disappointed.

    As this is a French car forum, and this thread is about AL4/Dpo transmissions then people can say things on these subjects. If some then choose to 'discuss' some matters as the conversion unfolds, so be it. If people choose to reveal the secrets of them or the faults or even the good sides, whatever they may be, these are just a side matter. Sorry but that is the truth as it is writ !

    Some members are ornery bastards and choose to argue, or disagree in strong terms but ? It may be considered part of the rich tapestry of life or an irritation but your choice to keep reading. Life is about sorting the wheat from the chaff, this forum and others I go to are just a microcosm of life.
    Jaahn
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    Jaahn, you have amazing writing skill, and must say like most of you gentlemen.

  10. #35
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    I did respond but someone did not like my explanation

  11. #36
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    hello every one
    greeting from egypt
    i would like to ask the experts over here about something
    what is the switch or the selector main job ?
    i mean what is it responsible for ?
    thank you in advance

  12. #37
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    I'm not sure what axmed is asking in the previous post. Possibly, he means the position switch on the gearbox casing? It has various names, but moves with the manual linkage.


    To answer an earlier post ...

    Quote Originally Posted by frenchtranstech View Post
    Jaahn
    Please can you or other AF members please keep those control solenoids for me, on the count of, i don't have any cores in my new work place now, and demand is still quite high for the serviced solenoid component.

    if you know of anyone getting them changed ask about the old ones, i would really appr$cciate it.

    Just today a very distraught young lady was almost in tears, while she was explaining about her 307 wagon 2006, after just spending hard earned, on this very nice example of a great strong safe french car. that WAS giving her so much grief.

    Do you mean the (black) pressure reg valves or the sequencing valves or entire valve body?

    Regarding the forum overall, while I've usually been happy to assist where I can, I don't feel the forum members should feel any obligation to provide a solution and I don't want my contributions seen as a substitute for visiting a competent mechanic. I tend to find the 'urgers' who can't be bothered to use a search facility a pain and I'll often just not bother replying if I know there are good answers already easily found. In the Citroen forum, we've added a thread at the top 'Thread of Excellent Threads' and it contains links to some of the more useful threads addressing particular issues. Maybe, we could add a few AL4 threads there.
    The Thread of excellent threads!
    Last edited by David S; 18th April 2017 at 11:14 PM.

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by David S View Post
    I'm not sure what axmed is asking in the previous post. Possibly, he means the position switch on the gearbox casing? It has various names, but moves with the manual linkage.
    hello David S
    im talking about this sensor
    Al4/dpo transmission discussion !-oem-252927-automatic-transmission-mpls-font-b-switch-b-font-dpo-al4-transmission-font-b-switch.jpg
    i want to understand what does it do what is the main job
    if this sensor is not working how will it effect the gearbox
    is it responsible for manual control for the shifts?
    how to install it correctly in the gearbox ?

  14. #39
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    The multifunction switch is operated by the gearshift mechanism.

    It operates the warning when you leave the vehicle in gear; the reversing lights; and prevents starting if not in P or N.

    Al4/dpo transmission discussion !-mf-switch.jpg
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  15. #40
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    It needs to work and be correctly adjusted as it tells the ECU where the gearbox manual linkage is. In older, non-electronic gearboxes, it might only perform the functions of start inhibitor and reverse lights. If it doesn't work, the gearbox may report a fault where it has an incoherent signal from the switch. So, it doesn't reliably know what position it is supposed to be in and goes to a fault mode, being stuck in 3rd gear in the Al4.
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  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by seasink View Post
    The multifunction switch is operated by the gearshift mechanism.

    It operates the warning when you leave the vehicle in gear; the reversing lights; and prevents starting if not in P or N.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    can you please send download link for this manual?

  17. #42
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    If you go to the Citron forum thread I linked to:
    The Thread of excellent threads!
    I've added some C5 / AL4-related links down the bottom. One of those threads contains a link to two factory documents that might assist you. Or to shortcut all the useful reading on the AL4, visit
    https://www.frenchcarforum.co.uk/for...ic.php?t=42353
    for two download links that worked OK last year.
    It will not be the only place these documents can be found online.

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by David S View Post
    If you go to the Citron forum thread I linked to:
    The Thread of excellent threads!
    I've added some C5 / AL4-related links down the bottom. One of those threads contains a link to two factory documents that might assist you. Or to shortcut all the useful reading on the AL4, visit
    https://www.frenchcarforum.co.uk/for...ic.php?t=42353
    for two download links that worked OK last year.
    It will not be the only place these documents can be found online.
    all download links are dead

  19. #44
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    There are a few online copies still available after a search. The file is headed DPO-AL4.pdf and has the first chapter entitled "PRESENTATION : AL4 AUTOACTIVE AUTOMATIC GEARBOX". The remaining 70 odd pages are rebuild instructions.

  20. #45
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    Hi everyone

    Well instead of a new thread I opted of posting here in hopes someone reads it and that I am not hijacking the thread. If so, sorry, not my intention. I have been searching a bit regarding the type of ATF to use in the AL4 box. First let me give some backgroud regarding the car in question

    It is a 2002 Citroen C5 exclusive 3.0 V6 with 83000 km on the clock, it probably never had an ATF oil change. What I want to know is. the original (correct) ATF used in the AL4 box seem to be Esso LT 71141 which is quite difficult to get hold of.... Many of you point to either Penrite or Nulon, neither of them are available where I live (South Africa) I went on ebay dot UK and used ESSO LT 71141 and I got shown this oil as an alternative...
    https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Febi-Automatic-Transmission-Fluid-1-Litre-Equivalent-to-Esso-LT71141-ATF1/142448318455?epid=28007494209&hash=item212a94d7f7: g:wNYAAOxyRNJSn0u7

    Basically it's German febi branded ATF which was used in Audis and BMW of the same era as the Citroen. Anyone got knowledge on this particular ATF fluid? The reason I ask is because it is extremely common ATF over here and very easy to get. So if this oil is truly an equivalent to Esso LT71141 then it means I don't have to import ESSO or Penrite or Nulon.
    After watching many Youtube clips it seems the AL4 doesn't have a gearbox oil filter. Just wanted to confirm with guys who have went into the gearbox that far.
    Wow never realised searching for a simple ATF could be this difficult, where are the days of ATF Dexron 2 and that's it!

    Thanks in advance
    Corne
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  21. #46
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    Hi Corne
    A V6 C5 would not actually have an AL4 transmission I believe. Someone else would tell us exactly what transmission it has, but it is a ZF, but it might have had the same oil recommended.

    However I would say that the original recommended oil is nothing special and a modern full synthetic multi use oil would be an improvement. What is important is changing it, as that removes the wear particles and replaces the additives which get used up as they do their work. Any good quality brand that is recommended will be good most likely

    Jaahn
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  22. #47
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    Hi Jaahn

    Thanks for the reply. Wow ok, that explains a few things, always difficult to find anything on the C5 V6 3.0 auto gearbox. Wil dig deeper but if it is the same type of oil I might even just use this Febi oil as I believe it most likely is better than original oil. Best is to get this old oil out.... Almost 17 years on this oil! Hope there is not too much of a nasty surprise. I wonder if the ZF box is any better than the AL4 box?

    Cheers
    Corne
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  23. #48
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    Ok, I did more digging.

    This particular car has got a ZF 4hp20 gearbox it seems. I got a very nice writeup too via citroenet:
    CitroŽn C5 technical

    Agter reading the article it shows the ins and outs of the gearbox, interestingly the AL4 sits inbetween the 4hp 20 gearbox and the MB3 gearbox with how much torque it can handle.

    http://www.c5club.cz/files/automat/ZF_4HP20.pdf

    It uses the same type of ATF as the AL4. Now just to get a sheet of the specs of the ESSo oil aswell as the Febi atf oil. would like to compare the two just to be sure...

    Although, each time I use the ESSO brand name it states the Febi as suitable replacement
    https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Febi-Auto....c100033.m2042

    I guess it is worth the try?

    Sorry for asking in the wrong writeup as I thought it was the AL4 gearbox... never too old to learn!

    Thanks
    Corne
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    What would life be if we had no courage to attempt anything?
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  24. #49
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    Hi Corne
    That transmission is fitted to quite a few cars and that series of transmissions are widely used. Look at what other makers recommend also. I am sure there are suitable oil suppliers there for all the other brands.
    Again I would say that a recognised brand in a modern synthetic multi use type will be suitable. Just change it twice in quick succession to get a reasonably complete change of the oil. Then every reasonable mileage change it again.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZF_4HP20_transmission
    jaahn
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  25. #50
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    Thanks Jaahn

    Will look into it and other manufacturers who uses same type of gearbox (already got a list with few to call) I did identify a suitable synthetic ATF which is available locally.

    Next search will be for the Aisin BW6 auto box... But that's for another day under a different thread.

    Thanks for all the help
    Regards
    Corne
    1968 ID21 break
    1971 DS21 IE BVH Rouge de grenade (Madamoiselle Rouge)
    1974 DS Pallas Sable metalisse My first restoration (Edith) Now BVH
    1973 DS pallas Metallic red. "Rusty"

    1947 Traction Avant

    Modern

    2006 C4 VTS 180 Coupe

    What would life be if we had no courage to attempt anything?
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