Renault get Smart
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  1. #1
    1000+ Posts gerry freed's Avatar
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    Default Renault get Smart

    recap: Smart is a "French " car marque as it is made in a factory in France but it is a subsidiary of Daimler who own the Mercedes marque as well. Renault and Daimler have a shareholding in each other to cement a collaborative relationship.
    now:
    The 2014 Smart range has just been released in Europe. It comprises two models with variants. Both are almost entirely based on the mechanicals and technology of the Renault Twingo III. However, the appearance externally and internally is almost all styling by Daimler.
    Here are some pictures
    Nouvelles Smart Fortwo et Forfour 2014 : infos, photos et vidťos - L'argus
    The fortwo is similar in size to the old Smart and is being made in the same factory.
    The forfour is like the one made briefly 10 years ago ie 4 doors and 4 seats but is being made in the Twingo factory in Slovenia.
    Both use the Renault three cylinder engine and the automatic is a six speed dual clutch robotised box.

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    1000+ Posts Renomad's Avatar
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    So the engine is in the front now?
    Cheers Renomad

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    VIP Sponsor 59 Floride's Avatar
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    That reminds me of the last wedding I did in my Floride, it rained so the hardtop had to stay on, no billowing veils that day, just three sardines..
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    1000+ Posts Kim Luck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Renomad View Post
    So the engine is in the front now?

    "The Smart Forfour appropriates effect this unusual architecture, and typically Smart:rear engine , propulsion....................."
    Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got 'til it's gone............

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    Quote Originally Posted by gerry freed View Post
    recap: Smart is a "French " car marque as it is made in a factory in France but it is a subsidiary of Daimler who own the Mercedes marque as well.
    When I tried this argument the forum opinion was that I was wrong and that Smart is very much 'German'.
    Which left our two Smarts (ForTwo and Roadster) feeling isolated parked between the 2 Renaults and Renault engined Lotus.
    The Landrover is rightly pushed down the driveway by itself

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    1000+ Posts gerry freed's Avatar
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    That is the problem with trying to attach a nationality to modern cars made in transnational companies and alliances. It is an obsolete concept but if you go back in history before globalisation you can certainly do it.
    The concept of the Smart range started with the boss of Swatch and was Swiss. Once it went into production in his factories he looked for a distribution network and chose VW. It didn't work and he shifted the partnership to Daimler. With the Germans they decided to build in France and Chirac and Kohl both attended the factory opening. The company lost millions and after attempts to pull out, Daimler took control and put it under Mercedes as a division where it is today. The design development was a dead end and Merc had no expertise in small low cost vehicles. Arising from the alliance with Renault they were able to capture Renault's proven expertise in this sector and have the range revamped at minimal cost by sharing the Twingo investment.
    It is now more "French" then it ever was. Whereas Daimler is headquartered in Germany, it is a listed public company and its ownership includes investment funds from elsewhere.
    Your Land Rover was once fairly solidly British until Ford and BMW carved up the Brits. Now, it is wholly owned by Tata Motors, an Indian company.
    Last edited by gerry freed; 23rd July 2014 at 04:32 AM.
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    Good Sport danielsydney's Avatar
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    Renault aparently have no plans on selling Twingo in Australia.....Such a lost opportunity.

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    1000+ Posts 504-504-504's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gerry freed View Post
    That is the problem with trying to attach a nationality to modern cars made in transnational companies and alliances. It is an obsolete concept but if you go back in history before globalisation you can certainly do it.
    The concept of the Smart range started with the boss of Swatch and was Swiss. Once it went into production in his factories he looked for a distribution network and chose VW. It didn't work and he shifted the partnership to Daimler. With the Germans they decided to build in France and Chirac and Kohl both attended the factory opening. The company lost millions and after attempts to pull out, Daimler took control and put it under Mercedes as a division where it is today. The design development was a dead end and Merc had no expertise in small low cost vehicles. Arising from the alliance with Renault they were able to capture Renault's proven expertise in this sector and have the range revamped at minimal cost by sharing the Twingo investment.
    It is now more "French" then it ever was. Whereas Daimler is headquartered in Germany, it is a listed public company and its ownership includes investment funds from elsewhere.
    Your Land Rover was once fairly solidly British until Ford and BMW carved up the Brits. Now, it is wholly owned by Tata Motors, an Indian company.
    The history of the Nash-Heally' (the first American sports car) makes interesting reading.
    Nash/Kelvinator shipped engines, transmissions and suspension components to Heally in England.
    Heally built the chassis assembled the Nash components into it then shipped the rolling chassis to Italy where Pinin Farina built and fitted the body, interior etc. The finished cars were then shipped to America.
    Understandably their price tag was a few thousand dollars more than the Corvette when it appeared.
    Quite an interesting race history for the Nash-Heally variants at Lemans too.

    Paul.

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    1000+ Posts fnqvmuch's Avatar
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    Nash did something similar (bar the italian part, sadly) with the Metropolitan, too.

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    Default Renault get Smart

    Talking of Nash I found this parked at shops last week. Looks like a Kelvinator (partnership??) chest freezer with wheels (about the same size too) 😄 I wonder why the brand didn't survive.....
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    Fellow Frogger! Jinandfonic's Avatar
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    Renault get Smart-imageuploadedbyaussiefrogs1406523387.622390.jpg
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    1000+ Posts fnqvmuch's Avatar
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    they did sell stateside quite well - maybe not quite as nash wanted, but still - must have helped austin out too

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    1000+ Posts Kim Luck's Avatar
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    I actually had a ride in a new one whilst hitch-hiking between London and Southampton in about 1959. Very futuristic it was in those days!
    Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got 'til it's gone............

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    Now go make me a sandwich Hotrodelectric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jinandfonic View Post
    Talking of Nash I found this parked at shops last week. Looks like a Kelvinator (partnership??) chest freezer with wheels (about the same size too)  I wonder why the brand didn't survive.....
    The styling for just about everything Nash through that era was Farina- either by actual deed or overt influence. That didn't end until Dick Teague took over styling in the late '50s.

    I sorta doubt Kelvinator had much to do with the Metropolitan except as a family branch. Farina did the deed on both of those, too. Lot's of creativity, just in an odd way.
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    1000+ Posts fnqvmuch's Avatar
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    bill flajole's original design model the nxi was market researched by george mason then
    developed as a nash kelvinator international and released as the nki custom which changed to metropolitan, also sold as a hudson and by austin who had built them.
    the best bit for me was reading - somewhere - that the final name had to be able to use the holes made for the previous name/s...
    Renault get Smart-r-t_feb_50.jpg
    Renault get Smart-1950_nki_prototype.jpg
    Renault get Smart-amh-71-827.jpg
    Last edited by fnqvmuch; 28th July 2014 at 05:29 PM.

  16. #16
    1000+ Posts gerry freed's Avatar
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    I used to live on a busy road with dangerous hill and a bend half way down. We used to maintain an elaborate first aid kit which unfortunately we had use many times. One day we heard a crash with no previous skidding noises and rushed out to find an Air Algeria like wreckage scattered around a telegraph pole. Close examination by experts showed that it had once been a Nash Metropolitan. I have never seen a car disintegrate like that. The driver was wandering onto the road somewhat dazed but apart from a few bruises was uninjured. It took the concept of progressive crumple on to complete energy absorbtion by implosion. He had lost control on the bend at about 40 mph, over corrected and that was it. No seat belts involved.
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    1000+ Posts 504-504-504's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jinandfonic View Post
    Talking of Nash I found this parked at shops last week. Looks like a Kelvinator (partnership??) chest freezer with wheels (about the same size too) �� I wonder why the brand didn't survive.....
    Apparently Nash and Hudson were taken over by AMC.
    The big lament at the time was that the Nash Heally should have had a v8.
    The 6 cylinder Nash engine was very strong but its output was muffled by a cylinder head which had an inbuilt log inlet manifold and an exhaust manifold which consisted of a single pipe bolted to the side of the head.
    Donald Heally fitted a crossflow multiport aluminium high compression head to the Nash Heally.
    The increase in output enabled the cars to finish Lemans ahead of some exotic machinery.
    Paul.

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    Veni Vidi Posti 68 404's Avatar
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    Something in the back of my brain tells me that the 4 litre OHV 6 cylinder fitted to 1990s Jeeps was a Nash motor, contrary to the popular belief that it was the old Valiant motor.

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    1000+ Posts gerry freed's Avatar
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    and AMC became a part of Renault!
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    And, if I recall, AMC and Renault jointly developed the successful (for Chrysler) Jeep Cherokee?

    The Metropolitan is an odd device - there's one in a museum near Perth . When I was at school in Adelaide, there was one that passed me on my bike every morning, so there must be the odd one around here and there. We saw two parked on the side of a road near Pittsburgh last year, for sale.

    All interesting stuff!
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnW View Post
    And, if I recall, AMC and Renault jointly developed the successful (for Chrysler) Jeep Cherokee?

    <snip>
    Grand Cherokee, I think.

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    Yes,Grand Cherokee.

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    Now go make me a sandwich Hotrodelectric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 68 404 View Post
    Something in the back of my brain tells me that the 4 litre OHV 6 cylinder fitted to 1990s Jeeps was a Nash motor, contrary to the popular belief that it was the old Valiant motor.

    Dave
    Never, ever would have been the Slant 6. Astoundingly tough motor, but Jeep had it's own proven motor that was equally tough, they had used it for decades, and I don't think the Slant 6 would have easily fit in the smaller Cherokee, much less the CJ anyway.
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    Yes. That would be the 'AMC' 199-232 and 258(4.0 H.O.)series of Inline Sixes. These date back to the early '60's(1962..).

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    Now go make me a sandwich Hotrodelectric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StephineS View Post
    Yes. That would be the 'AMC' 199-232 and 258(4.0 H.O.)series of Inline Sixes. These date back to the early '60's(1962..).
    Slightly surprising, too, since Jeep was still Kaiser at that point. Wasn't the big 6 in the Wagoneer a Kaiser design? That got used up to the AMC takeover. I'll have to look all that up, probably over at Allpar. I think the F head 4s stayed in production for quite a while.
    The measure of your character isn't what you do when people are watching- it's what you do when they aren't watching.

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